Milling in a pillar drill

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

Great idea nobby!

Neil

[RichardNParticipant @richardn]

Nobby- is that a cross piece you insert through the 'MT tang extraction hole' which you then thread an inverted drawbar into that runs up inside the collet chuck from below?

If so, I like the idea…. if not, I've no idea what you've created?!

Posted by Nobby on 03/07/2017 12:50:21:

Hi Guys Have a look at my idea to hold cutters

[Ian PParticipant @ianp]

Neat Idea Nobby

I can see how the cross bar and bolt retain the 'thing' in the Morse socket, but how does the tooling fit to the 'thing'

Ian P

[NobbyParticipant @nobby]

HI r]Richard & Ian
The tools fly cutter boring head ect screw on with 1/2" thread 2nd picture shows me turning the location nice and true in situ I have made several cutter holders 6MM one shown in 1st picture

[norman valentineParticipant @normanvalentine78682]

I have a very robust bench drill that has a Jacobs taper on the end of the spindle. I have tried using a 2" diameter flap sander in the chuck and all that happens is that the chuck pops off and goes spinning across the floor. A drilling machine is for drilling and a milling machine is for milling, simple.

Edited By norman valentine on 03/07/2017 18:13:45

[NigeParticipant @nige81730]

Milling in the pillar drill is out so I have been looking at how I can use the ML4. I realised that I own a chinese machine vice that swings up 90 degrees. If I can mount that on the cross slide I am there,

https://www.dropbox.com/s/bunp6pyodxpx63l/File%2003-07-2017%2C%2018%2014%2050.jpeg?dl=0

It is a big heavy thing and the vice jaws are too low and it isnt a good looking fit on the cross slide. having looked at it and scratched my head a bit I realised I could take the vice part of its heavy mounting and think about an alternative mount maybe using a piece of plate fettled to fit. To do that the end of the vice that will become the 'bottom' would need to be flat. laying onto the crosslide the way forward seems obvious, some sort of cutter in the chuck and face off the end of the vice.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/vc51c6l7jio5su0/File%2003-07-2017%2C%2018%2013%2040.jpeg?dl=0

So what I would like please is advice on what sort of a cutter would be best. If I cannot remove all the material in one pass I will need to change the packing under the vice to take multiple passes unless I can use an end mill about 3 cm in diameter or use a fly cutter. The vice material is cast iron of unknown quality.

Edited By Nige on 03/07/2017 19:36:23

Edited By Nige on 03/07/2017 19:37:35

Edited By Nige on 03/07/2017 19:38:05

Edited By Nige on 03/07/2017 19:40:58

[Clive Brown 1Participant @clivebrown1]

There are some pictures and a description of the Fobco mill on the Lathes.uk website. Cutters were intended to be held in 2MT collets, a fine downfeed was fitted and also a compound table.

Fairly rare I would guess.

Incidentally, before I had a "proper" mill, I once tried to use an end-mill in the chuck of my Fobco. The chuck came off the Jacobs taper in very short order.

Edited By Clive Brown 1 on 03/07/2017 19:56:04

[NigeParticipant @nige81730]

Pictures to, hopefully, replace the links in my posting above.

and

Edited By Nige on 03/07/2017 20:28:04

Edited By Nige on 03/07/2017 20:32:09

Edited By Neil Wyatt on 03/07/2017 21:03:02

[RichardNParticipant @richardn]

If you want to flatten the end of the vice, I would suggest using a fly cutter, perhaps mounted on a faceplate. I use an old HSScentre drill that was broken and reground as a single point fly cutter secured into a random block of steel, counterbalanced on a face plate.

I would suggest you keep an eye open for a vertical slide though too- I can only imagine the fun you could have juggling cutter size and packing under a vice to get the adjustable height for milling- milling in the lathe is fine, but you will probably need to take lighter cuts than on a mill…

[PeteParticipant @pete41194]

You've had your question well answered Nige and have made the more than correct decision not to try and force a machine no where close to being designed for it into something it just can't do with any accuracy or surface finish. So just for future referance since the subject is sure to come up again.

Most if not all consumer grade light duty pillar / drill presses sold today don't even make a good job of drilling holes if your willing to run a few simple tests. Set up an indicators magnetic base on the rear column with the tip of the indicator at the middle or outside edge of the table then just start adding some pressure to the table with your thumb. Then visualise driving a 1/4", 3/8", or 1/2" drill through steel and how much added pressure the table sees plus the vise and work piece weight. Tramming the table to the spindle is almost a waste of time because of that variable table flexing.The usual very light wall column and head castings also flex under those pressures if your willing to set up an indicator that's not attached to the machine but can indicate the head movement while drilling with a larger diameter drill. Those mill / drills only resemble a pillar drill with an added X,Y table. Check there weights and there far heavier than adding that X,Y table would add on it's own. The column and head casting are much heavier and far more rigid. Better bearings that are designed for the side loads, a drawbar, and much more rigid and accurate fine feed on the Z axis. With all that they still don't make the greatest milling machine, but they can be made to work.I own a mill but still tried milling just once on a 180 lb. 16 speed floor model drill press that had the drill chuck secured with a center bolt into the end of the jacobs taper and a 35 lb X,Y table bolted down to see how well it might work. It was a waste of time with very poor ragged edges on aluminum even while reducing the cut to .005" depth. I'm extremely doubtful adding a proper end mill holder or collet chuck would have made any noticable improvment.

Youtube has more than a few videos by people saying it works and trying to prove it. Read the comments and the ones most in favor of it seem to know the least. The ones against it all seem to have a large amount of experience and understand the requirements and forces involved. Then watch the video and take note of the depth of cut, vibration and surface finish quality.Yes you probably could rebuild and work around the light duty components with something far better, and after all that time and money still have something that only works semi well compared to even an X2 sized mini mill. They do make industrial floor model drills with a built in X,Y table that can do light milling and even proper boring with a boring head. Check the weights and what they cost and both numbers approach what an off shore Bridgeport clone would cost and weigh. A 2200 lb Bridgeport because of it's design is actualy a very flexable machine if it's pushed harder than it should be. There used so much simply because of how versitile they are than there absolute rigidity. Trying to make a 100 – 200 lb. light duty pillar drill do milling is a great way to test your frustration and patience limits in my opinion. I no longer even own any pillar / drill press for working with metal because of there limitations and poor accuracy. My knee mill will drill holes 10 times as well at least against any pillar drill I could afford.

[NigeParticipant @nige81730]

First: Thank you to whomever rotated my pictures, I did look at the FAQ and like many others found I could not get them right😔

RichardN: a flycutter was the solution I decided upon too and I like the idea though I think holding the random block of steel in a 4 jaw chuck will be easier for me as at this time I don't yet have a face plate for the ML4.

Pete: Yes, my question well and truly answered😀 Thank you also for drawing all the previous comments together and rounding it out into a précis of why it probably isn't worth trying milling operations in a pillar drill.

Thanks everyone 😀👍

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