Machinery removals

[Dave Sawdon 1Participant @davesawdon1]

[Dave Sawdon 1Participant @davesawdon1]

A little later this year I'll be moving from Hampshire to Herefordshire and will need to move a few machines – are there any recommendations for someone in either of those areas with a HIAB on a flatbed?

The heaviest single item is a lathe that weighs about 1800kg and the total weight to be transported is about 3T.

[MuzzerParticipant @muzzer]

It's important to find an experienced machine mover, rather than a transport company who will have a go for you. My first move 2 years ago used a good outfit in Liverpool but I lost their details. Then a few months back I used another company that was more of a haulier than a machine mover (the latter would be called "riggers" in N America). Things nearly went tits up (literally) due to a complete ignorance of centres of gravity, lifting points etc.

This is what happened. Luckily (no skill involved), nothing got damaged, although if I'd been standing there when he did it, I might have seriously damaged my underwear.

You'll notice that the lifting points are at ground level and the centre of gravity is around chest height. So, if you use 2 long straps looped through the lifting eye (as opposed to 4 short ones), you'll end up with an unstable machine, as ably demonstrated – it's not rocket science. This machine weighs 3 tonnes.

Murray

[ScrumpyParticipant @scrumpy]

On Traction Talk Forum there is a section on machine removal I'm sure someone would help possible part of a back load

[vintagengineerParticipant @vintagengineer]

Also the 1800kg weighs a lot more the further the cranes boom is extended. I loads of trouble while working in Africa trying to get native crane drivers to understand this. Saw plenty of tipped over cranes!

[Dinosaur EngineerParticipant @dinosaurengineer]

If you can reduce the weight to equal or less than 1500Kg then a tail lift truck can move your lathe. . If you put it on a pallet and strap it down to the pallet then there are a number of pallet moving companies who will move it for you at a considerable reduction in cost compared to a Hiab lift ( and less likely to get damaged). This is assuming that the lathe can be moved with a pallet truck to the truck tail lift. 2000Kg pallet trucks can be hired reasonably cheaply.

[Boiler BriParticipant @boilerbri]

I can't remember where he advertises but Steve at landilift is good. He moved a workshop for me with no problem.

Bri

[Martin ConnellyParticipant @martinconnelly55370]

Muzzer the term for looping slings over hooks or through shackles or lifting eyes is reeving. It is a big no no in the eyes of anyone with any lifting training since it is easy for a load with a high or offset centre of gravity to start to move with the result so aptly shown in your photo.

Martin C

[Dave Sawdon 1Participant @davesawdon1]

Thanks for all the replies thus far.

1800kg is an estimate, based on a lot of googling, but I've no way of weighing it. Any bright suggestions for how I can check the load on each of the four feet without hiring industrial scales?

The machine is 1800×800 and that seems to be larger than a normal pallet, but this is an area I know nothing about so please educate me if there are options I haven't found.

Steve "Landlylift" can't cope with the weight, plus his distance is measured from Yorkshire so that's a lot of wasted miles for my move.

[Rik ShawParticipant @rikshaw]

http://www.projectorlifting.co.uk/index.php/contact/

Ask for Duncan – he might be able to help.

Rik

[Raglan LittlejohnParticipant @raglanlittlejohn]

https://www.gumtree.com/p/van-truck-hire/hiab-hire-crane-hire-worcestershire-gloucestershire-warwickshire-lathe-pallet-anything-considderd/1181666787

I noticed this one on Gumtree, might be worth checking out.

[Dave Sawdon 1Participant @davesawdon1]

I'll try projectorlifiting but I suspect they're going to be a bit pricey

Thanks for the gumtree link but the text says "THE HIAB CAN LIFT 1.2 TONS.AND THE PAYLOAD OF THE TRUCK IS 1.4 TONS" – "she won't take it Cap'n", as Mr Scott might have said

[MalcBParticipant @malcb52554]

I would have a word with your nearest machine tools dealers and see who they use and can recommend and get a price from them. On their recommendation I did this with my M300 and for a local delivery they only charged £80 for a decent flat wagon with hihab cash in hand.

In 1983 we engaged Pickfords for a full factory move into new premises , office blocks, 3 x machine shops and a foundry.

They dropped a two year old Adcock and Shipley Horizontal mill from a large fork lift, broke the main casting and wrote it off. The dropped a near new 48" Webster and Bennet V.B. on its side breaking handwheels and flattening the copiers hydraulic pack. When breaking out the Kitchen Walker radial arm drill from its foundations they tried lifting it with two of the foudation bolts still secured causing considerable chain damage. So called proffesionals.

After this I used Beck and Politzer for bringing in several new machines, but in 1999 when delivering a new Bins & Berry Data 90 ( 1M swing ) with live tooling they slung it over the main lead/ball screw and damaged it. New screw needed. The proffesionals dont alway get it right. Most machine suppliers are now using their own transport specialist, hence not required much nowadays untill moving used machines.

[MuzzerParticipant @muzzer]

Posted by Dinosaur Engineer on 20/03/2017 14:22:15:

If you can reduce the weight to equal or less than 1500Kg then a tail lift truck can move your lathe…..

Possibly, but they don't behave very well when you are talking about a heavy concentrated load. I speak from the experience of having moved a 1000kg Bridgeport using such a vehicle. I won't be doing that again.

Tail lifts have to be flat and close to the ground, with the result that they are not very rigid. Either that or they are not flat and close to the ground, in which case, getting a 1000kg (or 1800kg) machine onto one could be challenging. You also have to think about how you will move the thing into the centre of the vehicle and out again at the other end. This is boys' own stuff with plenty of potential for damage and harm. And it took 2-3 of us "several" hours.

There are many different models and ratings of Hiab cranes. I think the Liverpool one could reach right into a 40' container and deliver something like 6t at a fairly significant extension, whereas the one in the posting above could barely drop(!) my 3t machine beyond the pavement. With the right choice, you may be able to get your machine close to your workshop.

MartinC – haha yes, that's it. As I say, hardly rocket science but an enthusiastic lorry driver may struggle to grasp the subtleties.

Murray

[BazyleParticipant @bazyle]

One of the ways being mentioned increasingly on other forums is the use of a tilt bed car recovery vehicle. If you can move your machine out of the shed you should be able to move it onto a properly made pallet not a bit of matchwood with bolted on bracing not a few straps. Then if the pallet is designed for it a few scaffold poles will allow it to be easily winched up the transporter ramp.
You could almost create a set-up where the pallet became the floor of your new shed.

[Chris Evans 6Participant @chrisevans6]

Plus one for asking the local machine tool dealer. I had my lathe delivered this way for £75 cash. he did say it will be early on Saturday and turned up just before 6am having picked up the lathe the day before.

[Nigel McBurney 1Participant @nigelmcburney1]

If looking for a haulier,have a look at their transport, virtually all machine movers and installers have the Hiab or similar crane mounted at the rear of the lorry,this allows them to swing the load right round towards the back of the lorry and then the crane can be fully extended to allow the jib and load to go right into the building,this helps prevent the crane toppling which can happen if the load is close to the capacity of the crane and just swung over to the side of the lorry.

[David Standing 1Participant @davidstanding1]

Posted by Martin Connelly on 20/03/2017 15:07:12:

Muzzer the term for looping slings over hooks or through shackles or lifting eyes is reeving. It is a big no no in the eyes of anyone with any lifting training since it is easy for a load with a high or offset centre of gravity to start to move with the result so aptly shown in your photo.

Martin C

That second example is almost as bad as the first!

A spreader bar should be used in those circumstances, so there is a straight lift on the eye bolts, not introducing side forces on the eye bolt threads, as the example shown would.

[vintagengineerParticipant @vintagengineer]

When I worked with mobile cranes, we employed riggers to make sure the loads were lifted correctly! Bet they don't exist now!

[Martin ConnellyParticipant @martinconnelly55370]

David, the second slinging example is showing normal bending of the load under the forces caused by lifting but in an exaggerated way. It should show collared eyebolts but this may not show on a small graphic. It is a common and accepted lifting method as long as the "correct use of eyebolts rules" are followed. An understanding of the tension in the slings is important as well as the de-rating of eyebolts for an angled pull. It is necessary to understand the difference between working load limit (WLL) and safe working load (SWL) if you are to lift something in a safe manner. The department I work in regularly lift multi-million £ loads of 30 to 60 tonnes, we take lifting safety very seriously.

Martin C

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