Affordable CAD software?.

[MuzzerParticipant @muzzer]

+1 for Fusion 360. It includes full parametric 3D CAD, full 2D drawings, simulation and motion study, "proper" 3D CAM including milling, turning and router/laser. It's also continuing to evolve rapidly, as the developers (Autodesk) are investing very heavily in it. It says "free for a limited (90 day) time" but actually it's free without time limitation as long as you are hobby user or your business turns over under $100kpa. Once your trial ends, you declare that you are eligible and it is free thereafter. Unlike many student versions, you continue to get free updates and technical support and the forums are very active and supportive. Not many of the alternatives can offer this.

The other powerful but user-friendly (and free) alternative is Onshape.com which also has full 3D CAD and drawings – and is now offering 3rd party add-ins for CAM etc. The latter will cost you, so to me it seems less compelling than Fusion 360. You are also limited to 10 working documents unless you want to start paying a monthly fee which would exceed our budgets. As the graphical computation is actually done on a remote server, you can use OS on almost any device that can open a browser including iPhones, iPads, Android tablets, Apple and Windows machines and Chromebooks. The downside is you need to be online to use it.

I've used both of these a fair bit now, following on from stints with Solidworks, Solid Edge (3D), Alibre/Geomagic and Inventor, some in a professional capacity. I'd have to say that in my eyes, Fusion 360 has the most to offer in terms of features, price and usability. There are quite a few introductory videos on Youtube, as well as lots of free tutorials. John Saunders over on his NYC CNC Youtube channel has done some helpful examples that illustrate why he is moving over from Solidworks to F360 for his business needs. If you look through his videos, you can see some starter examples, leading on to simple examples of the CAM (CNC) functions if you fancy using them.

There's no right answer but there must be a lot to be said for trying out one of the current professional (but hobby and user friendly) offerings that is being actively developed and supported. The fact that some of the other options have been around for many years and don't cost a lot isn't in itself a justification for choosing them in my eyes.

Murray

[Iain DownsParticipant @iaindowns78295]

For what it's worth, you might have a look at onshape.com.

It's made by the founders of Solidworks and appears to have very substantial functionality. And it's free.

The free version is the full version but you are only allowed 10 private designs. Each design can have hundreds of parts and assemblies, so that's not an enormous constraint. You can have as many public designs as you want – something which may appeal to many of the forum users!

I'm not a CAD expert and I'm finding the learning curve steep, but that's true for every package I've tried.

The downside is that it runs in a web browser. I think this makes it a little slow from time to time. Also, it describes itself as a 'beta' and there are somethings which seem to be a bit spotty – though it's equally likely that I'm just doing stuff wrong.

Iain

[Peter KroghParticipant @peterkrogh76576]

I started with AutoCAD for DOS back in '89 and have used it since then through all the versions. I must admit that I like SolidWorks better than ACADs 3D.

When I acquired this MAC (PD went TU) everyone assured me that Turbo was great. But I found that the Mac version was missing many very useful features and tools that were present on ACAD as well as being quite buggy.

This was 2012.

Downloaded the QCAD last night. Haven't done anything with it but looking through the menus and tools it seems to have good potential.

Pete

[Russell EberhardtParticipant @russelleberhardt48058]

I have also been using Autocad on and off since the 1980s, starting with v1.4 for DOS up to r2000 but found the later versions too involved for occasional use.

I have been using Draftsight (free) for some years now, it being virtually a clone of the Autocad 2000 version and thus easy for me to use. The 64 bit Linux version is a bit buggy – I have to unplug the mouse before starting it and then plug it back in when Draftsight has loaded to get the mouse to work correctly!

I have tried the free version of QCAD but without the layer functions and all the printing functions it is difficult to evaluate properly. I have found that it is impossible to get anything like a 1:1 print of a drawing on my printers which work fine with Draftsight. Perhaps the pro version works better – can anyone comment?

As for Autocad 360, it's a fantastic offering for the price (free) but, as others have noted, it does have a long learning curve and I found the tutorials assume too much prior knowledge of the system. For example, the instructions will tell you to use the "x" function to do something but won't tell you where to find it.

Russell.

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by Russell Eberhardt on 14/12/2015 11:08:58:

I have tried the free version of QCAD but without the layer functions and all the printing functions it is difficult to evaluate properly. I have found that it is impossible to get anything like a 1:1 print of a drawing on my printers which work fine with Draftsight. Perhaps the pro version works better – can anyone comment?

.

Russell,

Only a partial-answer, but: The demo version that I downloaded recently gives [repeatable] 15 minute access to the Pro features, and to the CAM add-on. Both look very promising. … Hence my earlier question to John.

MichaelG.

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 14/12/2015 11:33:53

[JAParticipant @ja]

I was taught how to use CADs and solid modeling software at work. Don't ask me their names, we just did not know, but they were very powerful, nice to use, cost a lot of money and used up a lot of computer space.

As for home use I was given an early version of Autocad which I did not think much of. I then bought Version 11, I think, of Turbocad, 2D only, which was easy to use. However when I bought a laptop with Windows 7 on it I found that it was not compatible with Version 11. Therefore I bought the then latest version of Turbocad, Version16, with some solid modeling capability which I never managed to master, only to find it was not fully compatible with the earlier version. Now I have a new desktop computer with Windows 10 and Version 16 will not run on it. I have to admit that I have not looked at Turbocad up-grades recently.

JA

[duncan webster 1Participant @duncanwebster1]

Whenever I import drawings from TurboCad into eithet AutoCad or Daftsight I find the ends of the lines don't quite meet. At least one laser cutting company I know of won't touch TC drawings because of this. They might have fixed it in later versions, but no matter how cheap TC is, Draftsight is free!

[Bob RodgersonParticipant @bobrodgerson97362]

Duncan,

I have lots pf problems with my CAD programme (Iron Cad). I know that in Autocad there is a function that sllows you to jpin lines to make them polylines and all of the holes ang crossover points that sometimes are present are fixed snd ot then becomes a mich easier task to produce a solid noxy by rxtruding it.

regards,

Bob

[Frances IoMParticipant @francesiom58905]

At the Xmas meeting of London based SMEE the Digital Working Group announced a series of monthly meetings to discuss + introduce Fusion 360 (+ also to provide distance video access to such talks etc).

However I have 2 major qualms
(a) after 40 years of Microsoft embrace, extend + extinguish coupled with their often illegal exploitation of a monopoly I actively avoid this company having switched to Linux but Fusion 360 will not it appears operate under Linux (nor under WINE)
(b) tho the software is free licence to hobbyists you need to use cloud based programs and store data with the company nor is there any guarantee that that the company will continue its policy (there are cases of similar offers which then turn out to be withdrawn) nor that future versions will be compatible with hobbyist PCs (eg not clear that it runs under Win10 which Microsoft is forcing on all non-professional users)

I have a concern that this offer has the same commercial idea as Microsoft – make future FOSS developments less likely (recall Ballmer’s words that FOSS software is a cancer) so that in the end it can be easily extinguished

[JAParticipant @ja]

Just had a look at the Turbocad web site. The basic Turbocad package is cheaper than the up-grade. If the package is not fully compatible with an earlier version then you have to up-grade the earlier version. Nice business model.

JA

[John Stevenson 1Participant @johnstevenson1]

Posted by Frances IoM on 14/12/2015 12:21:48:
At the Xmas meeting of London based SMEE the Digital Working Group announced a series of monthly meetings to discuss + introduce Fusion 360 (+ also to provide distance video access to such talks etc).

However I have 2 major qualms
(a) after 40 years of Microsoft embrace, extend + extinguish coupled with their often illegal exploitation of a monopoly I actively avoid this company having switched to Linux but Fusion 360 will not it appears operate under Linux (nor under WINE)

.

Tough.

I read this all the while but it's you that have backed yourself into a corner and now want others to do something about it.

I don't like Vauxhall cars but do you think they would build me on to a Ford spec ?

Either use something the Linux community has written and works or except the fact that Fusion has tied it's apron strings the Windows.

It's not even like you are paying for anything so that someone gets a just reward. Linux is free, Fusion is free.

[MuzzerParticipant @muzzer]

Frances – not many proper CAD systems are available as Linux versions. We all hate monopoly abuse and lots of other things in life but you might as well just live with Microsoft as you can't change it, otherwise you are cutting off your nose to spite your face.

Ditto, if you really believe that Autodesk are going to deprive you of your work and license, you can keep local copies of your F360 work and import them into another application. It'll be a few years before then, so why not deal with it if and when it happens, assuming you are still alive and kicking. Glass half full etc.

Murray

[Swarf MakerParticipant @swarfmaker85383]

While Fusion 360 uses cloud storage for its proprietary file format, you do have the option of importing and exporting your work to your local storage. This seems to work well enough and I freely exchange files each way between F360 and TCAD Pro21 as some things are easiest done in one package or the other.

There are some detail differences between the 64 bit and 32 bit versions of TCAD Pro21 to be aware of. It also does on occasion get its knickers in a twist so saving progress frequently is worthwhile. Its ability to deal with many file types is a distinct advantage. I don't like its sequential history however and that is something that F360 has to strongly commend it. Being able to quickly and easily modify an earlier action is an excellent facility.

The best route to acquiring TCAD if you so wish is through 'PaulTheCAD' as advertised on this site. Very helpful.

The comments regarding whether files are compatible with industry standard machines is largely down to versions of supposedly standard 'file standards'. There are many subtle variations to trip everybody up – have a look at 'Teigha'.

'Onshape' also has some features that are quite useful such as the ease with which 2D drawings are taken from a 3D model. However, it does not have a 'quality' feel about it and having to be 'online' is a real pain with a slow connection, and for me, with several projects on the go at once, the 10 project limitation is a nuisance.

For most of what is normally required of a hobby manufacturing process, 2D CAD is the easiest and most useful thing to get proficient at. My previous recommendation of QCAD still stands in that regard.

Edited By Swarf Maker on 14/12/2015 13:25:39

[Peter G. ShawParticipant @peterg-shaw75338]

Well, I'll plough my lonely furrow once again!

I use DesignCAD Pro 3D which is now published by IMSI, the same people who publish TurboCad, although they appear to go to great lengths to not publish anything about it, DesignCAD that is.

I first came across DesignCAD when looking for a replacement for Draft Choice for Windows (which, incidently is still available – free) as Draft Choice didn't want to work with my then computer setup. DesignCAD is similar to Draft Choice in that a lot of commands, especially the oft used commands, can be activated straight from the keyboard, which saves messing about looking for the appropriate command in all the menu trees. I actually use a very old version, DC2000, but also have a later version, DC17 which is just as easy to use. The reason for using the old version is because I am running the program under Linux using WINE, the compatibility program and DC17 is slightly unbehaved in my particular system, But that should not bother you if you are running Windows.

I have just done a search and discovered that in the UK, the only version that appears readily available, at what seems to me to be an exhorbitant price, is DC2000, which as it's name implied, hails from 2000 (actually 1999 as this is the version I use). There are other versions available, but as an import from America and I do have to wonder about import duties etc.

In respect of TurboCad, when I tried it, I found it absolutely abominable, nonsensical, and yes, stupid. Nothing seemed intuitive, and I tried three different versions! In contrast, I found DesignCAD a joy to use. Having said that, I am aware that TurboCad has a large fan base, but is that because it gets pushed so much? I have seen it said that one either gets on with TurboCad, or one does not, and if the latter, well then…..

As I said Draft Choice is still available, although it is, and has been, unsupported for many a year. Licensing is free and the codes are available from the website (look for Draft Choice). It is old, it is 2D only, but for a raw beginner, as I was, it does have a very good introductory manual. As I said, I'm now using Linux so I can't comment on whether or not it will run satisfactorily on modern computers but it could be worth a try, even if you have to resort to something like Virtual Box (also free) to get it running.

Regards,

Peter G. Shaw

[Andy from WorkshopshedParticipant @andyfromworkshopshed]

I've moved to free versions of my CAD software.

OpenSCAD for 3D models, I enjoy that because of it's programming style approach.

For 2D work DraftSight works well and there still appears to be a free version of that.

I used to use Turbocad like Neil but after a machine upgrade my free license key stopped working and the full version was very expensive.

[John McNamaraParticipant @johnmcnamara74883]

Fusion works fine on a Mac there is a special version for Apple computers, A mate uses it on a Mac and is CNC cutting parts with it.

The CAM abilities are really what got me excited about Fusion. It can import many different file types.

**LINK**

I was able to import a 3D solid model written in Autocad straight into Fusion then create G code using the CAM functions.

See link below Look down the page a bit
**LINK**

For CAM… Direct to Mill or 3D Printer.
If you already have a CAD program you like working with and it has a compatible file type you can use that until you have learnt to use fusion for drawing in 3D.

Regards
John

Edited By John McNamara on 14/12/2015 22:37:10

[duncan webster 1Participant @duncanwebster1]

For some reason I think DarftSight works on Linux

[Gary WoodingParticipant @garywooding25363]

JA,

I think there's something wrong with your system. I'm using TCAD 16.2 Pro/Plat on my Win10 x64 system with no problems.

If you upgraded an earlier (Win7 or Win8) system to Win10, then try re-installing TCAD 16.

[JAParticipant @ja]

Gary

I will try again in a few days time when I have some available time. Thanks.

JA

[Bodgit Fixit and RunParticipant @bodgitfixitandrun]

Im learning FreeCad. It is what it says and meets my needs.

[JAParticipant @ja]

Success, many thanks Gary.

JA

[IanTParticipant @iant]

Another vote for Turbo CAD here – although it seems a bit like "Marmite" – you either like it or hate it.

I've been a long term user – starting with a free version of TC4DL and have upgraded several times – although I'm currently still on V15. I'm fairly proficient in 2D now but I've had to invest time to learn it.

I struggled to use TC 3D but then watched the tutorials on YouTube and a few things clicked. You need to re-think to some extent how you approach a drawing. I was very pleased to produce a reasonably complex 3D drawing recently with full rendering. Not sure it was particularly worth the effort (over 2D) in this case – but it was more of a 'let's see if I can do this' exercise.

There may be better system out there these days but why change if your CAD tool is more than capable of meeting your current drawing needs.

By the way – the comments about the Evil Empire (et al) that is Microsoft are running a bit thin these days. I used to hear them mostly from Apple fans, which is somewhat ironic given that Apple is the most closed/proprietary platform on Earth that you can choose. Stylish, yes; Cheap, no; Open Hardware or Software – absolutely not.

If you want Free/Open/"Death to all Capitalists" etc – then Linux is there for you to enjoy and many do so. One day, I may take the plunge too. Meanwhile, as a satisfied Microsoft user over several decades now, I'm happy to continue that way for now.

Regards,

IanT

[Ady1Participant @ady1]

Another Windows fan, still on XP32 and 64

Use the xp32 with Zonealarm pro because it blocks all outgoing transmissions, and there are a lot

I don't like my computer communicating with unknown receipients

The next version, Vista, wouldn't let ZAP work, surprise surprise, so I stuck with XP32

Designspark 1 works fine with the XP os

[Anthony GibsonParticipant @anthonygibson71082]

Viacad from Punchcad. various versions, 2d only, 2d/3d and Pro. I have the 2d/3d version. Quite intuitive and reasonably priced IMHO.

What attracted me to it was the fact it comes in PC and MAC versions, so my dad and i can share drawings for when he gets our 3d printer working!!!!

they also have a power pack add-on for 3d-printing but i have not played with this yet but it purports to 'fix' your drawing before you print it (fill in the meshes etc)

I have also started to look at iPad apps for quick drawings. Concept looks best so far with and without stylus support

[Author]

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