Why “Press Brake” and not “Brake Press”

[David McNivenParticipant @davidmcniven30335]

Hi, new member with possibly the most trivial first post ever, sorry…

It's just that not knowing's annoyed me for years and Google hasn't a clue.

So why isn't a press brake called a "brake press" instead?

I've asked operators, setters and managers different places I've worked, no answers.

You wouldn't say "press fly" or "press hydraulic" or "press forging" unless you were French so was it possibly invented in France? (my best and only guess)

I can live with all the other stuff I don't know and I promise never to pester you with apprentice-level questions again

[David McNivenParticipant @davidmcniven30335]

[Adrian JohnstoneParticipant @adrianjohnstone89946]

It's because a brake (as a noun) is a device for clamping and then bending metal.

You can have various kinds of brake for forming different kinds of folds, such as a box-and-pan brake (which uses inserts to form box shapes).

A press brake uses 'presses' which in this context are punch and die combinations allowing quite flexible folds to be formed.

To take your examples, in fly-press and hydraulic-press, the word press is the noun and the terms fly- and hydraulic- are modifiers telling you how they are actuated. In press-brake and box-and-pan-brake, the word brake is the noun and the press- or box-and-pan- terms are modifiers telling you what kind of folds they can make, and the names don't tell you how they are actuated at all. You can have manual press brakes, hydraulic press brakes or ones driven by a flywheel coupled to an electric motor.

Forgive the perhaps over detailed response, but you did ask…

[David JuppParticipant @davidjupp51506]

Perhaps because a brake operated by a press (a Press Brake) is only one option amongst Sheet Metal Brakes. I.E. 'press' is describing the 'brake', not the other way around.

I'm sure there will be many other explanations offered – decide which you prefer.

[BazyleParticipant @bazyle]

Well that is a rather interesting first post David and gave me food for thought. I like Adrian's explanation and think the hard part is accepting in one's mind that 'brake' has another meaning apart from it's use on wheels.

[Nicholas FarrParticipant @nicholasfarr14254]

Hi, well my understanding of the term "Press Brake" is a machine that presses a material to a settable predetermined amount, that is it presses and then brakes at the predetermined point. Brake meaning slowing or stopping motion.

Regards Nick.

[Roderick JenkinsParticipant @roderickjenkins93242]

"Brake n.

mid-15c., "instrument for crushing or pounding," from Middle Dutch braeke "flax brake," from breken "to break" (see break (v.)). The word was applied to many crushing implements and to the ring through the nose of a draught ox. It was influenced in sense by Old French brac, a form of bras "an arm," thus "a lever or handle," which was being used in English from late 14c., and applied to "a bridle or curb" from early 15c. One or the other or both took up the main modern meaning of "stopping device for a wheel," first attested 1772."

In certain cultures I think the term "brake" has been used as a synonym for machine, presumably derived from the various mechanisms to crush grain and plant fibres which were some of the earliest industrial mechanisms. So, using that line of thought a Press Brake is just a Press Machine.

Sorry, I have seen this written down somewhere with reasonable authority but can't remember where

Rod

[ronan walshParticipant @ronanwalsh98054]

Ok car buffs, what is a shooting brake

[richardandtracyParticipant @richardandtracy]

I had never honestly thought about it. And on reflection, don't think I really care. Will make a nice factoid for a Wine & Wisdom, but can't see it being a critical bit of knowledge in my life. However, I await other, and possibly more far fetched explanations with interest to see how far the explanation can be stretched.

In anticipation,

Richard.

[David McNivenParticipant @davidmcniven30335]

Thanks all,

still finding it hard not to see it as a press which is braked at a set point though.

Nick, if press-then-brake is what's meant I can see the logic in that, maybe that's it, dunno.

Today I've seen simple manual sheet metal folders described as brakes but not sure why – unless brake refers to the sheet clamp – one Wiki entry seemed to suggest use of the term "folder" is particular to the UK.

Wow, shooting brake. Had a Mini Countryman woody in the 60's. Delivering eggs, narrow lane, passing toff asked me to please move my shooting brake. Strangely quaint even then – his idea of politeness to an oik I think. Or maybe sarcasm…

Thanks for the effort everyone 

Edited By David McNiven on 26/01/2017 14:44:54

Edited By David McNiven on 26/01/2017 14:47:00

[John RuddParticipant @johnrudd16576]

Posted by ronan walsh on 26/01/2017 14:20:16:

Ok car buffs, what is a shooting brake

Alternative noun describing an estate car?

[RJWParticipant @rjw]

Posted by ronan walsh on 26/01/2017 14:20:16:

Ok car buffs, what is a shooting brake

Best I could come up with Ronan,

**LINK**

[Nick WheelerParticipant @nickwheeler]

Posted by ronan walsh on 26/01/2017 14:20:16:

Ok car buffs, what is a shooting brake

It's a two-door estate car for carrying guns.

Or it was, as the meaning has been diluted by applying it to posher estate cars.

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by David McNiven on 26/01/2017 13:01:19:

It's just that not knowing's annoyed me for years and Google hasn't a clue.

.

David,

I didn't know the answer either, but now it's been explained, I thought I would check your comment ^^^

A Google search for Press Brake led me very quickly to this Wikipedia page: **LINK**

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Press_brake

… which in turn links to: **LINK**

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brake_(sheet_metal_bending)

Whilst there was absolutely no harm in you asking the question … I think Google & Wikipedia between them did a pretty fair job.

MichaelG.

[Tim StevensParticipant @timstevens64731]

Shooting Brake:

A Brake in the 19th century was a light carriage used for breaking-in horses to carriage work – mis-spelt 'brake' in later use, which has stuck. Such a vehicle was later modified to carry luggage (a luggage-brake) and developed into the 'station waggon' intended to collect Fortum & Mason boxes from, and deliver parcels for the eldest son running the Empire to, the nearest railway station. In the US, the term 'Depot wagon' was also used. Another version was the 'Shooting Brake' which had seats (for the shooters) around the top of a box which could hold dogs, guns, lunch etc. (The beaters, being working class, walked.)

As such vehicles were generally only found on gentlemen's estates, the term 'estate car' was used in some areas when makers of motorised versions sought a wider market. The fancy patterning and woodwork on more recent estate cars is an echo of the shooting brake with a ventilated box so the dogs could get air.

Regards, Tim

[JAParticipant @ja]

Posted by Tim Stevens on 26/01/2017 22:05:41:

As such vehicles were generally only found on gentlemen's estates, the term 'estate car' was used in some areas when makers of motorised versions sought a wider market. The fancy patterning and woodwork on more recent estate cars is an echo of the shooting brake with a ventilated box so the dogs could get air.

Regards, Tim

Er…. Morris 1000 Traveller? Most of the ones I knew were well ventilated.

JA

[Tim StevensParticipant @timstevens64731]

Yes, Morris Traveller – but I'm not sure what question you are asking. If it helps, I was suggesting that the wood (etc) was merely symbolic, a sort of folk-memory, rather like the early railway carriages which had coach-lines around the doors to remind people of the mail Coaches they were used to.

The dogs that needed the air were the original ones, crammed under the seat, and not the spaniel in the Woodie.

Cheers, Tim

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by Tim Stevens on 26/01/2017 23:03:07:

… If it helps, I was suggesting that the wood (etc) was merely symbolic …

.

… and yet the Morris 1000 Traveller was probably the last example of a mass-market vehicle with a structural and visible Ash frame.

MichaelG.

.

P.S. … I think we can reasonably assume that JA was referring to the accidental ventilation, courtesy of corrosion.

[john carruthersParticipant @johncarruthers46255]

>Er…. Morris 1000 Traveller? Most of the ones I knew were well ventilated.<

and well insulated from engine heat

[Dave HalfordParticipant @davehalford22513]

accidental ventilation ? always thought the lack of paint was deliberate

[Carl Wilson 4Participant @carlwilson4]

Why why press brake and not brake press?

[Ian S CParticipant @iansc]

You might use a brake press if you wanted to press some part of a brake system.

Ian S C

[John HaineParticipant @johnhaine32865]

Post Office Telecommunications used to have a "rate book" that listed all the items you could get from their stores. Convention was that the noun appeared first in the description followed by an adjective if applicable. I was initially puzzled why everyone in the lab called a terminal block a "block terminal" but it was a result of this strange paractice. Presumably after a few more years someone would rename it a terminal block as by common usage the roles of noun and adjective had reversed.

As for a "mounting core dust", guess what that was?

[Carl Wilson 4Participant @carlwilson4]

If a press brake is something you use to press some part of a brake system then by definition my foot is one.

[ChrisHParticipant @chrish]

In a similar vein you stop off the end of a pipe or gutter with a stopend, rather than an end stop, which is what I would ask for at the plumbers merchants before I was 'educated'.

[Author]

Posts