Sulphuric Acid

[WindyParticipant @windy30762]

Just came across this on a motorcycle enthusiasts site

The government has added sulphuric acid to its list of regulated substances in The Poisons Act 1972. Due to this latest amendment, as of July 1st, 2018, members of the public must have an Explosives Precursors and Poisons (EPP) licence to buy sulphuric acid above 15% concentration.

This legislation mainly affects retail customers

However, all motorcycle batteries must be filled by the retailer before being sold to a member of the public in the UK who does not possess a valid EPP licence.

Lithium-ion batteries are acid-free and are thus unaffected by the legislation.

AGM/GEL batteries (such as Motobatt) – those which are factory activated (pre-filled with acid at the time of manufacture) – are also unaffected.

Maintenance-free un-activated batteries & Traditional/Wet batteries – those which come with a separate acid pack for home-activation – are to be sold to the General Public pre-filled and charged if necessary.
EPP licencing is not required for batteries that are supplied with the acid already activated inside. These are exempt – as a filled battery is classified as ‘specific object’.

The exemption is provided by new paragraph 2 (9) (b) of the original Poisons Act 1972:

(9) A substance or mixture is excluded if … (b) it is contained in a specific object.

What is the reason for this legislation?
In response to a rise in acid-related violent crimes in recent years, the government had added Sulphuric Acid to its list of regulated explosives.

[WindyParticipant @windy30762]

[Thor 🇳🇴Participant @thor]

Well apart from the obvious danger of getting skin burns, sulphuric acid is used extensively in the chemical industries and also in the production of explosives, so I guess in our violent world there are reasons to regulate its use.

Thor

[JonParticipant @jon]

Just another case of higher command being seen to be doing something whether right or wrong.
It dont take brain scientist to figure could drain readilly available batterys for the sulphuric.

Dare say theyve regulated/banned fertilisers!

[Brian GParticipant @briang]

I thought the change involving acid was more to show some action on vitriol throwing than explosives.

Brian

[David Standing 1Participant @davidstanding1]

It is in the Offensive Weapons Bill, that has just been put to Parliament:

**LINK**

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

If you have sulphuric acid already in stock, or want to stock up for electroplating, anodising, pickling or any other legitimate use, I suggest you dilute it down to 14.99% which will make it legal for you to keep it without a licence.

That's what I'll do.

Neil

[VicParticipant @vic]

I feel a trip to the hardware store coming on as sometimes the only thing that seems to clear our drains is a shot of the strong stuff. I’m not enamored by the idea of paying a plumber hundreds of pounds for something I can do myself.

[Speedy Builder5Participant @speedybuilder5]

How about the alcaldes ? Caustic soda gives you a nasty burn too ! The problem is, there is always a way around legislation – Buy a lead acid battery and drain the acid out of it. It is society that is the problem. You can have knife laws but own a carving knife, Its where you take and what you do with the knife which you can legislate for, but can't stop the use of.

[SamsarandaParticipant @samsaranda]

I was surprised when I read this posting as only recently you were able to obtain sulphuric acid easily from both eBay and Amazon so I checked the web this afternoon and sure enough the only way to purchase now is if you are licensed, seems that the change in legislation is being observed rigidly, as it should be.

Dave W

[colin branniganParticipant @colinbrannigan54160]

I bought 5 lts of battery acid today, enough to see me out.

Coln

[ronan walshParticipant @ronanwalsh98054]

This is like most other knee jerk legislation, it will do nothing other than inconvenience decent people who have legitimate uses for these substances. It has gotten to ridiculous proportions, you can not buy Kasenite anymore because it supposidily contained cyanides, paint stripper that may make a good face cream, but it won't strip paint, paints with certain components no longer permissible, such as hammerite, which are not a patch on the originals, the list goes on.

 

The lowlife who chuck acid in others faces, will simply move onto other substances, really obscure and rare chemical compounds, like petrol.

They have also gone out of their way to ban .50 bmg rifles. To the best of my knowledge, no .50 bmg rifle has ever been used in a crime in the Uk. I believe you have a much higher chance of dying by a leopard/lion/tiger attack, a golfball, lightening bolt,  than being struck with a .50bmg bullet.

Edited By ronan walsh on 22/06/2018 21:44:48

[Fowlers FuryParticipant @fowlersfury]

I can do without sulphuric in the workshop because apart from the obvious hazards, it's no good for descaling the boilers (forms insoluble calcium sulphate). But, I do use hydrochloric acid for efficient descaling (lime scale, Ag solder flux, removing copper oxides etc etc).
How long before that's added to the list – or has it been included already?

[Peter SpinkParticipant @peterspink21088]

Yup, usual knee jerk reaction targeting the easy option rather than tackling the root cause of the problem.

As ever, the majority of law abiding citizens such as me, a gun owner and model engineerr will have to restrict our harmless activities because of the actions of lawless morons.

Politicians . . .

[vintagengineerParticipant @vintagengineer]

One Shot Drainlable cleaner is readily avaiable and is 91% sulfuric acid. So that blows a hole in the law! Also if you boil sulfuric acid you can increase the strength.

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

Posted by colin brannigan on 22/06/2018 21:16:56:

I bought 5 lts of battery acid today, enough to see me out.

A good cupful will see you out if you are daft enough to drink it

N.

[Martin WParticipant @martinw]

I thought this regulation change re sulphuric acid had been covered pretty comprehensively in an earlier thread. Isn't it bloody marvelous one spells sulphuric the correct way and the site wants to correct it to sulfuric.

Gripe over.

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by Martin W on 23/06/2018 00:05:31:

… Isn't it bloody marvelous one spells sulphuric the correct way and the site wants to correct it to sulfuric.

.

It's worth looking at Schedule 1 of the act: [scroll down a little from here] :

**LINK**

https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/bills/cbill/2017-2019/0232/cbill_2017-20190232_en_5.htm

MichaelG.

[Robin GrahamParticipant @robingraham42208]

Posted by Martin W on 23/06/2018 00:05:31:

I thought this regulation change re sulphuric acid had been covered pretty comprehensively in an earlier thread. Isn't it bloody marvelous one spells sulphuric the correct way and the site wants to correct it to sulfuric.

Gripe over.

Sulfur has been the IUPAC standard spelling since 1990 and was adopted by the RSC in 1992 – it also has better etymological credentials than sulphur in that the name comes to us from Latin not Greek. Personally I shall continue to spell it sulphur to my last – sulfur just looks wrong – but it's harsh to blame the site spell-checker for adopting what has become the standard form!

It seems that it's fairly easy to get a licence to buy oil of vitriol (as I insist on calling it) – not much more hassle than applying for a passport. I don't think you even have to justify your need, unlike getting a licence for industrial alcohol. I think it's not so much about restricting legitimate home use as keeping a track on who's got the stuff – personally I have no objection to Mr Plod having a poke around my workshop to make sure it's not a bomb factory, fair enough, so as I use the stuff for anodisi(z)ng I shall probably apply.

Robin

[Martin WParticipant @martinw]

Robin, MichaelG

Thanks for the heads up re the 'Newly' adopted spelling of sulfur (yeuk) but like Robin I find that the new spelling just doesn't look right. Robin, 'S's and 'Z's is another bugbear of mine while the Z might be more phonetically correct I prefer the S version. Languages evolve and no doubt our predecessors would be horrified by my/our use of their language!

Cheers

Martin W

Sulphur rules OK

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by Martin W on 23/06/2018 11:02:30:

Sulphur rules OK

.

Not forgetting that other old favourite 'inflammable' … which was deposed by that young upstart 'flammable' ; allegedly to avoid misinterpretation.

MichaelG.

[Philip RoweParticipant @philiprowe13116]

Posted by vintagengineer on 22/06/2018 22:57:08:

One Shot Drainlable cleaner is readily avaiable and is 91% sulfuric acid. So that blows a hole in the law! Also if you boil sulfuric acid you can increase the strength.

Have you actually purchased any recently? I tried last week in my local diy shed and found that it was no longer available. Now got to find another way to clean the patio, grrr.

Phil

[vintagengineerParticipant @vintagengineer]

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/One-Instant-Shot-Liquid-Drain-Cleaner-1-Litre-Clears-Clogged-Drains-FAST-1L-/263654318560?_trksid=p2385738.m4383.l4275.c10

[GeorgineerParticipant @georgineer]

Not forgetting that other old favourite 'inflammable' … which was deposed by that young upstart 'flammable' ; allegedly to avoid misinterpretation.

MichaelG.

I've seen 'flammable' in an 1890s engineering book, and the Merriam Webster on-line dictionary dates its first known use to 1813. Some upstart!

George

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by Georgineer on 23/06/2018 23:16:13:

I've seen 'flammable' in an 1890s engineering book, and the Merriam Webster on-line dictionary dates its first known use to 1813. Some upstart!

.

**LINK**

https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/inflammable

MichaelG.

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