Idiots guide to brass

[norman valentineParticipant @normanvalentine78682]

Izack Your comment about solid blocks being tricky to adjust is correct but that is tiny compared with the trouble of making the blocks far more complicated than they need to be.

I didn't find getting the tension on the rigging to be a problem.

 

Edited By norman valentine on 25/05/2015 13:15:15

[Izack MaddParticipant @izackmadd89335]

Posted by Vic on 25/05/2015 10:27:28:

http://www.syrenshipmodelcompany.com/swiss-pear-rigging-blocks.php

Should have what you need.

Hi,

Your right they do have all I need but at $23 for fifty it's more than I want to spend really

[Izack MaddParticipant @izackmadd89335]

Posted by norman valentine on 25/05/2015 13:14:26:

Izack Your comment about solid blocks being tricky to adjust is correct but that is tiny compared with the trouble of making the blocks far more complicated than they need to be.

I didn't find getting the tension on the rigging to be a problem.

Edited By norman valentine on 25/05/2015 13:15:15

Hi,

I fully understand what your saying and mainly agree. But it's the same as "why make the model" in the first place. Because… And as I'm unable to work it gives me something to aim for. You could say the same of people who make steam engines with hundreds of scale rivets. Plus the one I've made which is always the slowest. Only took five mins. And looks ten times better than any I've seen. I may not do it but I had the tube. And decided to try. Especial as mine look better than some hand made ones on the MSW. Forum which are just cubes of wood with holes in.

But as I put into action all the great ideas and see if it's at all practical then let thing develop from there. Thanks Norman and all the rest of you.

Izack

[AjohnwParticipant @ajohnw51620]

With GREAT care using a knife edge needle file WITH hopefully a plastic handle rather than a sharp end – hold said tube in some form of electric drill at a moderately slow speed.

You could jig this up to form a lathe of sorts – drill a hole in some piece of wood to suite the tube OD, saw in half. Lay tube in the wood as a support and drive it with the drill and file away. This should give you nice clean cuts. A knife probably will too,

John

–

[jason udallParticipant @jasonudall57142]

As to consistency.
How about a blade spacer dull blade sandwich. ..
Sharp blade ..spacer of required thickness..futher blade ( or just plain strip)…

.the plain strip hangs onto end..allowing blade to touch tube spacer ( plus half blade thickness) from end..
Now roll for effect…
This is why I asked weather you needed say 1.34 mm or “all the same”…
When I made one for work they had to be 20.0 mm long -0.0 +0.1..but that was easy..with the toys to machine spacers with ease…

[jason udallParticipant @jasonudall57142]

One futher thing
The knife blade solution gives a clean burr ( on outside) free finish…..
No small bonus on parts this size…
I once had to finish with oil stone 1000’s of 3mm long by 0.6 mm diameter pins..to take off the part off pip.. (yep even cnc lathes leave part off pips. ( esp in carbide))…no fun no fun at all..

[norman valentineParticipant @normanvalentine78682]

Izack, I agree with your philosophy of wanting to make it because you can. My ship model has all of the interior detail that could only be seen if you were to break it open. I did it because I wanted to. The blocks that I used were awful, little cubes with holes in them but in the overall scheme of things you don't even notice them in the mass of rigging, and I only did the fixed rigging and left the running rigging off!

It was my first ship model and I got huge satisfaction from building it. It is now on display in the museum in the Falkland Islands.

Enjoy your model.

[VicParticipant @vic]

I'm finding it hard to imagine how small pieces of brass tube are supposed to represent Wooden Blocks. Can't help thinking it's not going to look very good. I understand some of the issues but folks that build ship models either make or buy wooden blocks or use the plastic "blocks" supplied in some kits. What are you going to do for Deadeyes?

[Izack MaddParticipant @izackmadd89335]

Posted by norman valentine on 25/05/2015 16:49:30:

Izack, I agree with your philosophy of wanting to make it because you can. My ship model has all of the interior detail that could only be seen if you were to break it open. I did it because I wanted to. The blocks that I used were awful, little cubes with holes in them but in the overall scheme of things you don't even notice them in the mass of rigging, and I only did the fixed rigging and left the running rigging off!

It was my first ship model and I got huge satisfaction from building it. It is now on display in the museum in the Falkland Islands.

Enjoy your model.

Thanks for understanding and very impressive place to have your first model end up. Congratulations.

[Izack MaddParticipant @izackmadd89335]

Posted by Vic on 25/05/2015 17:19:43:

I'm finding it hard to imagine how small pieces of brass tube are supposed to represent Wooden Blocks. Can't help thinking it's not going to look very good. I understand some of the issues but folks that build ship models either make or buy wooden blocks or use the plastic "blocks" supplied in some kits. What are you going to do for Deadeyes?

Not everyone uses the ready made versions. As there is a chap, Dafi, over on MSW. making his own block right now.

The brass tube is for the pulley wheel inside the block. Which the rope will slide over. It should be grooved around the edge. But the metal is slick enough without that much detail.

[Izack MaddParticipant @izackmadd89335]

Posted by jason udall on 25/05/2015 16:45:08:

One futher thing
The knife blade solution gives a clean burr ( on outside) free finish…..
No small bonus on parts this size…
I once had to finish with oil stone 1000's of 3mm long by 0.6 mm diameter pins..to take off the part off pip.. (yep even cnc lathes leave part off pips. ( esp in carbide))…no fun no fun at all..

Hi,

Thanks for the comments. I think we've reached the main sticking point between wooden tops and tin tacks. That of exact terms and accuracy. 😜 if we can ignore are own specialities for a moment and use the vernacular, what I need is a means of cutting lengths of tube repeatedly, simply, easily, and with enough accuracy so as to make the sizes "look" the same. I'm not like split cane rod makers, working to a precise 1/75". So as I can create the wooden parts the same and know that they should hold the pulley wheel without binding. So if some are mildly smaller that's fine. It's a maximum that is the main critical point.

Hope this makes sense.

I don't envy you with the De-piping 👎

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

Maybe make something like this with a stop to set your lengths, slot to take a knife or razor saw and simple clamp to hold the work.

Similar design here

Edited By JasonB on 26/05/2015 12:16:49

[Izack MaddParticipant @izackmadd89335]

Posted by JasonB on 26/05/2015 12:11:52:

Maybe make something like this with a stop to set your lengths, slot to take a knife or razor saw and simple clamp to hold the work.

Similar design here

Edited By JasonB on 26/05/2015 12:16:49

Thanks for that as its something that I can recreate shall we say without any special equipment and even out of timber. Defiantly something I'll be trying as its so simple yet potententialy very useful not just tubes. And no chance of loosing fingers

[jason udallParticipant @jasonudall57142]

Sorry can’t supply skrtch at moment. .
—-l lxxxxl l
—-l lxxxxl l
—-l lxxxxl l
. l l l l
. V l l
========l l
. Ll
========

xxxxx = spacer
l l
l l = knife blade
V

l l
l l = end fence
l l

=====
= tube being cut.
=====

Does this help?

I see now its not. ..can’t even post ascii art..*mutters*

Edited By jason udall on 26/05/2015 15:37:11

Edited By jason udall on 26/05/2015 15:43:03

[jason udallParticipant @jasonudall57142]

Ok in “carpentry” terms

What you want us like a mini marking gauge..
Replace the scriber with a blade..score the tube at fixed distance from sliding part..

Score it by rolling blade over tube ..While keeping “fence” in contact ( really it is that simple ..once scored theblade locates it self ..). Three or four firm strokes ought to do.

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

Simple block of wood with two strips of hardwood fixed to the top to make a channel to take the tube, stop cut from thin material with a slot for two screws to lock it. if the strips were shallower than the tube OD you could just press it down by hand while cutting so no need for a clamp.

Either roll a knife blade over the tube guided by teh slot or use a razor saw

Edited By JasonB on 26/05/2015 15:55:11

[jason udallParticipant @jasonudall57142]

What I don’t seem to be communicating is the roll ing of the tube under a simple knife blade..
It leaves a cut that normally needs no further deburr…think of the knife blade in a plumbers tube cutter..

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

Communicated to me OK

Something like this, alter the rebate to give the length of ring needed then just hold it on the end of the tube as you roll it along the bench

[jason udallParticipant @jasonudall57142]

Jason B..
Thats a way…
And what I shoud have suggested for this application.
I had this idea of seperating fence from spacer so spacer could be changed..for different lengths
Over complex..
Now how about one that does ten at a time

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

No problem, thickness of a stanley blade should be about right just gang them up

[jason udallParticipant @jasonudall57142]

Gosh..just like I suggested two pages ago

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

Problem with that is if the rings don't part off in order…

Neil

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

This is the jig from Expo I am trying out:

http://www.expotools.com/cgi-bin/sh000003.pl?WD=tube&PN=Mini-Tube-Cutter-Capacity-1-8—-7-8–71540.html#SID=14

It is nicely done and very much like those Jason suggests. The commercial ones will tackle a wider range of tube sizes.

But sawing off 700? rather you than me!

Neil

[Izack MaddParticipant @izackmadd89335]

Thanks for all the brilliant ideas which I'm certainly going to be trying in one combination or other.

I really do appriciate all the suggestion but there are too many to name but I would like to thank JasonB and Jason Udall for showing such teamwork. One comes up with the ides and the other draws it out.

[jason udallParticipant @jasonudall57142]

Another thing that comes to mind..
I never had any trouble with “not parting off in order”.. so it never needed solving ( for me)

But , and inhind sight might keep the parted off parts under control, if you thread a thin wire down the tube first..knot either end…the parted off bits stay together while you work..

Oh…futher thought…what about watch/clock bushes…you can buy these in such a variety of sizes. …just a thought.

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