Ac motor 3 wire

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Ac motor 3 wire

This topic has 16 replies, 8 voices, and was last updated 6 July 2020 at 23:04 by Kiwi Bloke.

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6 July 2020 at 14:12 #27499
Buffer
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@buffer
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6 July 2020 at 14:12 #484262
Buffer
Participant
@buffer
Hi

I was thinking of using my old tumble dryer motor for a gadget builder style four facet drill grinder. Only thing is I am not sure how it is wired. I have included a photo because it has three wires going into it and two of those go via a capacitor. The capacitor has four terminals which I think might be because it is a start capacitor for a motor that runs both ways. My question is does anyone know what the connections would be if i just wanted to run this motor one way for grinding. Does anyone know what rpm this motor might be when run on UK mains single phase. I have seen before that some of you can tell the speed of some motors just by looking and knowing the frequency of the mains.

Thanks for any help
6 July 2020 at 14:46 #484265
John Baron
Participant
@johnbaron31275
Hi Buffer,

The motor will run at 2850 rpm. But without the information on the capacitor its difficult to say whether it is simply an interference suppressor or a start capacitor. The way that its wired it could be either.
6 July 2020 at 14:54 #484266
Maurice Taylor
Participant
@mauricetaylor82093
If you know make and model of drier ,look up service manual/circuit diagram on internet. Just done the same to re-use my old Whirlpool washer motor.
6 July 2020 at 15:04 #484267
Buffer
Participant
@buffer
John thanks for the info I have just taken a photo of the capacitor.

Maurice, that's a good idea. Even after 20 something years of being on the net I never thought of trying that! I will have a look now.
6 July 2020 at 15:17 #484270
Ian Parkin
Participant
@ianparkin39383
Are you sure that the cap has 4 terminals? not 2 terminals with 2 conections on each terminal?

Edited By Ian Parkin on 06/07/2020 15:17:51
6 July 2020 at 16:14 #484280
John Haine
Participant
@johnhaine32865
Quick google on the cap confirms it's a start capacitor. Also I think that it has 4 terminals but in 2 commoned pairs. Did the machine reverse in operation? Nothing to say that this is a 2850 rpm motor – could be 2 or 4 pole, if the latter it would be 1425.
6 July 2020 at 16:51 #484292
Buffer
Participant
@buffer
The capacitor has 2 terminals with 2 wires on each terminal.

I think the dryer turned both ways but I do know that when I took the lid off the dryer i could make it go both ways depending on which way i spun the drum.
6 July 2020 at 19:43 #484322
John Baron
Participant
@johnbaron31275
Hi Buffer,

Thanks for the picture ! Yes its a start cap, and yes the motor will run either way.

Your earlier picture made it difficult to see that there were only two connections.

Effectively the black wire is mains neutral. The live goes to one side or the other of the capacitor depending upon which way you want it to spin.

If you do a resistance check between the black and yellow wires it should be the same resistance black to either yellow wire.
6 July 2020 at 19:51 #484323
John Baron
Participant
@johnbaron31275
Posted by John Haine on 06/07/2020 16:14:46:

Quick google on the cap confirms it's a start capacitor. Also I think that it has 4 terminals but in 2 commoned pairs. Did the machine reverse in operation? Nothing to say that this is a 2850 rpm motor – could be 2 or 4 pole, if the latter it would be 1425.

Hi John,

Definitely a two pole 2850 rpm motor ! I don't know of a tumble dryer that uses a four pole motor to provide direct drum drive. Look at the size of the belt pulley and compare its size to that of a 26" diameter drum. The belt runs around the outside of the drum from that small pulley. Also its only a 1/2 Hp motor.

I actually use a similar motor on my four facet drill grinder.
6 July 2020 at 19:54 #484325
Buffer
Participant
@buffer
John x2 Maurice and Ian.

Thanks for all the help and advice it seems to be sorted, so now I can work out if it will be good enough for a small grinder.

Regards

Rich
6 July 2020 at 20:10 #484336
John Baron
Participant
@johnbaron31275
Hi Rich,

I use a similar motor on my four facet drill grinder. I used a switch so that I can run the motor in either direction depending upon which side of the grinding wheel I'm using.

There is a picture of mine on the "Gadget Builder" web site, near the bottom of the page.
6 July 2020 at 20:27 #484340
John Haine
Participant
@johnhaine32865
If you could reverse the direction depending which way you gave it a spin then the cap is probably gash.
6 July 2020 at 20:30 #484341
duncan webster 1
Participant
@duncanwebster1
My 4 facet drill grinder has the motor out of a dishwasher main pump, just the ticket.

Buffer:- make sure you shield those holes in the motor but not to restrict air flow.
6 July 2020 at 20:52 #484346
Pete Rimmer
Participant
@peterimmer30576
I took a motor out of a security barrier once that was wired like that. It's a 3 phase 415v motor but wired to 240v single phase with a capacitor wired across 2 phases. Up and down was provided by sending power to one of the two phases wired to the cap or the other, as required.

For light duty operation it works just great.
6 July 2020 at 22:12 #484357
Buffer
Participant
@buffer
John B, John H

I just measured the rpm and it was about 1400. I've turned in now but will check again tomorrow with my glasses on!

Do you think the gadget builder design is worth doing? Did you make any changes or would you make any with hindsight?

Thanks
6 July 2020 at 23:04 #484366
Kiwi Bloke
Participant
@kiwibloke62605
Hope I'm not adding to the confusion – there's inconsistent advice in this thread…

The capacitor is, strictly speaking, a run capacitor, in that it is permanently in circuit. The motor almost certainly has two identical windings arranged with one end of each connected together, and brought out as one lead, typically the black one. The other end of each winding is brought out as a lead, and the capacitor is connected across these leads. The identical windings allow the motor to be reversed at will. As has already been said, one wire carrying mains (eg live) is connected to one or other end of the cap, depending on the desired direction of rotation, typically by a change-over switch. The other mains wire (eg neutral) is connected to the winding's common point (the black lead).

You can check this by measuring the resistance between each coloured wire and the black one, and between the two coloured wires (disconnect the cap). I'm assuming the black lead is connected to the two windings' common point. The latter resistance should be twice the former, and the two former resistances should be identical. If that's not the case, it's a single-direction motor, and is wired a little differently – mains across lower-resistance winding (coloured to black), cap across other two coloured wires.

[edited to be even more pedantic…]

Edited By Kiwi Bloke on 06/07/2020 23:07:33
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