I now get all mine from china/Hong Kong. Not had any problems, so far.

We tried some Chinese ones at work. Ran as good as the “branded” ones, but had about half the life. Cheap will do me at home on carbide inserts.

never had a problem but have a sneaky idea that most of what we buy, shall we say at normal prices are just rebadged chinky gear anyway………

remember Taihwan stuff was shall we say was pony to begin with……..now it's up there with the good'uns……..

it all depends on the cost cutting aXX-hole accountants that order in the cheapo gear, hence the bad reputation for Chinese materials…….

have heard that certain European roller bearing manufacturers have their bearings made in China………

it's just quality control…….

buy the cheapo stuff and if it goes bad just bin it…..

shame European manufacturers think they can charge what they want….spose u can if it's tax deductable…..

memories of the crap that the Brit motorcyle manuf's used to turn out…..

rant over……….clogs

Recently I have seen where a well known brand was being counterfiet in China and sold as this brand. The packet and label looks identical. The product looks to a casual observer as being the same. But a close inspection shows this is not the case. Not saying what you brought is a knock off , but it is happening. These knock off tips that I have seen don't have the tool cutting life of the genuine article. But home hobbiest seldom get the same cutting volume off an insert anyway.

Neil

Is it genuine or a cheap clone? Tools, inserts are the same as electronic assemblies from China.

Assume a production line making carbide tips and the customer wants 1 million – does the production stop when that number is reached? Or do they continue to make more and sell to local stockists for next to nothing.

I have had electronic assemblies from China that cost less than the postage here in the UK but all were well made and worked. I have no doubt that there are cheap clones, the Arduino boards are a classic example, obviously a rip off clone just by looking at it.

How to spot a lower quality item, not always easy but you have a number of options, pay top wack price, go to a reputable dealer or take your chance and see what you get.

It reminds me of third part batteries for digital cameras, there is so much cr#p on the camera forums you would not believe it. If it bothers you pay the manufactures inflated price (£60 – £80) is not uncommon.

If it bothers you take the hit, if it doesn't there are plenty of reliable clone manufactures at a quarter of the price, just don't be stupid and go for the cheapest. I like to think the average person on this forum is above average intelligence and quite capable of making this sort of decision.

I have just tried some cheap APMT tips. They did not survive one pass over a 7"x5" casting.

If users of the cheap imports find them effective then they've had more success than me. I purchased a few supposedly Chinese imported carbide tips but their cleaness of cut was very poor on my lathe set up. I then tried "expensive" Iscar tips and their performance was a revelation e.g. when taking a 1 thou cut on silver steel rod. A comparison of the cutting edges on both new inserts under the microscope revealed why.

(At x200 the depth of field is extremely narrow).

Being no expert whatsoever on such tips, I just now purchase the branded tips based on performance and have no feelings about being 'ripped off'.

What part numbers did they claim for these 2 (clearly very different) inserts? The RH one looks like a ground, uncoated insert. You'd expect them to behave quite differently. There are many hundreds of different geometries, surface treatments, chipbreakers, nose radii etc available. Apples and pears?

Murray

I just bought a face mill from Banggood along with a 10 pack of APMT tips. They seem to work ok on aluminium with a light test cut of a few thou. Trying a piece of mild steel they were awful – I stopped a ten thou cut before the mill shook itself to bits and tried around three thou. The finish looks like the back end of a badger.

However, on looking around at what is available I have to say that there might be something in what the op says. Prices vary wildly, even for name brands. I see Axminster are selling no-name APMT 1604 tips at around £14 each. No idea what the quality is like and I'm unlikely to ever find out at that price. Some name brands on eBay are available for around £25-30 for 10.

ARC sells named and un-named brands (namely CCMT and CCGT types). ARC knows the exact source of un-named as well as named brand which it sells. The maker of the un-named brand supplies us a a specific – consistent quality. We are unable to buy un-named or named brands from the original makers at the low prices regularly suggested on eBay, Banggood or other similar sites. The real reasons are stated earlier.

Ketan at ARC

Edited By Ketan Swali on 21/09/2017 15:11:47

I accept Ketan's comments and acknowledge my relative ignorance of the intricacies of "hundreds of different geometries, surface treatments, chipbreakers, nose radii etc".

If model engineers find a tool which does the job to their satisfaction where's the problem? My point was merely that the unbranded tips, I maybe misguidedly purchased, performed badly in use. Consequently I tried an Iscar insert in the same toolholder and was satisfied with the results obtained. I've no idea what, if any, the claimed part number was for the unbranded tips and I doubt the "well known" seller did either. These are the two tips in question at x10 magnification. The unbranded one (left) had been used once only on the upper tip.

To appropriate that common stallholder's cry to customers "yer pays yer money and takes yer choice".

Or you could go up a gear and use PCD or CBN tips? That would most certainly be premium.

Michael W

Oh lord, what a real messed up conclusion

Ketan at ARC.