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  • #509498
    V8Eng
    Participant
      @v8eng
      Posted by Martin Kyte on 23/11/2020 22:27:19:

      Yes but think of all the extra battery's you can get in a caravan. I thought you lot were engineers.

      regards Martin

      Or a big diesel generator to charge the car up.devilblush

      I’ll get me coat.

      Edited By V8Eng on 23/11/2020 22:36:29

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      #509510
      Stuart Smith 5
      Participant
        @stuartsmith5

        Re towing and 4wd electric cars.

        The new Mercedes EQC 4wd SUV is apparently similar in size to the current GLC SUV. The brochure spec says it has an 80kWh battery, range of 241miles and 0-60 time of 5.1 secs. A kerb weight of 2495kg, towing capacity of 1800kg (braked). The problem is the list price is £65,700 . No road tax though. In comparison, the cheapest 2l diesel GLC has a list price of £40600.

        It doesn’t mention what the range would be when towing.

        Stuart

        Edited By Stuart Smith 5 on 23/11/2020 23:26:44

        #509517
        Mike Poole
        Participant
          @mikepoole82104

          I think Martin’s comment about batteries in the caravan was tongue in cheek but maybe it will be possible to hire an auxiliary battery to improve range when towing. Maybe caravans will have a space to install a temporary battery, due to extended periods of out of service I would think a permanent battery would be unsuitable. Although cars are tending to be built around the battery I would think trucks would lend themselves more easily to a quick swap battery pack and a stationary truck does not earn money so could be a winner. We are probably far from the solutions that in the end will prevail. Calling an autonomous car to come and collect you and drop you off may well happen but looking how some people keep their cars I would rather ride in the back of a dustcart, maybe a trip to a valet station between customers will be essential.

          Mike

          #509532
          pgk pgk
          Participant
            @pgkpgk17461

            Hot on the heels of british classics like the Bond Bug and the Sinclair C5 comes the Citroen Ami – for the urban proletariat. Licensed as a quadricylce can be used from 16yrs. With its massive 5,5KWH battery it;s good for nearly 30mph and a range around 45 miles. And only 3 hrs to recharge from a domestic 13A source.
            All this for £3K down and £18 a month. To make it perfect they even put a suicide door on one side – magic.

            I suppose it's one-up on the moped I had at 16 but that was environemntally friendly – break wind in the tank, wait for it to condense and good for another 5 miles…laugh

            pgk

            #509534
            not done it yet
            Participant
              @notdoneityet

              Posted by Mike Poole on 23/11/2020 23:50:35:

              ……

              Calling an autonomous car to come and collect you and drop you off may well happen but looking how some people keep their cars I would rather ride in the back of a dustcart, maybe a trip to a valet station between customers will be essential.

              Mike

              Don’t you think that hirers would very quickly slap on a huge deposit, were a vehicle returned in an unsuitable condition (for the next customer) and thus need to be sanitised?

              #509561
              Samsaranda
              Participant
                @samsaranda

                In respect of electrical infrastructure, I.e. the cables under our streets and their inability to cope if everyone wants to charge their vehicles at the same time, by the time this starts to happen in 9 years time the government hope that their smart meter installation project should have completed so functions on the smart meter are the ability to increase tariffs when there is high demand and when demand in a particular area looks as though it will exceed the capabilities of the distribution infrastructure then the supply companies have the facility with every smart meter of selective disconnection in order to protect supply, so customers may find their supply disrupted at regular intervals, food for thought?
                Dave W

                #509567
                duncan webster 1
                Participant
                  @duncanwebster1
                  Posted by pgk pgk on 24/11/2020 07:20:51:

                  Hot on the heels of british classics like the Bond Bug and the Sinclair C5 comes the Citroen Ami – for the urban proletariat. Licensed as a quadricylce can be used from 16yrs. With its massive 5,5KWH battery it;s good for nearly 30mph and a range around 45 miles. And only 3 hrs to recharge from a domestic 13A source.
                  All this for £3K down and £18 a month. To make it perfect they even put a suicide door on one side – magic.

                  I suppose it's one-up on the moped I had at 16 but that was environemntally friendly – break wind in the tank, wait for it to condense and good for another 5 miles…laugh

                  pgk

                  I've always wanted to drive around in a toaster, in the meantime, here's some info on hydrogen power projects

                  IMechE

                  #509576
                  Circlip
                  Participant
                    @circlip

                    Totally screws the "Split charge" facility unless you can charge both car and caravan at same time but only if caravan had a Lithium monstrosity fitted.

                    Pity KR200 had such a poor engine, retrofit was a Honda 250.

                    Regards Ian.

                    #509589
                    Paul Rhodes
                    Participant
                      @paulrhodes20292

                      In large part the initiative is more political than practical.Who advises and have they not understood that green at point of consumption differs from green at the point of production? Expect not as the same system pushed us towards diesel that the man in the street knew then to be unpleasant, and now knows to have its own dangers.

                      Having but one government minister ( in 33 I am told ) with a science degree, perhaps "diversity" in a grown up understanding of its broader meaning should be addressed.

                      An earlier poster was spot on that the future will be a mixed energy economy. My city uses hydrogen fuelled buses, to a fanfare almost as loud as some of our self congratulatory posters here. The cost is 4-5 times that of diesel, and they stop 4-5 times more frequently because of interlocks and sensor warnings ( again my source tells me). They certainly pollute not the town, but require a large electrical sub station to feed the hydrogen production.

                      If the political green (sorry) light is to stimulate debate and encourage energy innovation I am all for it. If it is taken as confirmation by blinkered green enthusiasts that battery is the "one true way", then we are heading up a cut de sac with no charging point at its terminus.

                      #509592
                      Bob n About
                      Participant
                        @bobnabout

                        Gentlemen, what is needed is an order of magnitude increase in voltage at the socket. Fast charging of electric vehicles will be a breeze at much reduced current. Not to mention the BOOM in appliance sales.

                        #509635
                        10ba12ba
                        Participant
                          @10ba12ba

                          If you are interested to know how your electricity is being generated right now:

                          gridwatch.co.uk

                          and as I post this, 1Gw is from coal.

                          Regards all round

                          H.

                          #509639
                          Vic
                          Participant
                            @vic

                            Has anyone mentioned yet that Amazon have ordered 100,000 electric vans and UPS have ordered 10,000 to be built and operated in the UK?

                            There is new battery tech on the way.

                            **LINK**

                            I’m pretty disappointed to hear that you can tow a caravan with an EV, I was hoping it would put and end to the inconvenience millions have to suffer getting stuck behind one. smiley

                            Edit: Just seen this.

                            **LINK**

                            #509651
                            pgk pgk
                            Participant
                              @pgkpgk17461

                              A lot going on in theoretical battery tech and development. According to Link the Lithium-Air battery has potential to almost equal petrol energy/weight and presumably EV would be more efficient in how it uses that energy.

                              I still like the idea of hydrogen, particularly for heavy transport but it does depend on enough spare (cheap) leccy generation and finding some magic catalyst to make electolysis efficient enough – and then a distrution system. Or make your own at home? I wonder if this link is real?

                              pgk

                              #509653
                              Steviegtr
                              Participant
                                @steviegtr
                                Posted by pgk pgk on 24/11/2020 18:14:42:

                                A lot going on in theoretical battery tech and development. According to Link the Lithium-Air battery has potential to almost equal petrol energy/weight and presumably EV would be more efficient in how it uses that energy.

                                I still like the idea of hydrogen, particularly for heavy transport but it does depend on enough spare (cheap) leccy generation and finding some magic catalyst to make electolysis efficient enough – and then a distrution system. Or make your own at home? I wonder if this link is real?

                                pgk

                                As i said earlier a car that can run on water. B.P & i guess all the other energy suppliers have this up there sleeve to market when the time is right for them. It's all about the money money.

                                Steve.

                                #509661
                                pgk pgk
                                Participant
                                  @pgkpgk17461

                                  It was back in the '60s when Grandpa Munster invented the pill you add to a tank of water to run a conventional ICE hearse. It just never made it to market.

                                  Link

                                  pgk

                                  #509664
                                  duncan webster 1
                                  Participant
                                    @duncanwebster1
                                    Posted by pgk pgk on 24/11/2020 18:14:42:

                                    ……
                                    I….Or make your own at home? I wonder if this link is real?

                                     

                                    sounds like a bit of pie in the sky. Many metals react with water to produce hydrogen and the metal oxide (or hydroxide), but you would then have to recover the metal from the oxide, which will take at least as much energy as you could get from the hydrogen. If you start with metal and water and finish up with metal and water you aren't going to liberate any energy

                                    Edited By duncan webster on 24/11/2020 20:01:50

                                    #509716
                                    pgk pgk
                                    Participant
                                      @pgkpgk17461
                                      Posted by duncan webster on 24/11/2020 20:01:23

                                      sounds like a bit of pie in the sky. Many metals react with water to produce hydrogen and the metal oxide (or hydroxide), but you would then have to recover the metal from the oxide, which will take at least as much energy as you could get from the hydrogen. If you start with metal and water and finish up with metal and water you aren't going to liberate any energy

                                      Edited By duncan webster on 24/11/2020 20:01:50

                                      There's obviously hype in the writing and promotion. If the system works then self-evidently you aren't going to be getting energy from nothing nor does it pretend to be some ficticious cold fusion. If the system can effectively produce H2 locally in usable quantities whenever needed then the energy required for reprocessing can be used when available from alternate renewables. Practicality depends on those energy values input/output.

                                      However that link was 4years old and further searches show their facebook page was last updated 3years ago and their domain name is up for sale. I think we can assume they folded and it was a possible scam unless you like Steviegtr's conspiracy theories and they were buried by Big Energy smiley

                                      pgk

                                      #509727
                                      J Hancock
                                      Participant
                                        @jhancock95746

                                        The real pain to everyday life will be when 'navvies' get to work on the streets/roads/ houses/offices to provide the infrastructure to allow this 'nightmare' to become reality.

                                        And it ALL has to be in place before 2030.

                                        #509731
                                        Howi
                                        Participant
                                          @howi

                                          Gentlemen! stop worrying, it just won't happen. Anything the government puts its hands on turns to disaster. the only people who will benefit are those advsing the government ( who in turn get their share of course!!!)

                                          the future is not electric but hydrogen.

                                          #509732
                                          clogs
                                          Participant
                                            @clogs

                                            make the cars for less than 1/2 the price a Petrol engined car is now and we'll buy a new EV now….

                                            well almost all of us………

                                            my thinking is it costs less to make than the vehicles now (petrol), certainly as much electronic nonsence…

                                            hopefully more reliable than now…..

                                            it's just 4 wheels n tyres (no spare anymore, been like that for years) a few cheapo metal pressings and a whole load of plastic poo to sit on and in…..

                                            yes the research has to be paid for but if 25% of the population bought an EV in the next year they'd still make a fortune…..

                                            been told,

                                            to replace my VW T4 Diesel BUS/Kombi (with no RUST) will set me back over £60,000 for the EV version….

                                            the Diesel version, I got a quote 1 year ago for a tad over £41,000……..

                                            come on guy's get realistic…..

                                            also, with all this electro nonsence/static etc in an EV, will they rust out quicker than they do already…..?

                                            I enjoy this post….more please……

                                            #509740
                                            J Hancock
                                            Participant
                                              @jhancock95746

                                              I reckon we can keep this going 'til 2030……….at least.

                                              #509747
                                              Michael Gilligan
                                              Participant
                                                @michaelgilligan61133

                                                Trains being ‘vehicles’ too … This is worth a look: **LINK**

                                                https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/stories-55044198

                                                MichaelG.

                                                #509750
                                                pgk pgk
                                                Participant
                                                  @pgkpgk17461
                                                  Posted by J Hancock on 25/11/2020 09:22:19:

                                                  And it ALL has to be in place before 2030.

                                                  No it doesn't. Average age of cars UK is <8yrs. It has to be started now but 2038+…

                                                  Howi

                                                  "the future is not electric but hydrogen. "

                                                  The future is fusion – and always will be… Helium4 futures anyone?

                                                  Clogs

                                                  make the cars for less than 1/2 the price a Petrol engined car is now and we'll buy a new EV now….
                                                   

                                                  He's a thought. Gov will spend more than £100Billion on HS2 and has spent masses on Covid. There's currently 38million cars UK. So for £100Billion gov could give every car owner more than £2.5K towards a new car. And it wouldn't even cost them anything because it's your debt smiley
                                                   

                                                  National debt is over 2 trillion with a population of 67million so nearly £30K/head of pupulation. Or considering there's 20million households a mere £100K per household… just 50% more on that and everyone gets a free EV – tabloid math

                                                     

                                                  J Hancock

                                                  I reckon we can keep this going 'til 2030……….at least.

                                                   

                                                  I Suspect many original authors will have dropped by the wayside or live in urns on the mantlepiece by then…

                                                  pgk

                                                   

                                                  Edited By pgk pgk on 25/11/2020 10:39:26

                                                  #509752
                                                  clogs
                                                  Participant
                                                    @clogs

                                                    MIke G,

                                                    sadly ur link to the train didn't work…….damm BBC…..

                                                    found it on……..Posative News.com……something unfortunatley the BEEB has forgotten all about…

                                                    remember Tomrrows World, Raymond Baxter….eh….

                                                    #509794
                                                    J Hancock
                                                    Participant
                                                      @jhancock95746

                                                      Living in an urn !

                                                      I distinctly remember Fred Dibnah's words, " They're not turning me into two-penneth of fag-ash "

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