Clock gear cutting needed or advice in setting up from scratch.

[mccormackclockrepairsParticipant @mccormackclockrepairs]

Hi all, just registered. I’ve an interest in Horology, basically anything with a gear train and a power source.

I was hoping you might be able to help me out . I’m in need of someone to cut clock gears when  the need arrises.  Or some info on buying lathes,indexing and milling tools/machinery. Long term plan is to set up to do my own. I want to do it on a budget but not bottom of the barrel either. I don’t imagine I’d be machining 5 days a week so that would be less wear on anything I may buy.

Has anyone tried the eastern lathes and indexer ? Would they be accurate enough for clock work?

Thanks for taking time to read this, I appreciate any feedback or suggestions, and if someone is allready doing this commercially I’d be interested in hearing from you.

 

Kind regards,

 

Dary.

[John HaineParticipant @johnhaine32865]

Lots of people here using Chinese lathes and mills with great success.  Accuracy requirements for clockmaking aren’t great anyway.

The biggest problem may be a good dividing head – most of the products available now at reasonable cost are based on rotary tables with chucks attached but I have doubts about their concentricity.  There’s a “workshop practice” series book on Dividing which probably has designs for devices you can make.

I would recommend that you don’t go for division plates in this day and age but get an electronic divider which drives the spindle using a stepper motor through a worm gear.  All the division ratios you could possibly want without the error-prone faff of working out which plate, hole circle, and how may turns and holes to move the detent.  Also either learn to make simple single-point cutters or budget for rather expensive horological cutters.

I have a Myford dividing head to which I have fitted a stepper motor and I use the “World of Ward” driver.  Works well but the Myford dividers are pricy unless you can find a second hand one.

If you want gears made there’s someone who advertises in the classifieds at the back of Horological Journal.

[BazyleParticipant @bazyle]

A mini lathe is perfectly adequate unless you want to make a 1:1 replica of Big Ben. Back 50 years ago there was a tiny lathe called the Elliott based on two half inch bars for the bed (that later got upgraded with a cast bed) which was about the smallest cheapest machine available to hobbyists yet ME magazine ran clock making series specifically on this to show that was all it needed.

For indexing you can get away with a large ply disc with marks round the edge stepped out with a pair of compasses though you can make a better system and counting holes etc is part of the fun. If you need a computer to do it for you maybe the whole thing is too much faff and you can just buy a quartz clock, or ask Elexa.

[mccormackclockrepairsParticipant @mccormackclockrepairs]

<p style=”text-align: center;”>Hi Bayzle, thanks for you reply..I don’t think I’ll be using Elexa any time soon. I’m traditionalist enough to appreciate the indexer approach but also intrigued enough by the electronic dividing system.</p>
Kind regards, Dary.

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

This is an excellent introduction to the subject:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Wheel-Pinion-Cutting-Horology-Historical/dp/1861262450

MichaelG.

[roy entwistleParticipant @royentwistle24699]

Dary    Where abouts in the world are you?

[mccormackclockrepairsParticipant @mccormackclockrepairs]

Hi Roy, I’m in Ireland.

[mccormackclockrepairsParticipant @mccormackclockrepairs]

Thanks Micheal looks interesting

[Clive SteerParticipant @clivesteer55943]

I second the World of Ward indexing controller as this has the capability to drive a second stepper motor to allow automatic gear cutting. However the high cost of multi tooth cutter such as those by Thorntons can be a problem. Many people now use a small CNC mill and specialist software to produce wheels.  This has a high initial investment but low ongoing costs plus the benefit of many other uses.

Clive S

[mccormackclockrepairsParticipant @mccormackclockrepairs]

Thanks Clive,   ..I’m gonna need to do a lot more research into this.

[Clive Steer]

On Clive Steer Said:

… However the high cost of multi tooth cutter such as those by Thorntons can be a problem…

 

I made a Eureka device for relieving home made gear and clock wheel cutters.  However, if I were starting now I would probably use the method advocated by the inspirational Clickspring.  This Youtube video and subsequent episodes describes the method he uses.

Highly recommended.

Rod

 

[mccormackclockrepairsParticipant @mccormackclockrepairs]

Thanks Rod, I love Clicksprings content,the actual process,film quality and narration it’s all very informative. His remaking of the Antikythera was amazing ,lots to learn from there.

[Marcus BowmanParticipant @marcusbowman28936]

I can thoroughly recommend this book:

Wheel and Pinion Cutting in Horology by Malcolm Wild, published by Crowood Press

https://www.crowood.com/collections/horology/products/wheel-pinion-cutting-in-horology-by-malcolm-wild

 

[DellParticipant @dell]

I restore antique torsion clocks and only made one pinion so plus 1 for world of ward controller, I have two rotary tables 1 4” & 1 2” & either can be used with the controller as it has more than one channel & it can also control a motorised X slide on the mill at the same time.

[mccormackclockrepairsParticipant @mccormackclockrepairs]

<p style=”text-align: center;”>Thanks Marcus,I’ve ordered this, been recommended by M.Gilligan,looks like a good place to start.</p>

[BazyleParticipant @bazyle]

If someone hasn’t even got a lathe it is a bit early to be worrying about esoteric electronic aids.
Lets start again.
It gets a little confusing but two of the big names in the recent past in amateur clockmaking are J.M.Wild and J. Wilding. The latter wrote a lot of books starting simple and building up also writing in ME and then went back to the beginners with a simple egg timer. Good way to build skills.

https://www.model-engineer.co.uk/forums/topic/beginners-first-simple-clock-kit-plans/

Another route to building skills is to buy a ‘junk’ clock off ebay and use its wheels in a new frame.

[Roger HartParticipant @rogerhart88496]

Brilliant,  you learn something new every day on this site. Fascinating the Clickspring device and the idea of using CNC type control rather than division plates.

I have made a few brass wheels by the divider plate/flycutter technique. Works quite well and cheap to do. The only snag comes when you break the tip off your flycutter halfway round the second pass. After a few bad words and filing/grinding/polishing/tempering a new one and a lot of patience you are back in business.

I did try my hand at clock restoration and I found the amount of effort, time and what passes for skill seemed out of proportion to the rewards – and I don’t like the smell of Brasso. So I gave that up. Other people may have a different experience.

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