Calling all Little John and other Raglan users

[David SeniorParticipant @davidsenior29320]

I’m doing a little research into Raglan machines. Specifically I am trying to narrow down the dates and numbers of each type of machine that Raglan produced.

If anyone has (or has access to) any of the lathes or milling machines I would be grateful if you can let me know what machine it is (Little John Mk1, LJ Mk2, 5″ (or capstan versions), Loughborough or milling machine), the serial number if available (on the lathes it is normally stamped on top of the last cross beam between the shears at the tailstock end, though I am not sure whether the Loughborough has a number), and if you have any indication of the date of manufacture.

We have quite a few already logged on the Raglan forum  https://raglanmachinetools.freeforums.net/ . The earliest Mk1 listed is No. 192 (though I have heard of No. 159) and the latest is No. 752. For the Mk2 the earliest we have is No. 959 and the latest is No. 3787. For the 5″ the earliest we have is No. 4194 and the last is No. 5779. Any serial numbers outside of those ranges would be especially useful, but all numbers will help to understand how many still survive.

If anyone has any original Raglan paperwork (letters, invoices, test certificates) especially if they have dates on them, I would be very interested to hear, either by replying to this topic, sending me a PM, or joining the Raglan forum and posting there.

Thanks

Dave Senior

[Howard LewisParticipant @howardlewis46836]

FWIW

The WaterWorks Museun has a Loughborough.  It is a pleasant little machine to use On the rare times that I visit, I prefer to use it rather than the bigger and more sophisticated Colchester)

A 5″ Raglan that was used in war work has been passed through a friend’s family and probably now sees little use. Since there a choice had to be made between a Top Slide and a four way toolpost, I made a rather skinny 4 way toolpost, for the Top Slide, so that short tapers could be cut.

Howard

[David SeniorParticipant @davidsenior29320]

Thanks Howard

I also have access to a Loughborough but have never been able to find a serial number so there is probably little to be gained from asking you to to look next time you visit.

The war work reference to the 5″ is strange – they probably only started in the 60s.

Has anyone else got access to a Raglan product (or any Raglan literature)?

Dave

[Howard LewisParticipant @howardlewis46836]

David,

It might be some time before my next visit. I live 142 miles away, and the next visit might be to hand over a Worden cutter grinder; once the kit has been completed.

I’ll ask if a serial number is visible on the 5″, if the owner can be told where to look!

Howard

[David SeniorParticipant @davidsenior29320]

The serial number is stamped on the bed casting at the tailstock end – on the last cross beam

[Mark EasingwoodParticipant @markeasingwood33578]

I have a worn/abused LJ Mk 11, gearbox version, serial number 3845.

There is a second number on the tailstock end, hidden under the support bracket, as below.

The lathe has some other oddities/repairs, the change wheels are 14dp, not the usual 16dp. the quadrant for change wheel is machined from a solid piece of Aluminium, the “ABC” selecter is a fabricated non-standard item. The lathe is quite worn, lots of backlash in crosslide nut, crosslide much looser in middle of travel, tailstock loose towards headstock, tight at tailstock end, etc.

I think it is probably a late model, hence the 14dp change wheels as used on the 5 inch model??

It was probably sourced from a school/college.

Mark.

[David SeniorParticipant @davidsenior29320]

Thanks Mark, that is really useful information. It is the latest Mk2 on the current list, and does look as though it might be a ‘cross-over’ before the 5″ production started. Perhaps they were using up left-over Mk2 bits but having to make do with what was around for some parts.

Any chance you can register on the Raglan forum and we can get more information from you?

Dave

[bernard towersParticipant @bernardtowers37738]

I have registered on the forum but cant find anything about mills?

[David SeniorParticipant @davidsenior29320]

Hi Bernard

Thanks for registering. It’s always good to find more Raglan mill devotees.

There is a (short) list of serial numbers in the ‘Raglan Lathe & Milling Machine’ section, and a specific section further down ‘Raglan Milling Machine’

They are a fairly unusual machine but with a dedicated following. You will find other users on the forum. Try telling us about yourself in the ‘Announce Yourself’ section.

Dave

[Howard LewisParticipant @howardlewis46836]

I’ve asked if my friend’s son can tell the Serial Number of his 5″

Howard

[David SeniorParticipant @davidsenior29320]

Thanks Howard. That is much appreciated.

Dave

[Mark EasingwoodParticipant @markeasingwood33578]

David,

I registered on the forum a few years back, is their anything specific you would like to know?

Mark.

[David SeniorParticipant @davidsenior29320]

Mark

probably just some photos of those unusual details that you mentioned (the gear train area), just to build up a picture of any variations that are around.

Dave

[Howard LewisParticipant @howardlewis46836]

T here might be two versions of the gearbox set ups on the 5″

But it is possible to set up changewheels and gearbox to obtain a fine feed.

Howard

[David SeniorParticipant @davidsenior29320]

Howard

As far as I am aware there are just the Norton-style QCGB version and the non-gearbox (change wheel) versions of the 5″. Both of them use a leadscrew for threading and a separate feed shaft for fine feeds (both along and across)

Dave

[Mark EasingwoodParticipant @markeasingwood33578]

David,

I have created a gallery HERE with some photo’s which may be of interest to you, feel free to copy/use them as you want. I can send you them by pm, if required.

I forgot to say that the top of the, (removable) ways have been re-ground, and the height adjusted by using full length shims under the ways. I bought it around 35 years ago, but then it was effectively, “in storage” until a few years back. I always thought the top of the ways looked, “too new”, it was only when I stripped it down, to clean it that I realised why!

There was no internet when I bought it, so I had no source of information as to how it should be!

I am missing a couple of change wheels, including the 20 tooth for a fine feed, the 14 dp ones never seem to come up for sale on ebay etc, unlike the 16 dp ones.

Mark

 

 

[David SeniorParticipant @davidsenior29320]

Thanks Mark, the pictures are very useful as a reference. The change wheel set-up is completely different to my Mk2. I haven’t got any photos of the 5″ set-up to hand (I have stripped them all off my 5″ and fitted an ELS) but the forward/reverse mechanism looks the same as that. A very mixed bag. The fabricated ABC lever is so visually crude it is hard to imagine it came out of the factory like that.

Dave

[aarknoidParticipant @aarknoid]

Hello, just registered to report a Raglan 5″ in Burlington, Ontario with serial no. 4130 and was fitted with L00 chuck adapter and the tachometer

[bernard towersParticipant @bernardtowers37738]

Have you tried the raglan machine tools forum

[David SeniorParticipant @davidsenior29320]

Looks good. It’s unusual to see one with the L00 spindle and the tacho. We are aware of one other with that spindle (also in Canada). I’d be interested to know how the tacho is driven.

I’ve added you to the database on the Raglan forum (I see you registered there a couple of days ago)

Yours is the earliest 5″ that is on the register!

Dave

[bernard towers]

On bernard towers Said:

I have registered on the forum but cant find anything about mills?

The Raglan mill is a delightful little machine.  A bit limited in size but makes up with the operation.  I won’t be parting with mine.

Questions? Just ask away, on the forum.  They almost always get answered.

[Oily RagParticipant @oilyrag]

Raglans are the most underatted and overlooked lathes of all the home grown machines. They are robust yet quirky in their own way. I have 3 MkII LJ’s plus a Loughborough (in process of refurbishment!) and with a little care and attention make very ‘useable’ machines. The original finish was superb with filled castings and incredible paintwork which stands the test of time.

I bought the Loughborough as it was equiped with a capstan – I have used this on one of the Mk II’s for volume production of special screws and nuts, but intend for it to go back onto the Loughborough when the refurb is finished. The Mk II’s I have are 2 Change Gear models (16DP change gears) and a QCGB model (14DP drop gears). I too have had shears reground and shimmed to renovate one of the Mk II’s and also picked up a pair of brand new shears from Myfords when they were disposing of their Raglan spares. I managed to also pick up sets of unmachined taper turning attachment castings which I finished one set off after borrowing a TTA off my brother (who also owns a Mk II – as you may guess the affection for Raglans runs in the family!). One delightful accesory is the capstan tailstock which I believe was an intended option for the late 5″ although I have never seen another one. This may have been a prototype as it was missing some small parts and came out of Myfords old stock.

For any aspiring new owners of these machines you need to be aware of their short comings; number one on the list is bent spindles, usually due to training school abuse, so look out for toolpost / chuck crashes. It is not an insurmountable problem as spindles can be straightened (not in the machine though – as the headstock bearings are virtually irreplaceable [Timken high precision taper rollers]). Number two on the list is the tendency for the idler drop gear mounted on the back gear eccentric shaft to seize and as a result engage the back gear. The damage resulting from this is usually a tooth being stripped off the back gear! This is repairable with a dovetailed insert and recutting the gear profile, the eccentric shaft is best replaced with a new item (fairly easy to make – I made mine in EN40b and had it nitrided) the other worthwhile modification is to bush the idler gear with a leaded bronze bush and give it the occasional dollop of AFB.

I will return to this thread with details of my serial numbers and the dates of my machines.

Martin

[Howard LewisParticipant @howardlewis46836]

The 5″ with which I was in contact was in a basement and used to produce small, parts for war work.

(Sorry, have had no feedback as to the Serial no.)

It a gearbox type, with power feeds for both Saddle and Cross Slide.

By suitable choice of changewheels, and gearbox settings, it was possible to set up a fine feed.

Since there was a choice between the 4 way toolpost, or a Top Slide,(You could have one or the other)  I made a rather thin 4 way toolpost for the Top Slide.

It also has a taper Turning Attachment, although my friend, and now his son, have never used it.

It is a long time since I saw it, but think that there may have been a collet attachment and collets, as well.

I’ll try to remember to ask again about the serial number

Howard

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