Beginners lathe

[Richard S2Participant @richards2]

I have no experience of the variety and quality of small plain Lathes, only to say that I was in your position (Brian and others) with zero knowledge or experience way back in 1984. There was a similar variety of machines around at the time and the decision/choice is no different now. All I could do is find a machine that will allow me to learn and at least enable me to start a project.

I chose the Peatol and progressively acquired all the extras, also using a 1/4hp motor via a reduction counter shaft. I also obtained spares including Feed nuts and a spare Spindle and Bearings.

I still have it and it has coped easily with 4inch dia Alloy Minnie 1" scale front Wheel Castings (no Headstock Raising Block), Rear Hubs and all of the Crankshaft to name but a few parts. I love it for it's precision, feel and portability. I never expected to do any Screw Cutting. Yes, the Hand Wheels are small, but my machine still gives me less than 0.002" back lash on all H/Wheels. It is still turning parallel over 5 inches+ (125 mm-ish). Not shimmed yet, but the Tailstock lever feed is beginning to tire.

I also have a tired old ML7 which I nurse to produce acceptable results, but for small jobs, I turn to the 'Diddy one'

As said, what ever you do, don't pass up the opportunities this hobby affords you and enjoy whichever machine you obtain.

Regards

[Brian NormanParticipant @briannorman50523]

After reading all your comments since my last post I have to say that I am feeling a lot happier. I know a bigger lathe will be better but when the time comes if it has to be my original idea then I will go that route. Seeing what other people have produced with their small lathes has given me confidence to know that if I can do a fraction it will give me hours of fun, and that is what it's all about.

Ketan, it's a shame that your company is to stop supplying the C0, I understand why but there must be people who would be buying it for the right reasons, including me, and it is about £100 cheaper with an adjustable tail stock than your competitor.

Anyway, thank you all for your kind help, I will let you know which one I eventually get.

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by Brian Norman on 19/01/2017 21:29:45:

… Seeing what other people have produced with their small lathes has given me confidence to know that if I can do a fraction it will give me hours of fun, and that is what it's all about.

.

Good analysis & the right answer, Brian

MichaelG.

[Brian NormanParticipant @briannorman50523]

Hi again, on a lighter note, I posted on our ex pat forum that I was looking for a lathe and I had a reply from someone about 10 miles away. He has a Myford Super 7 with stand and gearbox, milling machine and lots of tooling for sale. If only! I wonder if he is aware of the value of his equipment!

[AjohnwParticipant @ajohnw51620]

Posted by Ketan Swali on 19/01/2017 20:13:08:

Posted by Ajohnw on 19/01/2017 19:30:33:

Anyway he bought a baby lathe – same as C0 only different make that looks a little different but was essentially the same. He then went rather quiet for some time. About 6 months later he came up and said he had no idea what it was suitable for – maybe turning plastics.

Edited By Ajohnw on 19/01/2017 19:32:19

Hey John,

Sorry but you are wrong. Your comments are a little offensive. Unlike you, the competitor and Trustpilot, I do know more about the C0 than you. Your comments simply prove my point about your friend – a beginner – without help, support or knowledge or expectations! Perhaps you should re-read my post… on second thoughts..forget it..

Ketan at ARC.

I know Ketan. That's why I asked if the OP had any experience. On the other hand the person I mentioned was a more than usually well qualified graduate electronics engineer so his problems were not down to lack of intelligence just a complete and utter unawareness of what a lathe of that size, power and weight can be expected to do.

John

–

[Ketan SwaliParticipant @ketanswali79440]

Posted by Ajohnw on 19/01/2017 22:14:24:

Posted by Ketan Swali on 19/01/2017 20:13:08:

Posted by Ajohnw on 19/01/2017 19:30:33:

Anyway he bought a baby lathe – same as C0 only different make that looks a little different but was essentially the same. He then went rather quiet for some time. About 6 months later he came up and said he had no idea what it was suitable for – maybe turning plastics.

Edited By Ajohnw on 19/01/2017 19:32:19

Hey John,

Sorry but you are wrong. Your comments are a little offensive. Unlike you, the competitor and Trustpilot, I do know more about the C0 than you. Your comments simply prove my point about your friend – a beginner – without help, support or knowledge or expectations! Perhaps you should re-read my post… on second thoughts..forget it..

Ketan at ARC.

I know Ketan. That's why I asked if the OP had any experience. On the other hand the person I mentioned was a more than usually well qualified graduate electronics engineer so his problems were not down to lack of intelligence just a complete and utter unawareness of what a lathe of that size, power and weight can be expected to do.

John

–

Okay I understand John. Your opening post about it being only suitable for turning plastic was open to misinterpretation.

Ketan at ARC

[David ColwillParticipant @davidcolwill19261]

I own a peatol which I bought new. It doesn't get used often but can be jolly useful if used within its capabilities. It is more than accurate for my needs and did not require anything by way of fettling as bought. One point which should be considered if buying any small lathe is that they are small and quite fiddly to use. It is a bit like saying you can't afford a full size Ferrari so you will get one half size. Great but not the driving experience that you were after!

The C3 lathes are more robust and more ergonomic than their smaller cousins and not so much more expensive. They probably outsell any other hobby lathe by at least 2 to 1 (Ketan may question / confirm this as it is just a guess). There is loads of information out there on all aspects of them from correcting faults to souping them up beyond all recognition. Spares and accessories are readily available and will be for some time to come.

I would be inclined to move up to the C3 size. Everybody knows what they are and if you need to you could sell it and not lose too much money.

Just my thoughts.

Regards.

David.

[Ady1Participant @ady1]

I started off with a Unimat SL because I knew zip and they can be sent in the post if you buy one

After a couple of months it spurred my ambition for something bigger

Those "toy" sized lathes definitely serve a useful purpose, teaching you the basics and introducing you to oil and swarf in your flesh

[Ian S CParticipant @iansc]

I would say that the C0 in the right hands would be more capable than my door stop(Super Adept), but here is the Adept taking a .010" cut off a piece of 304(I think) stainless steel.

Ian S C

[Paul H 1Participant @paulh1]

Hi Brian,

I am not going to suggest a lathe other than if you can push the budget a bit you will really get more for your money by careful buying. I want to mention some practicalities of you being in Spain. As you are finding the mainland European suppliers are a lot more expensive than UK. I went through the same process (I live in France) and bought from the UK. UK suppliers are quite happy to export in general I found. What you have to think about are delivery costs as well as purchase price. There are some suppliers like Machinemart who I believe don't export but have been suggested. Don't despair there is a solution.

Check what and if the supplier will charge to send the lathe to you. Look on Angloinfo.com in your region for who does transport to your area. There are always trucks going back and forward to the UK who will add a small load to their total, particularly if they are moving Brits back to UK (this long predates Brexit by the way) so probably want a bit more load on the Spain bound run. You can look in the Directory in the Classifieds or post a wanted. Often a UK supplier will deliver free to the movers depot.

Another service that exists is Anyvan.com that matches jobs to trucks, vans etc going your way and you will get several bids in general. I have used this and it worked great for something big and very breakable. Bidders will pick up from the supplier if you specify.

This also opens up your options to used machines if you wish. Remember also using your UK credit card to buy your new machine from the UK still gives you protection even though you live in Spain.

When you have your machine, tooling up is easy as the UK suppliers who are often discussed on this site have very good services.

Wishing you happy machining,

Paul

[Ketan SwaliParticipant @ketanswali79440]

Hi Paul H1,

I understand where you are coming from with regards to collection.

ARC does not allow such collections for shipment to overseas countries, due to a different can of worms it opens, relating to various insurance liabilities in terms of who is responsible for claims of damage or loss for example, or potential fraud. We only ship through our carriers. About twice a year we deal with total write-offs of machines in transit. Here is an example of a shipment sent through Fedex last week to France.:

We are shipping a replacement to the customer on Monday.

If Brian takes the risk with a supplier who is prepared to allow collection of a large size machine, that is something he may wish to consider.

Similar, but not so drastic events took place – twice – with Brian John – Australia when he purchased C0 originally from AUSEE in Melbourne. The shipments were made through reputable carriers, but still received damaged. AUSEE honoured the claim and refunded so that Brian John could purchase a different machine from elsewhere.

If Brian from Spain decides to buy a C0 from who so ever, carriage to him is not so expensive. With current packing – moulded polystyrene and then in a cardboard box, the gross weight is around 16 to 18 kgs. Current handling and carriage to Spain from ARC for weights above 1kg to just under 30kg are £21.00 including VAT, for goods shipped through DPD courier. In our opinion, that is reasonable, and the transit risk is ours.

Ketan at ARC.

[AjohnwParticipant @ajohnw51620]

There is world of difference between some one who knows what they are doing and some one that doesn't Ian.

From what I can gather the frustrations come as the size goes up and the cut size has to go down and cut size expectation can fall short at what many might think is way too soon anyway. Not realising how much space the 2 chucks and a drill can take up is another. Unsuitable cutting tools probably crops up. That's extremely likely if lots of material needs to be removed.

To be honest though I think China is too locked into a certain style of hobby lathe. Maybe it suits some sizes. It's a common problem with all sorts of things at times. The baby lathes to me looked too much low price targeted and I suspect better could be done for similar costs. Always hard to be sure about that though due to margins at both ends and manufacturing process costs. How many they actually make too.

John

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[Brian NormanParticipant @briannorman50523]

Hi Ketan, if you remember I sent you a email a few days ago asking about the weight of the C0 lathe and you confirmed the cost to deliver to Spain which I thought was very reasonable.

Paul, if I do go for a larger lathe I have already been thinking along your lines. At the other end of our village lives a Scotsman with his own lorry and business carrying goods between Spain and the UK once a month, he moved us out here 10 years ago. He also has a depot in the UK where goods can be sent for him to collect. He is completely legal and insured and is used by a great many people out here.

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

Posted by David Colwill on 20/01/2017 09:04:35:

The C3 lathes are more robust and more ergonomic than their smaller cousins and not so much more expensive. They probably outsell any other hobby lathe by at least 2 to 1 (Ketan may question / confirm this as it is just a guess). There is loads of information out there on all aspects of them from correcting faults to souping them up beyond all recognition. Spares and accessories are readily available and will be for some time to come

I would be be very surprised if the C2/C3 pattern mini lathes now outnumber any other pattern of lathe across the planet. Whatever you think of them they have enabled thousands of people to add metal turning to their workshop repertoire.

I don't know if SEIG would give Ketan a figure for their production (which would not include other manufacturers like Real Bull).

This is interesting too!

Neil

[MWParticipant @mw27036]

Posted by Neil Wyatt on 20/01/2017 16:17:55:

This is interesting too!

Neil

Notice they have some of their chinese apprentices posing for a photograph, I would imagine it would be pretty cool to work for an outfit that makes such a large variety of machine tools for the hobby market. I'm sure they're pretty proud about it.

MW

[Ketan SwaliParticipant @ketanswali79440]

Posted by Neil Wyatt on 20/01/2017 16:17:55:

Posted by David Colwill on 20/01/2017 09:04:35:

The C3 lathes are more robust and more ergonomic than their smaller cousins and not so much more expensive. They probably outsell any other hobby lathe by at least 2 to 1 (Ketan may question / confirm this as it is just a guess). There is loads of information out there on all aspects of them from correcting faults to souping them up beyond all recognition. Spares and accessories are readily available and will be for some time to come

I would be be very surprised if the C2/C3 pattern mini lathes now outnumber any other pattern of lathe across the planet. Whatever you think of them they have enabled thousands of people to add metal turning to their workshop repertoire.

I don't know if SEIG would give Ketan a figure for their production (which would not include other manufacturers like Real Bull).

This is interesting too!

Neil

To the best of my knowledge, the C2/C3 pattern mini lathes do outnumber any other pattern of lathe across the planet, and we do sell more of them than the C0 . Almost anywhere in the world people know what a mini-lathe and mini-mill are… and then some go to latch on and describe a smaller or bigger machine as a 'mini-lathe/mill' to describe a totally different pattern of machine, to attract attention. One can probably buy spares for a mini-lathe anywhere in the world. The popularity is mainly down to Harbor Freight in the USA, who are historically and originally the biggest and most powerful buyer of the mini-lathe/mill pattern.

SIEG would give me production figures, but I would need to obtain their permission to release them.

Ketan at ARC.

Edited to correct spelling..

Edited By Ketan Swali on 20/01/2017 16:51:05

[Ketan SwaliParticipant @ketanswali79440]

Posted by Michael-w on 20/01/2017 16:23:39:

Posted by Neil Wyatt on 20/01/2017 16:17:55:

This is interesting too!

Neil

Notice they have some of their chinese apprentices posing for a photograph, I would imagine it would be pretty cool to work for an outfit that makes such a large variety of machine tools for the hobby market. I'm sure they're pretty proud about it.

MW

If you are talking about the slider picture near the top, – picture no.6, that is mainly the local sales and PR team when they were exhibiting at a kind of 'MAKER' show in Shanghai. The guy in the middle in the navyblue jacket is the man who originally started off the SIEG Group..as well as the mini-lathe/mill story… before anyone else did in China.

Yes, it is cool for the workers who work for them… and they have good days and bad days too.

Ketan at ARC.

[Bob JeppParticipant @bobjepp]

Lets get back to the topic !

Many years ago ( I'd hazard a guess at 35 years ), I bought a Toyo ML210 micro-lathe – it's very similar to the C0 machine in many respects except for one major point – its Japanese. I used the machine for many years making lots of small parts for a Tich, a 2' scale Clayton Steam Lorry and a plethora of other items and, I can say that the engineering of the machine was typically Japanese ( very high quality ).

A couple of years ago I decided that I needed some additional tooling for the machine, but due to the fact it has been out of production for many years, I couldn't find what I needed. I decided to buy a new small lathe and having visited both Arc and Axminster, decided on the Axminster C0 ( I liked the colour ).

On a previous forum post, I commented on the engineering standards of the Axminster C0 – it was dreadful – I didn't need another project, so I returned it and got my money back ( I didn't even get to cutting metal ).

I've since bought a new Cowells ME90 – I spent some time talking to Colin Childs at Cowells – he said all the right things about the quality standards he works to, and I am so impressed with the machine.

So :-

Toyo – was about £60 when I bought it – really good value for money – still got it, still works well,

Axminster C0 – enough said, got my money back on it,

Cowells, fantastic machine, but it should be at just over £3000.

Why the Cowells, well, apart from the quality, it has back gear, a full screwcutting capability and a common design M14 threaded spindle nose. I have one criticism – the MT0 headstock and tailstock tapers – very difficult to get tooling to fit this unless you go back to Cowells.

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

Posted by Bob Jepp on 20/01/2017 18:11:23:

Axminster C0 – enough said, got my money back on it,

Cowells, fantastic machine, but it should be at just over £3000.

For those who aren't familiar with the C0, it's worth pointing out that it currently sells for about 1/10 the price of the Cowells, which might put the differences in perspective.

Neil

[Steven Tao 2Participant @steventao2]

Posted by Neil Wyatt on 20/01/2017 16:17:55:

Posted by David Colwill on 20/01/2017 09:04:35:

The C3 lathes are more robust and more ergonomic than their smaller cousins and not so much more expensive. They probably outsell any other hobby lathe by at least 2 to 1 (Ketan may question / confirm this as it is just a guess). There is loads of information out there on all aspects of them from correcting faults to souping them up beyond all recognition. Spares and accessories are readily available and will be for some time to come

I would be be very surprised if the C2/C3 pattern mini lathes now outnumber any other pattern of lathe across the planet. Whatever you think of them they have enabled thousands of people to add metal turning to their workshop repertoire.

I don't know if SEIG would give Ketan a figure for their production (which would not include other manufacturers like Real Bull).

This is interesting too!

Neil

Hello Neil,

In the link you mentioned, there is a slider at top of page. Picture 6 shows Mr.Shao – the gentleman in dark blue jacket, along with SIEG staff.

Mr.Shao is founder of SIEG Group. Production of mini-lathe started in 1993, and up to now the total production from SIEG factory is 200,000pcs. Last year, SIEG produced 12,000pcs. mini-lathe.

Just like Arc, we sell more mini-lathe than C0.

Steven at AUSEE

[Brandon santiduParticipant @brandonsantidu97230]

I am in the same dilemma with the topic starter. I want to buy my own lathe so I don't have to always go to my friend and do the work there. In my search, I have come across a couple of reviews, but I'm more confused even now. So I decided to join here to ask your help.

Can anyone tell me which metal lathe is the best one to buy in this review?thank you.

This Review – .jenreviews.com/best-metal-lathe/

<edited by moderator to remove live link>

Edited By Neil Wyatt on 22/01/2017 09:22:58

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

Hello Brandon,

I would ignore that site, every review seems to be written to a semi-automated template (They have clearly entered 'best metal lathe' as 'product name&#39. It only shows an interest in wildly different machines from just two suppliers. There are a few nuggets of value along the lines of 'we had to fix the best metal lathe after every project'.

Perhaps if you let us know what lathe your friend has and whetehr you would like something bigger/smaller or with any particular features?

Neil

[Brian NormanParticipant @briannorman50523]

Hi all,

Just to let you all know what has transpired since my last post. I had almost decided on the Taig/Peatol lathe mainly because there is so much info and help available for this lathe on the Internet. When I obtained latest prices from Peatol I was surprised that the lathe had increased by approx 20% and the accessories I checked on between 5% and 10%. When I add the extras to be able to compare like for like with the Warco mini lathe the Peatol comes out more expensive and I also have to assembly it!! The only benefit I can see in buying the Peatol now is the portability which may not be the problem I first thought it was. I would like to hear your comments.

Brian

[richardandtracyParticipant @richardandtracy]

What can I say? When I was in your position, I got a Warco not a Peatol/Taig… I have done a great deal or work on my Warco, and at no point have I felt that the lathe has let me down. It's always me that's the weak link in the chain.

If you are going to have a workshop of any sort, I think there is no need to put much emphasis on portability. Only rate this need highly if you are going to have to use an office/dining room/kitchen and pack everything away afterwards.

Regards,

Richard.

[Brian NormanParticipant @briannorman50523]

Thanks Richard, it will be set up permanently when installed, the portability I was referring to was getting it from the UK to Spain.

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