Aircraft General Discussion

[KWILParticipant @kwil]

Why is it with "modern" TV programme makers that they must have mood music that masks the real music of a Merlin engine (or 4)??

[Sue HutchingsParticipant @suehutchings99787]

Posted by KWIL on 01/11/2018 12:16:03:

Why is it with "modern" TV programme makers that they must have mood music that masks the real music of a Merlin engine (or 4)??

Couldn't agree more, and it's not just Merlins that get drowned out!

Brian

[martin perman 1Participant @martinperman1]

Posted by Neil Wyatt on 31/10/2018 18:16:45:

Apologies to twitter haters but I'm not going to upload and type this all twice

Neil

It must be #Halloween because I saw a #Vampire today! I was at Brandon Marsh near Coventry when I heard a #jet making an odd whistling sound approaching. I though that sounds like an old one… long nose so a two-seat trainer version. #aircraft #planespotting pic.twitter.com/MU6vmaGZM2

— Model Engineer (@ModelEngineers) October 31, 2018

Gentlemen,

I don't do social media so I have no idea why the # sign is in front of only a few words will somebody please explain as I haven't a clue.

Martin P

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

Posted by martin perman on 01/11/2018 18:48:28:

Gentlemen,

I don't do social media so I have no idea why the # sign is in front of only a few words will somebody please explain as I haven't a clue.

Martin P

Hashtags.

You use them to highlight useful or currently meaningful search terms.

Neil

[charadamParticipant @charadam]

Neil:

"Coolest bike I ever saw was matt black BIG and almost inaudible, as it came into a roundabout I could hear the chain clicking and it barely grumbled as it ripped out of the turn."

Must have been a Vincent – couldn't have been a Harley Davidson, as the loudest thing you hear from them is the marketing machine in the background.

[CirclipParticipant @circlip]

Although Vinnies were not particularly noisy, they are louder than the BMW R69. Was once standing at the side of one when the owner kick-started it, (starter pedal came out sideways). Thought that he'd need to try again but he mounted it and rode away.

And yes, nothing like the sound of seven Merlins in close formation.

Regards Ian

[Ian S CParticipant @iansc]

I used to think that half a dozen or so DH Goblins didn't sound too bad(Vampires), But yes A Merlin, climbing out of Dunedin airport at 8am on a cold frosty morning, the sound echoing around the hills was hard to beat. Or tghis one at a local fly in.

Ian S C

[Ian S CParticipant @iansc]

It's on it's way, the fusilage is off the moulds! DZ 542 ex NZ2308 DH 98 Mosquito B IV for The Pathfinder Trust (John Romain) at Duxford will get it after it is completed, and test flown in New Zealand, there is a good while yet, but you will hear twin Merlins around Cambridge (no photos yet).

Ian S C

[martin perman 1Participant @martinperman1]

I looked to the sky this afternoon expecting to see a twin engined classic German bomber only to see a twin engined private aircraft with its engines out of sync, much disappointment I must say.

Martin P

[JC54Participant @jc54]

I went to Autojumble at Newark (UK) yesterday. At one stall there was a Rolls Royce Merlin engine on a stand. It was run up several times during the day but only for short runs due to not having a prop fitted. I wonder how many people asked the owner what he wanted for it…

[RevStewParticipant @revstew]

One of the reasons I stopped going to airshows. Always some utter git on the PA system, with nothing to say, and saying it too loudly.

If you want to know about the aeroplane, write it's name on the back of your hand, and go home and look it up. In a book.

[robjon44Participant @robjon44]

Hi all, sightings a bit sparse now display season over however yesterday I saw no less than 3 Apache attack helicopters in line astern along a nearby helicopter corridor, better than a poke in the eye with a sharp stick, so that's my quota for today I thought, lo & behold later in the early evening full dark heard a loud roar, just managed to get to an upstairs window without falling out & caught a fast receding Hercules very low sporting more flashing lights than Blackpool!

Bob H.

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

Posted by charadam on 01/11/2018 20:16:03:

Neil:

"Coolest bike I ever saw was matt black BIG and almost inaudible, as it came into a roundabout I could hear the chain clicking and it barely grumbled as it ripped out of the turn."

Must have been a Vincent – couldn't have been a Harley Davidson, as the loudest thing you hear from them is the marketing machine in the background.

Ha , I suspect it was a modern 4-cylinder water cooled machine. Harleys don't rip and Vincents only rip in straight lines (according to my Dad, who should know…)

[Cornish JackParticipant @cornishjack]

"Vincents only rip in straight lines (according to my Dad, who should know…"

My (long-since) late Dad would have agreed!!

He overslept one morning and missed the only bus – once-a-day country-style service. The mechanic in the garage opposite noticed the problem and offered to provide a 'catch-up' service … with his Black Shadow!! Dad duly embarked on the pillion and (clutching his trilby tightly) set off in pursuit! About 2 miles was sufficient (in both senses!) Bearing in mind Dad's military background , India, fighting up through Italy etc., his view of the experience was gratitude that it was so short!!

rgds

Bill

[Richard S2Participant @richards2]

Quick check of the posts here showed this item not mentioned yet?. So I though those who may be interested would like to know about it- Flt Lt Gunn's Spit

BBC4 2100 Local in UK is supposed to have a piece on it.

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Just looked at the initial Air Accident Report for the Leicester City helicopter crash:

**LINK**

https://www.leicestermercury.co.uk/news/leicester-news/article2299140.ece/BINARY/AAIB%20Dec%206%20crash%20report.pdf

Very well documented and illustrated.

MichaelG.

[Cornish JackParticipant @cornishjack]

An interesting read for the tech input. Unfortunately, the main problem was 'the holes in the cheese lined up'. The take-off had been made as a 'towering slow back up' which put it in an unrecoverable position for a tail rotor failure. The loss of T/R authority is quite manageable in low/medium power forward flight, if necessary going the autorotation route, but the Leicester scenario was never going to be recoverable.

Actual incident some years ago – Whirlwind 10 inbound from training to Valley.

Instructor -" Bloggs, get the ^&%* ball in the middle"

Stude – "I'm trying, Sir!"

Instructor – "Yes, I know you are but get the ball in the middle."

Stude – "I've got full pedal on , Sir and it's still slippingt!"

Instructor – "Ah, yes Bloggs, so I see. I have control, stand by for auto!"

Autorotation was duly completed into a nearby farmyard, which was noted (too late) as being well covered in slurry! Pulling in collective generated some 'interesting' gyrations!

rgds

Bill

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Thanks for the expert input, Bill

I find the machinery fascinating, but know next to nothing about piloting.

MichaelG.

[Anonymous]

Posted by Michael Gilligan on 07/12/2018 09:28:02:

Very well documented and illustrated.

As one would expect. It's a summary of the what, the question now is when, how and why, given the helicopter had already made several flights on the day. And were there any other factors involved.

Back in the 1970s, when I started at RAE Farnborough I got a personal tour of the AAIB facility, as my father knew a number of people there due to his group at RAE Bedford consulting on a number of helicopter and auto gyro accidents. Two piles of wreckage in the hangar remain with me. One, a Jaguar that hit a hill at 400 knots, nothing left that was bigger than a fist. Two, a Skylark (wooden glider) that had been struck by lightning in cloud. Most of the wood had exploded as the water turned to flash steam, but I remember the steel control cables being melted and the ends fused into a ball. Sadly the pilot didn't survive, but hit the ground with his parachute intact but unopened.

Andrew

Edited By Andrew Johnston on 07/12/2018 14:52:43

[martin perman 1Participant @martinperman1]

In the 90's I organised a visit to the AAIB for an aviation society I belonged to and I found it totally fascinating, they had a trainer that had flat spun into the ground killing the instructor and pupil, they found nothing wrong with the aircraft but found the pupil had severe fore arm bruising where the instructor had tried to get the pupil to let go of the controls.

I have a part time job delivering medication for a local chemist Bedford and this afternoon a military Puma helicopter came fast and low over me, performed a wing over to face back the way he came and dropped to the ground behind some houses, I could here the engines still running and after a minute or two made a low fast departure below the houses.

Martin P

[Jon LawesParticipant @jonlawes51698]

I used to be the manager of the Accident Data Recorder Services dept. at Boscombe Down. They have a large collection of the different types of recorders that have been used over the years (some looking very second hand indeed!), including some that even recorded onto wire as it was more resistant to heat than traditional tape.

Most interesting to me was an accident data recorder that had been recovered from deep ocean water. The individual transistors on the circuit boards had been crushed like recycled cans by the depth/pressure. When they recover the recorders from water they try to keep them wet as the salt crystals only start to form once it has dried out.

[Anonymous]

Posted by Jon Lawes on 07/12/2018 18:08:19:

I used to be the manager of the Accident Data Recorder Services dept. at Boscombe Down. They have a large collection of the different types of recorders that have been used over the years (some looking very second hand indeed!), including some that even recorded onto wire as it was more resistant to heat than traditional tape.

That's interesting, I worked at Boscombe Down, on the MRCA, for a short period as part of my thick sandwich course with MoD. That would have been the summer of 1979 I think.

I had it in my mind that the original recorders used wire, but changed to mag tape as the number of parameters increased.

Andrew

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

Posted by Andrew Johnston on 07/12/2018 14:52:02:

Back in the 1970s, when I started at RAE Farnborough I got a personal tour of the AAIB facility, as my father knew a number of people there due to his group at RAE Bedford consulting on a number of helicopter and auto gyro accidents. Two piles of wreckage in the hangar remain with me. One, a Jaguar that hit a hill at 400 knots, nothing left that was bigger than a fist. Two, a Skylark (wooden glider) that had been struck by lightning in cloud. Most of the wood had exploded as the water turned to flash steam, but I remember the steel control cables being melted and the ends fused into a ball. Sadly the pilot didn't survive, but hit the ground with his parachute intact but unopened.

Andrew

Back in the 70s it was my ambition to work there figuring out why planes had crashed!

Then in 6th form I discovered biology was even better

Neil

[SamsarandaParticipant @samsaranda]

First posting out of trade training when I joined the Air Force in the early sixties was to a Salvage and Transportation Unit, we were responsible for the recovery and transporting crashed aircraft in the southern half of the UK. We recovered military and civil accidents and so visited the AAIB hangar at Farnborough a number of times. Not a pleasant job and in those days no such thing as counselling.

Dave W

[Cornish JackParticipant @cornishjack]

Had a couple of years as Ops and S&R on D Sqdn at Boscombe in the late 70s. Some of the trials flying was unusual to say the least – such as carrying six 'dummies' on a 'jungle penetrator' suspended 300' below a Seaking at slowly increasing speeds. From memory, we got to 40 knots before the rope went into violent gyrations and detached itself!! I believe this was classified as a 'failure'.

Andrew -"…on the MRCA" … Multi Racial Cost Accumulator, as it was known , at the time

rgds

Bill

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