advice required

[john evans 13Participant @johnevans13]

I have used a chester conquest machine for 17yrs with no real issues other than replacing a circuitboard. I now find it hard to take reasonable cuts in steel so am considering a replacement.

Naturally I have looked at others in the range as the warehouse is close to me. I see nothing I like.

My search inevitably takes me to older myfords. I have an opportunity to buy a basic ml10 with few extras. I assume being heavier in construction the machine will be more robust..is that likely to be tbe case? i gain little in capacity but lose variable and higher speed so is it worth buying or should I look elsewhere?

I have a separate mill and do not turn large items. Mainly parts for old motorcycles.

[john evans 13Participant @johnevans13]

lathe

[Chris Evans 6Participant @chrisevans6]

I have never used a Myford but the spindle bore always looks restrictive for motorcycle work. You need a 40mm upwards bore for most fork stanchions.

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

Hello John,

Welcome to the forum.

I'm not convinced an ML10 will be significantly more capable than your Conquest. If you haven't done so already you might consider the taper roller bearing modification.

Another thing to consider is adding a 3-phase motor and variable frequency drive. This link shows how I did this on my Clarke CL300M, which is a very similar machine. I happily run it with a 4" chuck and TCT tooling these days.

Neil

[john evans 13Participant @johnevans13]

Old bike fork stanchions seldom reach 40mm,35 being an average maximum. Modern are 40 plus. It does not matter though as I would never machine fork legs etc plus my bikes have girder forks. Thanks for the response however.

My query surrounds comparison of the conquest lathe with an ml 10. I.e. will I be better off with the myford?

[john evans 13Participant @johnevans13]

Thanks Neil. Your response re the ml10 mirrors my own opinion.

As for the taper mod i suppose you refer to my conquest? If so,my problem is not with the headstock but with the top slide which chatters under load

[Kevin FParticipant @kevinf]

I own a Myford ML10 and I believe it would be a good upgrade compared to the Chester conquest lathe , you'll always get your money back on a Myford if you find it is not to your liking , I know many don't like the Myford lathes but in my opinion they are one of the best lathes for Model engineering .

[john evans 13Participant @johnevans13]

Thank you Kevin. I hoped a myford owner would chip in. I agree with you re resale value as the conquezt will not be worth much. My concern is that the myford is only slightly bigger. Has few speeds to select and is heavy. The ml10 does not however sell like the 7.

Advantages would be a potentially stiffer slide set up. Better spares but not necessarily cheaper.

I would love a southbend but have seen very few within reasonable distance.An atlas is my second choice but the ml 10 mentioned is a good price and in very good order.

[Carl Wilson 4Participant @carlwilson4]

My brother does a lot of motorcycle work. He has an emcomat that is too small. You want something like a Harrison M250 or similar. It’ll hold its value and be easier to use and output any Myford any day.

[Nick WheelerParticipant @nickwheeler]

An ML10 seems a backwards step to me: you'll be spending money to lose the variable speed, large(for the size) spindle bore, bolt on chucks and the ability to move it about on your own. About the only 'improvement' is a longer bed, which may or may not be of any use to you.

When I replaced my mini-lathe with a bigger machine, I sold it easily for about 2/3 of what it had cost me over the ten years that I owned it which seems a pretty good deal.

[Carl Wilson 4Participant @carlwilson4]

A longer bed that is basically the same as a Drummond B type from around the time of the first world war. Just buy a proper one.

[Carl Wilson 4Participant @carlwilson4]

Ps nothing against Drummond B’s, I have two.

[john evans 13Participant @johnevans13]

Harrison is too heavy for my shed. I looked at a boxford.Nice machine but again heavy. I need a bench lathe or one with a pedestal .

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

If your top/compound rest is really worn out rather than out of adjustment, both the base and top part are available as standard spares, as are the feedscrews. The whole schamozzle shouldn't set you back more than £50.

Neil

[Carl Wilson 4Participant @carlwilson4]

Have you considered an Optimum lathe? German purportedly. Were sold in UK by Excel in Coventry.

[Kevin FParticipant @kevinf]

 

 

Posted by john evans 13 on 08/01/2017 20:16:24:

Thank you Kevin. I hoped a myford owner would chip in. I agree with you re resale value as the conquezt will not be worth much. My concern is that the myford is only slightly bigger. Has few speeds to select and is heavy. The ml10 does not however sell like the 7.

Advantages would be a potentially stiffer slide set up. Better spares but not necessarily cheaper.

I would love a southbend but have seen very few within reasonable distance.An atlas is my second choice but the ml 10 mentioned is a good price and in very good order.

 

 

The ML10 centre height is 3.250" and the distance between centres is 13" ( unless it's the long bed 18" ) so it is slightly smaller than the conquest which has a centre height of 90mm and 350mm between centres , I agree you will miss the flexibility of the variable speed motor at first, I owned a warco lathe ( similar spec to the Chester ) which had variable speed which was a great asset to have but As time has gone by I don't miss it at all , the ML10 I have now is not my first Myford lathe ,I had an ML4 before and the ML10 feels so much more ' capable ' a very sturdy machine for its size .

As for the actual physical weight ,I don't have a figure to hand but two adult men can easily handle the lathe ,spares and parts availability is fantastic ,in my opinion I'd go for the ML10 I'm sure you won't be disappointed ,if there's any specific questions just ask .

Edited By Kevin F on 08/01/2017 23:10:53

Edited By Kevin F on 08/01/2017 23:12:26

[Nick HulmeParticipant @nickhulme30114]

As you're not fettling the lathe you have I'm guessing you don't want to modify whatever you get, if that is the case you really can't beat buying something new that comes with a warranty.

Don't get me wrong, I have a Myford Super 7 Long Bed that's had more time and money spent on it than would be sensible for most but if I was starting out to buy a lathe today I'd be spending the money on a nice tool-room lathe, preferably an '80s EMCO but some of the better Chinese stuff might do with some fettling,

 

– Nick

Edited By Nick Hulme on 09/01/2017 00:10:02

[Nick HulmeParticipant @nickhulme30114]

Double Post, Sorry

 

Edited By Nick Hulme on 09/01/2017 00:09:30

[HopperParticipant @hopper]

Posted by john evans 13 on 08/01/2017 14:23:22:

I have used a chester conquest machine for 17yrs with no real issues other than replacing a circuitboard. I now find it hard to take reasonable cuts in steel so am considering a replacement.

It seems like if you were happy with the lathe for that long it might be easier to do a bit of maintenance on the existing machine than to buy another, but older, secondhand lathe that may well need much the same sort of fettling.

If it no longer takes good cuts, where it once did, there is a reason. Providing the reason is not that the bed is worn out (unlikely in home use) the rest of the reasons are easy enough to fix at home.

First suspect would be headstock bearings. As Neil has suggested the taper roller bearing conversion will transform it into a different machine altogether. Do try to get good quality bearings and not cheapie no-name jobs. SKF bearings work well for precision stuff.

Second suspect would be gibs on the carriage, cross-slide and top slide need stripping, cleaning out and setting up properly. Also any shims on the anti-lift plates on the carriage probably need tightening up.

I would do these simple jobs before I went looking for a used lathe.

I just picked up an old Myford ML7 on the cheap. Complete and running. Looked a bit tatty but not too bad. And the bed was good. But get it home and I find it has a missing tooth on the backgear that requires a complete strip down to replace. Plus about ten thou slack in the headstock bearings once the congealed gunge was removed, requiring bearing overhaul and scraping in. Plus a good handfull of small broken knobs, bent cross slide leadscrew, halfnuts jammed full of the swarf of ages and on their last legs, countershaft bearings so worn they have chewed up the countershaft, cracked drive pulley etc etc etc.

It will be a good lathe once I have gone over and serviced every nut and bolt. Lathe restoration then becomes a hobby in itself. They are as bad as old motorbikes for eating up your time fiddling about fixing the ravages of time and previous owners.

Better the devil you know, I reckon.

[HopperParticipant @hopper]

Posted by Carl Wilson 4 on 08/01/2017 21:56:25:
Have you considered an Optimum lathe? German purportedly. Were sold in UK by Excel in Coventry.

Made in China for a German company . The only one I have personally had anything to do with (6 x 12 micro) was very poorly made. I would not touch one. I've seen Chinese lathes purchased direct from Aliexpress in China that have better qualitiy.

[Carl Wilson 4Participant @carlwilson4]

That’s a shame. Ah well. Caveat Emptor.

[Chris Evans 6Participant @chrisevans6]

John, girder forks here for me as well but once you have a lathe and mill you get 100 friends. I have regularly modified/shortened telescopic forks for people hence the bore size concern. True though 35mm is probably maximum.

[AjohnwParticipant @ajohnw51620]

If you do go for the ML10 I would be inclined to look for one that has taper roller bearings. The problem with the earlier ones is that past some point it's very difficult to do anything with the plain running in cast iron ones. There are pictures of the 2 types on lathe co uk. The difference is easy to spot. It's a big plus against all of Myford's other lathes. They can be changes easily – if needed and aren't that bad to adjust.

Hopper made a good point though – check carefully. I would go look and take tools with me to tighten up the slides if they are rather loose so I could get a true idea of wear. Particularly the saddle. I've looked at several of the later models over the years and generally they have all been in pretty good condition – even well adjusted usually. In fact I would say often hardly used. Getting things like fixed steadies for them can be rather difficult to find. Something to bear in mind if you need one you might have to make it. The change wheel gear set contains a fair few gears too. They can be found but a better option is a lathe with them.

The roller bearing model is essentially a speed 10 without the higher speeds. A mod or an inverter and 3 phase motor could fix that aspect.

Not sure it's right to knock Opti based on Brian's lathe that Hopper sorted out. Following that it's seems to have done some pretty decent work. He wants bigger now though and was probably advised to go bigger when he bought the baby lathe. 'hit probably happens on all makes at times.There do seem to be some happy owners and they can be seen being used on youtube. They cost more for less though but the gain is the claim that they use hardened bearings and in one case an aged bed. I assume that is still in the catalogue. All lathe manufacturers used to leave beds etc lying around to stress relieve them. Not sure if Opti leave 'em long enough but at least they know about the problem. Worth it over say Warco? I don't know and the fact that a German outfit is involved doesn't mean much really.

John

–

[john evans 13Participant @johnevans13]

Well lots of opinions as I expected.Machine loyalty is the same whether lathe or vehicle.

It is true I do not want to fettle my machine. I have adjusted the gibs but they do not have the effect I need. The tool post holder dips then pulls the top slide when cutting certain metals. Frankly I doubt I could repair for the sum suggested. Having visited Chester machinery before xmas I thought parts etc had shot up in price.

There is an old southbend 13" on ebay at the moment. I really fancy that but it is heavy and also 130ml away so I cannot view. If good that would do more or less all I need. I do not mind cleaning and part restoring an old machine but do not feel justified spending on my machine. I have had an okd ml2 in the past and a tyzac zyto,both needed work.

Re the ml10,yes it is the 13"version but as good as you are likely to find. I thought it slightly bigger than my conquest but obviously not? It certainly looks substantial and importantly,rigid;plus it has the later bearings.

I am not against chinese machines but believe you get what you pay for. I have been lucky but many are not.I do not trust warranties. The variable speed switch was faulty soon after delivery..only the switch casing slipping on the spline. The warranty fix was to give me a new switch to solder in to place! I have looked at the new machines but they do nothing to excite me. Most hobby machines look like extended versions of my own machine or look crudely finished..some actually have less features but greater bed length which would be useful at times.

I do not want a warco or a clarke ..sorry owners! No reason other than choice. Sadly,residing in n wales there are few machines available locally hence travel is an issue. I also have limited space. My timber shed is 12×14,timber floor on bearers. 4 motorcycles and lots of tools/machinery etc. If I have a heavy machine I need to reinforce the floor to spread the load as I do not want to cut it away and concrete the base under a machine.

[Carl Wilson 4Participant @carlwilson4]

You might as well use this period to reinforce the floor and get a 2nd hand Harrison or Colchester. My M250 is about 380kg.

At the end of the day a Myford is just another hobby lathe. I’m not denying that they were good when they came out. Things have moved on since the 1940s though.

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