Frames Assembly

Frames Assembly

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  • #250977
    Michael Crawforth 1
    Participant
      @michaelcrawforth1

      The question is simple and i think i know the answer but just want to check up with you guys.

      The frames are riveted to the buffer and drag bars. How are the stretchers fixed ? I can only think they are bolted because the material thickness is quarter inch and there are no angle brackets to rivet through.

      That is my assumption anyway i hope you can guide me it the possible errors of my ways.

      Michael

      #8250
      Michael Crawforth 1
      Participant
        @michaelcrawforth1

        Stretcher Assembly, 5″ Nigel Gresley 2-8-0 by Martin Evans

        #250978
        Neil Wyatt
        Moderator
          @neilwyatt

          Hi Michael,

          The question is simple but the answer depends on which loco you are building! Can you give us a clue

          Neil

          #250979
          Michael Crawforth 1
          Participant
            @michaelcrawforth1

            5" Nigel Gresley 2-8-0 by Martin Evans

            #250982
            JasonB
            Moderator
              @jasonb

              Yes stretchers most likely tapped to take screw/bolt fixings.

              You may also find that the angles on the buffers are only rivited to say the buffer but bolted through the frame which will allow for things to be taken apart at a later date if needed, not sure on that specific loco

              #250986
              Michael Gilligan
              Participant
                @michaelgilligan61133
                Posted by Neil Wyatt on 16/08/2016 13:01:42:

                Hi Michael,

                The question is simple but the answer depends on which loco you are building! Can you give us a clue

                Neil

                .

                Methinks the clue was in the subtitle.

                [or has that been added later ?]

                MichaelG.

                Edited By Michael Gilligan on 16/08/2016 13:28:12

                #250987
                Bob Brown 1
                Participant
                  @bobbrown1

                  On my build of 5" Nigel Gresley 2-8-0 (still a long way to go) the stretchers are drilled and tapped and fixed with countersunk cap screws. How far into the build are you?

                  #250988
                  Another JohnS
                  Participant
                    @anotherjohns

                    Hi Michael;

                    I'm into 3-1/2" gauge, but should be the same. Yes, bolt the frames together, to angles on buffers, and directly into tapped holes in frame stretchers. One can braze/weld the frames together, but you need to be sure of your bracing when welding, and I don't think it saves much time, if any.

                    On my latest 2 builds, I use metric cap screws onto the buffer "angles" rather than modellers bolts, as I think one can tighten them up more, and less likely to break. After painting, and tucked underneath running boards, behind steps etc, they are hard to see.

                    If you don't like tapping into blind holes for the stretchers, one can drill holes (say, 6mm) across the plate, then drill in to the sides meeting these holes. That way, you can tap easily, and can see the tap coming through the drilled hole. I've not bothered, but the DB23 (3-1/2" gauge 2-6-2) plans from the Netherlands show this.

                    #250990
                    Michael Crawforth 1
                    Participant
                      @michaelcrawforth1

                      Looking at the drawings and actually loading the drawings into Autodesk Inventor 2016 so that i can make sure it all fits and works and that i am getting it right.

                      I also means i can see it built before i start doing any actual engineering.

                      However i started this model 28 years ago when at school and then sold it as i grew up

                      How i regret that !!

                      #250991
                      JasonB
                      Moderator
                        @jasonb
                        Posted by Michael Gilligan on 16/08/2016 13:26:30:

                        Methinks the clue was in the subtitle.

                        [or has that been added later ?]

                        Guilty as charged, but there is no way to leave any evidence

                        #250994
                        Michael Crawforth 1
                        Participant
                          @michaelcrawforth1

                          I can say that the original posting had it within when it was created

                          #250995
                          Michael Gilligan
                          Participant
                            @michaelgilligan61133

                            Thanks, Jason

                            Neil's reputation is safe now devil

                            MichaelG.

                            #250996
                            Neil Wyatt
                            Moderator
                              @neilwyatt
                              Posted by Michael Gilligan on 16/08/2016 13:26:30:

                              Posted by Neil Wyatt on 16/08/2016 13:01:42:

                              Hi Michael,

                              The question is simple but the answer depends on which loco you are building! Can you give us a clue

                              Neil

                              .

                              Methinks the clue was in the subtitle.

                              [or has that been added later ?]

                              MichaelG.

                              Edited By Michael Gilligan on 16/08/2016 13:28:12

                              Jason has been retconning … ah, I see he has 'fessed up'.

                              Neil

                              #251082
                              julian atkins
                              Participant
                                @julianatkins58923

                                Hi Michael,

                                You really need to get the full set of drawings and the construction series which was in in ME 1969-1970. I have the full set of MEs for this period if you have any queries.

                                It is pretty obvious from the drawings how the frames are assembled to everything else, and the frames are NOT rivetted to the buffer beam angle or the drag box.

                                Cheers,

                                Julian

                                #251091
                                JasonB
                                Moderator
                                  @jasonb

                                  Julian, I don't think it is obvious from the drawings how things are assembled, there are no holes shown in the ends of the stretchers, no holes shown in the angles where they fix to the frame. Although the frames show hole positions for angles and stretchers they don't give a size.

                                  I also don't think a beginner could tell how the buffer angles are fixed to the frames even with the text as "the usual ones" does not really give much away. Granted there is a clue about how the stretchers fit in the text.

                                  J

                                  #251098
                                  Bob Brown 1
                                  Participant
                                    @bobbrown1

                                    I have a full set of drawings and the construction series, the drawings are not that clear as to how the beams or stretchers are connected but the notes do mention the fixings for the beams.capture.jpg

                                    #251101
                                    Kerrin Galvin
                                    Participant
                                      @kerringalvin72662

                                      Hi Michael, I just happen to have a Nigel Gresley in the loco shed, aka my dads workshop. I didn't build it so off the top of my head can't answer your question but can go early next week to have a look and let you know. Maybe in the mean time somebody else will answer the question Cheers Kerrin

                                      #251105
                                      Bob Brown 1
                                      Participant
                                        @bobbrown1

                                        5193-l.jpg5193-g.jpg5193-h.jpg

                                        Edited By Bob Brown 1 on 17/08/2016 10:58:04

                                        #251259
                                        Michael Crawforth 1
                                        Participant
                                          @michaelcrawforth1

                                          Thanks very much to everyone and i am hoping to get going with it all very soon and even more so armed with the additional information.

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