‘What LatheXXXXX sorry 3D Printer should I buy’

[Mark Simpson 1Participant @marksimpson1]

Hi Iain

I too would agree that the support from Mike is excellent, I was only short a couple of M4 washers from the whole build,no problems building it or with the wiring or even flashing the firmware.

I might try and make a better cover the electronics box with some defined cable supports and guides in it, It's tricky to access the plugs when debugging it through the slots in the cover and no way to secure them

I wondered whether the clearances between the sintered bushes and the guide rods were excessive, but it does not seem to be a problem in practice…Mike suggests that the free movement is much more important.

I printed a couple of 50 mm squares and circles, to try and gauge the accuracy and I'm happy with the result…

After that just printed a christmas decoration and a PUG dog (daughter in law is a fan). Used the autosupports of Cura for the pug and was impressed… Also tried slic3r using the same settings and got a good result

Cheers
Mark

[JourneymanParticipant @journeyman]

Spiral wrap can help tidy the wiring a bit. Fixing the power supply to the frame also gets wiring off of the bench. My effort below:-

For more details see *** Journeyman's Workshop ***

John

Edited By Journeyman on 27/12/2017 13:19:18

[Iain DownsParticipant @iaindowns78295]

Thanks, John.

Apart from not having any spiral wrap, Mike actually recommends against it. He says it adds drag. HOwever, you have a tidier machine than I do.

I will actively look at mounting the PSU once I've got basically used to the machine. And putting an on / off switch somewhere.

Iain

[JourneymanParticipant @journeyman]

One day I will print a box to fit under and around the power supply to contain the wires and include a mains socket (PC power supply style) and switch. One day…

John

[Colin LLoydParticipant @colinlloyd53450]

Message to Iain – I note that you are using bulldog clips to hold the glass plate to the table. Might I recommend you use Rapesco SupaClip 60 spring clips instead. Bulldog clips can get in the way of the extruder nozzle as it travels across the table. Supaclips are much flatter. The Supaclip 60 is the largest I think Rapesco do – but these will hold the glass plate very nicely – and the Supaclips have many other uses around the workshop or office. You can get them from any number of suppliers including Amazon.

Colin

[Iain DownsParticipant @iaindowns78295]

Thanks Colin.

I'm very much a beginner at this game, so happy for any advice which comes my way. Amazon is speeding some clips as we speak…

Iain

[Iain DownsParticipant @iaindowns78295]

And so to my first actual designed thing. Drawn up in OnShape, sliced in Cura and printed on the Factory 3D machine.

I even got some positive response from her highness.

That was a near 6 hours print. This machine is remarkable but tedious! It makes watching paint dry exciting!

I guess I can make the fill less and the walls thinner. Which for the next version of the toothy thing above I will try.

I wondered what peoples view of leaving the machine printing unattended was. Mike's document is very clear on the health and safety aspects, but i suspect because he has to.

Do people let the thing run for hours? Do you leave it alone in the house? (this will live in the house. The shed is far too hostile an environment).

Finally, the noise is driving me crazy. Admittedly two days on the sauce don't help, but I have a feeling a box for it is coming on…

Iain

[JourneymanParticipant @journeyman]

Posted by Iain Downs on 27/12/2017 19:41:28:

I wondered what peoples view of leaving the machine printing unattended was. Mike's document is very clear on the health and safety aspects, but i suspect because he has to.

Do people let the thing run for hours? Do you leave it alone in the house? (this will live in the house. The shed is far too hostile an environment

Iain

 

Well done, useful thing, bung it on Thingiverse. I have just installed an IP camera in the workshop so I can keep an eye on the printer from afar on phone, tablet or office PC. I don't find my printer to be particularly noisy but I have got Igus Drylin bearings in mine, also better to reduce printing speeds somewhat.

John

Edit.. Tablet fingers!

Edited By Journeyman on 27/12/2017 20:02:11

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

I don't leave mine alone in the house for more than fairly short periods

I usually use 0.8mm thick walls = two nozzle widths and 0.8mm top and bottom thickness.

For the toothbrush holder I would use only 15% fill and 0.2mm layers.

Neil

[Ian ParkinParticipant @ianparkin39383]

Can anyone supply a link to a 3d printer on ebay in the uk that’s good for a beginner to dip toes into 3d printing?

I have a 20% off voucher that’s only valid today

[Colin LLoydParticipant @colinlloyd53450]

Posted by Ian Parkin on 28/12/2017 12:20:04:

Can anyone supply a link to a 3d printer on ebay in the uk that’s good for a beginner to dip toes into 3d printing?

I have a 20% off voucher that’s only valid today

Hi Ian, I'm no expert and have only experience with one 3D printer but I bought the Geeetech i3 Prusa Pro B printer off ebay (currently selling for around £159) and have had no cause to complain – except for things that were my fault. It depends on whether you want to buy one fully assembled or in kit form that you have to assemble yourself. With the Geeetech you have access to about 8 videos showing you in minute detail how to assemble. Despite never having built a 3D printer before, I found the whole process quite easy if you took your time and applied Model Engineering practice to the assembly. if you do get a Geeetech, then feel free to contact me if you get stuck. Just make certain that the model you choose can print many different filaments but generally ABS and PLA and that the model comes with a heated bed – these can be added as an upgrade – but best to get one from the word go. There are many suppliers of this printer on ebay – go with the seller with the best rating. I got mine from "Geeetech-official" ebay seller but the kit had to come from China – so might not suit you if you wanted it before the middle of January. Hope this helps.

Colin

[Ian ParkinParticipant @ianparkin39383]

Thanks for that Colin duly bought with auto levelling too

Ian

[Colin LLoydParticipant @colinlloyd53450]

Posted by Ian Parkin on 28/12/2017 14:44:58:

Thanks for that Colin duly bought with auto levelling too

Ian

Hi Ian – glad I could help. If you want to start thinking about the assembly – there is a whole series of videos (27 to be precise) showing the assembly procedure in detail. Here's the link for the whole series

**LINK**

Colin

[Colin Bernard 1Participant @colinbernard1]

Hi All.

Just joined the forum. I am an aeromodeller but thinking of branching into Model Engineering now I am retired.

Came across this thread and think I may have a couple of useful comments having been using a 3D printer for nearly a year. Mine is a Malyan M150 – a Wanhao i3 clone. Good metal frame so no alignment or stability problems like the acrylic framed printers.

Firstly on CAD software. I looked at Blender, but I found it far too compicated, (and that coming from an IT application consultant!), so eventually settled on Fusion360 from AutoDesk. Feature rich, plenty of support and YouTube videos and FREE for hobbyists!.

For slicing I have all the free applications and was using Slic3r until I came across Craftware which is now my slicer of choice given its excellent preview facilities and the fine control of support structures.

I print mainly PLA on glass with a smear of Pritstik wiped over the glass with a damp piece of kitchen roll. Have never had a project detach during a print with this combination.

Someone asked about external computer control and here I use Octoprint running on a Raspberry Pi which I can access from anywhere, allowing me to monitor and view print progress while I am away from the house.

Hope this helps. Now to explore the rest of the forum and find the answer to 'What is a lathe?'

Colin

[Ian ParkinParticipant @ianparkin39383]

And now …what software do i need

Ian

[Iain DownsParticipant @iaindowns78295]

Asking questions like that on the ME forum will get you more answers than respondents.

For design work I like OnShape. It's online, it's functionally up there with the best of breed engineering design software and it's relatively easy to use (I have found no engineer design tools which qualify as easy to use, this is far better than most and there is a programming language if you need to go mad).

The drawback to free is that all your models are public. So can be seen and no doubt stolen by the world. Good luck to them with my toothbrush holder!

For blobby things there is Builder 3D which comes with Windows 10. This really isn't very good, but you can bring in an STL model from thingiverse and to some simple tweaks. As an example, I brought down an iguana soap dish from thingiverse, built a shower riser clip in OnShape, exported this to STL and merged the two in Builder 3D.

Iain

[Colin Bernard 1Participant @colinbernard1]

Ian,

Not sure if your post is a tongue in cheek response to my lengthy post above or you hadnt noticed it!

If the latter I put a number of software suggestions in it as have others earlier.

Colin

[I.M. OUTAHEREParticipant @i-m-outahere]

Any thoughts on this one ?

https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.com.au%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F112691665582

Not sure how long the wheels would last or would a unit with linear bearings be better ?

Ian.

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

The track ones are supposed to be very good but vulnerable to dirt causing errors as small deflection of a wheel can magnified to a significant movement of the print head by the geometry

[Iain DownsParticipant @iaindowns78295]

What an interesting Christmas. And I partly mean that in the terms of the Chinese curse (May you have an interesting life).

Building the Factory 3D printer was quite challenging. Actually it's not particularly hard – If you have no more than two thumbs and half a brain you can do it. But it's a sensitive thing.

In my case I got it working on Boxing day and printed some of my own designs (toothbrush holders are useful despite the jeers of at least one of the forum members!).

Then it all fell apart. I wanted to print a green lizard soap dish for the shower (I know it's not exactly Brunell is it?). I changed the filament for a green on (who has black lizards, eh?). And it just stopped working. The board decided that the hot end was at 83 degrees and the bed at 65. regardless of if there was power to heater or even if the thermistor was connected.

Mike (Mr Factory 3D) sent me a replacement board by return (plus some spares – I would recommend a spare hot end, barrels and nozzles).

Got that, the temperature now read correctly (phew!).

But now the models go mad. The head suddenly jumps to the wrong place and, worse, the extruder runs backwards effectively jamming the hot end which is a bloody nuisance to sort out.

More help from Mike. Tune up the current in the motor drivers. Realise that you've mucked up the bed alignment so recalibrate.

Print one of the many models which have been misbehaving. It works.

Print one of mine. That works too.

Now print a big one. Well, the Jury's out. mainly because it's a 5 hour print and only 2 hours in. But its working.

A few take away's if you get this kit.

For me the main thing is that Mike's support is above and beyond the call of duty. If I'd bought this kit from China it would just never have got working. Well with a LOT more stress, perhaps. If you do decide you want a 3D printer, make sure it's either got some good support behind it or it's not your first.

Secondly, you really need to be very anal about the instructions and if something changes pretty much go back to the start and work your way through.

Thirdly, with this kit, the wiring connections seem to be sensitive. the motor plug and the board socket are different sorts. I will be replacing the motor plugs with the same sort as on the board when I can.

Lastly, it would seem that once it is going, it's going.

I would still recommend this as a build despite the challenges and extra time it's taken me to get it going.

And I'm now making a toothbrush holder for my wife. Which actually has the potential to gain me brownie points – much needed after a Christmas not entirely focused on her!

Iain

[I.M. OUTAHEREParticipant @i-m-outahere]

Spent a little time watching some reviews of various machines the tarantula seems ok for a low end machine although according to one build video i watched the z axis bracket needs some stiffening and a blower needed to be fitted to the print head . Another was a creality CR 10 which the guy doing the review seemed excited about and it seemed to be a nice bit of kit , it did print a little better than most of the others except a $2k unit .

[Colin LLoydParticipant @colinlloyd53450]

My advice to anyone starting out with 3D printing is to keep things small and quick to start with. Not too many layers, not too long to complete build – this way you will quickly come to appreciate the foibles of your particular machine and where you need to investigate failures and consequent adjustments. As a complete beginner (graduated to novice now) at all aspects of machine engineering (lathe, milling, scrollsaw, CNC engraving, and 3D printing) – I never started by trying to produce a "wanted" object – just turned, milled, cut lines, engraved circles, printed a small round pill box – on scrap metal, plywood, PLA, etc). This way, I was never disappointed with the machines, only with my own failure to see the obvious, and not so obvious, when things went wrong.

With my 3D printer, the major problem was with the long 45mm linear bearings on the z-axis. These require either near perfect rods to slide on – or in my case, putting the rods into the lathe and emery papering down the rods from an interference fit on parts of the rod to slick movement with minimal loss of X-Y position. You could feel the resistance of the bearings on the rod and when this had been removed.

Colin

[I.M. OUTAHEREParticipant @i-m-outahere]

I have use the hardened pg shafting for linear bearings , Ebay has stacks of it cheap enough and i have always found it operated very smoothly so maybe a cheap option is to switch out the shafts for this ?

2 things i would like – a 3d printer and a cnc router / engraver so the decision is do i buy separate units or build a custom one unit does all sort of thing ?

The one thing about the build my option is it would be built like a brick out house but one thing has me a little stuck , i could use the arduino mega running marlin for the printer no probs but what to do for the cnc router ?  Probably use mach3 as a g code generator but I'm lead to believe that  the  arduino / marlin combo is not suitable to receive the output from mach3 as it is designed to run a std cnc conroller . 

Or would it just be easier to buy  individual units ? 

Ian.

Edited By XD 351 on 02/01/2018 12:55:16

[Colin LLoydParticipant @colinlloyd53450]

Posted by XD 351 on 02/01/2018 12:45:10:

2 things i would like – a 3d printer and a cnc router / engraver so the decision is do i buy separate units or build a custom one unit does all sort of thing ?

The one thing about the build my option is it would be built like a brick out house but one thing has me a little stuck , i could use the arduino mega running marlin for the printer no probs but what to do for the cnc router ? Probably use mach3 as a g code generator but I'm lead to believe that the arduino / marlin combo is not suitable to receive the output from mach3 as it is designed to run a std cnc conroller .

Or would it just be easier to buy individual units ?

Ian.

Edited By XD 351 on 02/01/2018 12:55:16

Ian, I just went and bought one of the Chinese CNC Engravers on Ebay – generically known as 3-axis 3020 or 3040 machines (the numbers refer to the engraving area (30 x20 cm, 30 x40 cm)). I run this exclusively on a dedicated Linux PC using LinuxCNC as the machine operator software and Inkscape with its Gcode extension to create patterns for export to LinuxCNC. The machine has worked effectively, with most failures being down to me using wrong speeds or wrong routing bits for the base material. I've never had a failure with the overall CNC aspects of the machine. I'm now converting mine to use a Pulse Width Modulated 2W Blue Laser to surface burn photo-realistic images onto wood.

Colin

[Colin LLoydParticipant @colinlloyd53450]

Posted by XD 351 on 02/01/2018 12:45:10:

2 things i would like – a 3d printer and a cnc router / engraver so the decision is do i buy separate units or build a custom one unit does all sort of thing ?

Ian.

Edited By XD 351 on 02/01/2018 12:55:16

Sorry Ian – missed the point about a combined unit. Unless you go for a high-end 3D printer I don't think this will work. The forces that the 3D printer motors and support encounter in printing means that they are probably not good enough to withstand those forces encountered when routing or engraving metal. The lateral speed at which the CNC router engraver works is also far beyond those speeds on budget 3D printers. Just examining the control boards of my 3D printer and my CNC router shows me that the electronics in the CNC router are that much more powerful than the Arduino -powered control board of the 3D Printer. That's not to say it cannot be done – but I would recommend you try and dual-use a CNC Router rather than from the 3D Printer end – even though the initial price is that much higher.

Colin

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