Unnecessary waste of paper

[Adrian 2Participant @adrian2]

Barclays Bank recently closed my local branch. I have now transferred my affection to another bank. A smooth and trouble free transition.

Last week I received from Barclays, copies of statements for the previous five years. Almost 90 sheets of A4 paper.

They are legally obliged to offer this service unless I requested otherwise.

Had they asked (which they did not) I would have declined.

It would take one letter on one sheet of paper to simply ask the question.

I hate to think of the needless waste if this is common practice throughout the banking industry.

Adrian.

[Adrian 2Participant @adrian2]

[Howard LewisParticipant @howardlewis46836]

I agree, but initiative is not encouraged. "Don't ask questions. Just tick the box"

As Model Engineers, who need to use our initiative, it is doubly frustrating, but like PC thinking, it is now a part of life, designed for those cannot assess a situation and react to it.

Where should I store my soapbox? Only clean answers please!

Howard

[Douglas JohnstonParticipant @douglasjohnston98463]

About five years ago I closed a bank account and every 6 months since then I have received a letter from them stating my account balance is 12p. I should really tell them to stop but am interested to see how long this silly business goes on.

Doug

[WatfordParticipant @watford]

Not just the banks. Just renewed my car insurance. Two large envelopes received, one to invite renewal, and the second to send the insurance certificate. Counting the total sheaf of papers that this involved I found that they had sent thirty-nine sheets of A4.

My input was a solitary bank transfer.

Mike

[OldironParticipant @oldiron]

Posted by Douglas Johnston on 28/11/2018 14:42:56:

About five years ago I closed a bank account and every 6 months since then I have received a letter from them stating my account balance is 12p. I should really tell them to stop but am interested to see how long this silly business goes on.

Doug

I shut my Barclays credit card account 15 years ago and still get paper billing giving me an account total of £0.00.

I have asked several times for it to be stopped but still it comes.

regards

[J HancockParticipant @jhancock95746]

Many years ago,when I reached the tender age of 65, in addition to my main pension I found two tiny extra

pensions.

One of £2.68 a year, which I naturally asked to be paid monthly, as it was taxed, Each month I would get an envelope with the paperwork inside showing 18p had been paid into my account, plus 4p to the Inland Revenue.

After many years they did try to pay me off (refused), so now get the lump sum of £2.15 up front.

[larry phelan 1Participant @larryphelan1]

Dont even try to understand this type of thing,I dont,I just ask them to repeat since I dont understand,and guess what ? Yes,they send out the same crap again !

It,s called PROGRESS or something !

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

Hmm at a rough count I can think of well over twenty organisations that send me regular statements.

The only ones I get paper communications for are my business bank accounts and some things from HMRC.

It's really up to you to contact them and switch to paperless.

Neil

[Fowlers FuryParticipant @fowlersfury]

"It's really up to you to contact them and switch to paperless"

Don't know if other banks are the same as Barclays but SWMBO and myself each have an account with them.
We opted for "paperless" communication but are both inundated with large unsolicited multi-page letters, often twice a week, inviting us to take out loans. It's junk mail and goes straight to the shredder – costing me electricity and them production and postage. But I suppose it all keeps Royal Snail Mail in business and our postman in a job.

[vintage engineerParticipant @vintageengineer]

You will find that most of this paper is due to EU rules and they harp on about saving the environment!

[I.M. OUTAHEREParticipant @i-m-outahere]

My bank started charging for printed monthly statements so it kind of forces me to go to the E – statements .

If all shose sheets are only printed single side you could use the other side for a workshop sketch pad

[HopperParticipant @hopper]

Haven't had a paper letter from a bank in years since I went all digital e-statements etc. Usually there is somewhere on your internet banking page you can tick the box for "I do not wish to receive mail/emails/phone calls about outstanding opportunities in banking I may wish to participate in" or the like. If you don't tick the box, you get pestered.

All my bills and vehicle rego etc are also received and paid online these days. So the only things in my letterbox these days are small parcels from eBay etc. (Mostly workshop related!) Can't remember the last time i got an actual letter. — edit, oh yes I can. Speeding fine. Doh! Some things never change.

 

 

Edited By Hopper on 29/11/2018 01:14:56

[Russell EberhardtParticipant @russelleberhardt48058]

Posted by vintage engineer on 28/11/2018 23:26:56:

You will find that most of this paper is due to EU rules and they harp on about saving the environment!

It's always too easy to blame someone else.

Russell

[SillyOldDufferModerator @sillyoldduffer]

Posted by Russell Eberhardt on 29/11/2018 08:55:11:

Posted by vintage engineer on 28/11/2018 23:26:56:

You will find that most of this paper is due to EU rules and they harp on about saving the environment!

• It's always too easy to blame someone else.

Russell

The EU has always been a convenient excuse for any bureaucratic cock-up or unpopular legislation in the UK. Be fun to see who gets the blame from next year onwards!

One explanation for this kind of nonsense from my personal experience:

• Step 1 – to reduce costs organisations like Banks replace staff with an in-house developed computer system. Now what can be done depends more on the limitations of the computer system than the willingness of an individual employee to change a paper record. As the system is developed in-house, there is a team who can fix annoying faults by changing the programs, but the cost of doing so may cause long delays, or even a decision to tolerate the problem.
• Step 2 – to further reduce costs the organisation replaces most of its computer team with a bought in software package, possibly externally hosted. This severely restricts the ability of the business to make direct changes to the system. It's no longer possible for in-house computer staff to modify code and quickly fix faults, instead what can be done depends on whatever contract has been struck with the package vendor. A common business model is for the core package to be relatively inexpensive, while changing anything after purchase is very expensive. Package vendors profit because most businesses will need to make changes.  In the worst case it can be necessary to negotiate a new contract, or migrate to a different package.

The high cost of making small software changes tends to cause organisations to tolerate inconveniences for ever, or to bundle fixes into the next major planned upgrade which might be several years away.

This forum has several small shortcomings of this type. No doubt Neil regularly lobbies his management to fix them. No doubt Neil's management look at the cost and decide not to bother – yet. No doubt when the forum software reaches end-of-life, its replacement will be better.

Dave

 

Edited By SillyOldDuffer on 29/11/2018 10:02:56

[Anthony KnightsParticipant @anthonyknights16741]

Last year when my private pension increased, I received an updated council tax bill for 7 pence.

[HowiParticipant @howi]

Posted by Anthony Knights on 29/11/2018 09:58:20:

Last year when my private pension increased, I received an updated council tax bill for 7 pence.

????

[Anthony KnightsParticipant @anthonyknights16741]

COST OF PROCESSING DATA +PAPER +ENVELOPE +2ND CLASS STAMP=LOSS TO COUNCIL=WASTE OF PAPER.

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

Posted by SillyOldDuffer on 29/11/2018 09:57:19:

This forum has several small shortcomings of this type. No doubt Neil regularly lobbies his management to fix them. No doubt Neil's management look at the cost and decide not to bother – yet. No doubt when the forum software reaches end-of-life, its replacement will be better.

No I don't lobby for changes, I have set out what i woudl like to see in replacement software, including links to forums that I think use better software.

FWIW I think most forums use software that could be improved, not just this one.

Neil

[martin perman 1Participant @martinperman1]

Posted by Neil Wyatt on 30/11/2018 14:39:27:

Posted by SillyOldDuffer on 29/11/2018 09:57:19:

This forum has several small shortcomings of this type. No doubt Neil regularly lobbies his management to fix them. No doubt Neil's management look at the cost and decide not to bother – yet. No doubt when the forum software reaches end-of-life, its replacement will be better.

No I don't lobby for changes, I have set out what i woudl like to see in replacement software, including links to forums that I think use better software.

FWIW I think most forums use software that could be improved, not just this one.

Neil

I find with all Forums the following applies “You can please some of the people all of the time, you can please all of the people some of the time, but you can’t please all of the people all of the time”.”

Martin P

[the artfull-codgerParticipant @theartfull-codger]

Father in law lived next door,died 3 yrs ago & left his bungalow to the wife & sisters, eventually got a letter from the beeb about no tv licence renewal,dutifully phoned them up & told them about the situation & thought that was that,duty done, but no we regularly get demand & threatening letters for the last yr or more, this weeks says they're coming round this saturday [great] as there's no bungalow there now it was demolished last wek as part of the land she's sold & there's now a road there,I'm not paying for phone calls when I've told them once,the letters come in handy as I cut them up & use them in the workshop for notes etc.

[Max ToleranceParticipant @maxtolerance69251]

When I bought my first house, an end terrace. It had an access path running past the side of the house to a housing estate situated behind the terrace. At some point probably in the mid twenties the local council had installed a street light on the path. However due to the narrow width they were unable to use a standard lamp post so it was fastened to the exterior of my house wall. They set up a payment as "rent" on the patch of wall at one shilling and sixpence (7.5 pence) per year. In the twenties this would have probably been enough for an evening in the pub but by the time I moved in it was not worth having. However every year I received a first class stamped envelope complete with a typed account letter and a hand written cheque to the value of 7.5 p signed by the borough treasurer, the accounts dept and the official who had raised the cheque in the first place. What this must have cost the local council I don't know but I would have settled for a small one off payment. I had one of the cheques in a frame in the hallway as a talking point for many years. I would have been embarrassed to present it to the bank.

[henrybParticipant @henryb]

I just use the back of unwanted paper to mark measurements on for marking out.

[BazyleParticipant @bazyle]

I too get the threatening letters from the Beeb. I feel sorry for the postman having to come all the way to the end of the road and up my overgrown path in the rain when there is no other post. I told him he didn't need to bother but he's obliged to deliver all the crap no matter what.
Trouble is all the junk mail is on glossy paper that's not nearly as good for lighting the fire. I have to get proper newspaper off a friend who is an avid daily newspaper reader. I must stockpile some as I need about 300 sheets a year for the rest of my life.

[Trevor Crossman 1Participant @trevorcrossman1]

Probably over 15 years ago I had a conversation with one of our delivery men who once had been the area rep. for Wiggins Teap, one of the paper companies, and he told me that far from being the end of that industry, increasing computer use would help it to flourish. It seems that he is right and what seems to happen is that 'operatives' just do what computer says, they don't have either the time nor inclination to notice whether or not the automatically generated letter(s) is needed. Automated systems make the problem worse because there isn't a human who you can talk to about it, unless of course you want to dial what is laughingly called Customer Services and spend an increasing amount of one's remaining time on Earth 'on hold' and listening to Vivaldi or Clannad or some other boring synthetic 'pop' track on an endless loop. My collection of threatening letters automatically generated twice/thrice a month for the past 20 years by the TV Licence Gestapo is now over a foot high since I gave up trying to get them to stop. As someone has said earlier, this and all the other garbage mail helps to keep our posties and refuse/recycling collectors in work and even if most of the junk is unburnable glossy stuff, there's usually an envelope or two good for firelighting ( after being used for design doodles in the workshop- – – two birds/one stone and all that)

Trevor.

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