Ink jet printer woes

[modeng2000Participant @modeng2000]

https://www.cartridgepeople.com/HP/DeskJet/DeskJet-500-Ink-Cartridges

[Simon CollierParticipant @simoncollier74340]

It will not print if any cartridge is "empty". Until this recent problem, it has been very good. I've only used genuine ink. Thanks for all the replies and advice. I don't think I could live with just black and white prints.

[SillyOldDufferModerator @sillyoldduffer]

Posted by An Other on 30/01/2020 17:50:32:…

… unless you are running Windows, don't buy an Epson. Hope this saves someone a lot of grief.

Epson are on my linux 'avoid' list too!

However, anyone having trouble with getting their printer to work with Linux/mac/amiga, might consider Turboprint, which is a paid for print spooler (about £35) specifically supporting printers not well supported by os other than Windows. It's a bit fancier than Cups (especially fo photography) so you get more for the money than just a driver. 30 day free trial available.

Dave

[Robert Atkinson 2Participant @robertatkinson2]

If anyone near Cambridge (UK) wants a working, small Samsung laser printer I have one free if they want to come and pick it up. Send me a PRIVATE MESSAGE if interested. Don't reply here and no I won't post it.

Robert G8RPI.

[John BaronParticipant @johnbaron31275]

Posted by modeng2000 on 30/01/2020 19:52:18:

https://www.cartridgepeople.com/HP/DeskJet/DeskJet-500-Ink-Cartridges

Thanks ! I'll check with them. It would be nice to keep the old thing going.

[John BaronParticipant @johnbaron31275]

Posted by Robert Atkinson 2 on 30/01/2020 20:42:22:

If anyone near Cambridge (UK) wants a working, small Samsung laser printer I have one free if they want to come and pick it up. Send me a PRIVATE MESSAGE if interested. Don't reply here and no I won't post it.

Robert G8RPI.

I would take it but I'm up in North Yorkshire and don't get down there very often.

[Kiwi BlokeParticipant @kiwibloke62605]

Have you seen the documentary video 'The Lightbulb Conspiracy'? It's on YouTube. Take Valium and a blood-pressure pill before, though… Essential viewing for the likes of us, who enjoy the reliability and life-span of honestly-engineered machines.

The video contains the revelation that Epson inkjet printers apparently contained (may still, for all I know) a page-counting (or ink-usage tallying) chip, which permanently shut the beastly device down at a certain number. Not user-resettable. The given reason was to avoid the pad which captures the ink from head-cleaning cycles from saturating and overflowing. Yeah, right!

I have a 16-year-old Epson photo-quality printer, which has printed a handful of beautiful A4 photos. The rest of the time, it just wasted ink and paper at a ferocious rate, trying unsuccessfully to unclog the heads. Infrequent usage, of course. Also had problems with Linux compatibility, which also affects an Epson scanner. Well satisfied with my Brother double-sided printing mono laser, operating fine on Linux.

Any company that cynically engineers sabotage devices into their products should be dealt with most severely.

Edited By Kiwi Bloke on 31/01/2020 00:04:59

[Nick Clarke 3Participant @nickclarke3]

Posted by Kiwi Bloke on 31/01/2020 00:02:02:

Have you seen the documentary video 'The Lightbulb Conspiracy'? It's on YouTube. Take Valium and a blood-pressure pill before, though… Essential viewing for the likes of us, who enjoy the reliability and life-span of honestly-engineered machines.

The video contains the revelation that Epson inkjet printers apparently contained (may still, for all I know) a page-counting (or ink-usage tallying) chip, which permanently shut the beastly device down at a certain number. Not user-resettable. The given reason was to avoid the pad which captures the ink from head-cleaning cycles from saturating and overflowing. Yeah, right!

I have a 16-year-old Epson photo-quality printer, which has printed a handful of beautiful A4 photos. The rest of the time, it just wasted ink and paper at a ferocious rate, trying unsuccessfully to unclog the heads. Infrequent usage, of course. Also had problems with Linux compatibility, which also affects an Epson scanner. Well satisfied with my Brother double-sided printing mono laser, operating fine on Linux.

Any company that cynically engineers sabotage devices into their products should be dealt with most severely.

Edited By Kiwi Bloke on 31/01/2020 00:04:59

Not new I'm afraid even 20 years ago Texas laser printers used similar devices to 'turn off' drums, waste toner bottles and toners – as did the clones (Can't remember 100% but perhaps QMS and Sharp??) These were influenced by time and not amount of resource used.

Even today I am torn between the HP system on Laser printers and most inkjets where it will try to print, even if empty – you can always get a vital, if poor quality print until it is totally dead, and the Brother system which measures how much toner has been used and then stops without the option meaning you should never get a bad print – all other consumables can be reset on the control panel.

[SillyOldDufferModerator @sillyoldduffer]

Posted by Kiwi Bloke on 31/01/2020 00:02:02:….

Any company that cynically engineers sabotage devices into their products should be dealt with most severely.

…

The idea is not new. Planned Obsolescence was conceived by Alfred Pritchard Sloan (Head of General Motors) in 1924, and I doubt the idea was totally original then.

As customers, we obviously want top-quality tools that last for ever at minimum cost. Unfortunately meeting that demand is fatal to the supplier, and not good for the rest of us either. Having to replace products and services is a good thing because it stimulates the economy.

Once demand for a new product has been fulfilled, the market collapses and the supplier may go bust. Unless he does something else, his employees all lose their jobs, no tax is paid and shareholders get no dividends. The last two are important because your pension depends on them.

While we all get richer under this system, there is a cost. Wealth based on growth is wasteful of the world's finite resources, too many fripperies, and growth can't last for ever. In the worst case the bubble will pop and civilisation collapse, in the best case the future will be different.

Dave

 

 

Edited By SillyOldDuffer on 31/01/2020 11:40:39

[Nick Clarke 3Participant @nickclarke3]

Posted by SillyOldDuffer on 31/01/2020 11:38:53:

Once demand for a new product has been fulfilled, the market collapses and the supplier may go bust. Unless he does something else, his employees all lose their jobs, no tax is paid and shareholders get no dividends. The last two are important because your pension depends on them.

Hence, despite all our moans, Win 2, 3, 95, 98, XP, 7, 10 plus all of those versions of OSX and iOS and Android.

And not only because they are getting better all the time!

Edited By Nick Clarke 3 on 31/01/2020 12:03:36

[An OtherParticipant @another21905]

And I thought I was alone struggling with Epson!. However, I would like to make one point in Epsons favour, but unfortunately they seem unable or unwilling to capitalize on it. Their older printers (my 4000 for example) do have these evil electronic monitoring chips which turn the things off, and up to a point I can see the reasoning: it does note in the instructions for the printer that the thing may stop printing if the absorbant pad which is apparently fitted below the heads becomes saturated with ink – they advise contacting Epson for (professional?) replacement – but you can't, because they won't answer qu0eries. I guess this does justify the cock-eyed reasoning for using the electronic switch-off (sounds like Volkswagen diesel cheater, doesn't it?).

But their later printers, such as the 382 and 3150 I mention are generically called 'ecotanks', and have large ink reservoirs which you have to fill from bottles of ink. When I bought the the 3150, it came with the three bottles of coloured ink, and two bottles of black. (If I remember correctly, they claim 3000+ black and white printings from a single refill, and I can confirm that the 382 which I managed to get going has already produced many pages. I also produce high-density PCB negatives using the printer, which uses 'lots' of ink, and so far there has been no need to refill the tanks). As far as I can see, these printers also have no electronic cheaters, so you can 'print' with empty tanks (confirmed) but they do warn you that this could damage the heads, which seems fair enough to me – but why no good driver for a widely used OS, and no scanning ability?

This was apparently in direct response to the complaints about expensive, restricted-life cartridges. I think this is a great idea, but has been ruined for me because they won't put a small amount of effort into producing an easily-deployed driver for Linux. Before someone jumps on me – there is an Epson LInux driver, but it is virtually useless – doesn't always install and work correctly, and has dependencies on deprecated and obsolete files – same for the scanner mode.

Now I will watch this thread to see someone justify why they don't need to produce a driver. Good luck to the WIndows users.

[Nick Clarke 3Participant @nickclarke3]

Posted by An Other on 31/01/2020 12:39:04:

ruined for me because they won't put a small amount of effort into producing an easily-deployed driver for Linux. Before someone jumps on me – there is an Epson LInux driver, but it is virtually useless – doesn't always install and work correctly, and has dependencies on deprecated and obsolete files – same for the scanner mode.

Now I will watch this thread to see someone justify why they don't need to produce a driver. Good luck to the WIndows users.

Linux is in the main community supported so if a user hasn't the skills or has no need to there will be no driver from that source – one of the issues with open source software I'm afraid.

The few commercially supported distributions may choose to develop a driver – if someone who pays needs it. These will often be made available to everyone else.

When you bought your printer you were told what versions of what operating systems it would support. It upsets me, I suspect even more than you, but there was no commitment then to support any future ones.

[TrickyParticipant @tricky]

Posted by Nick Clarke 3 on 31/01/2020 10:54:49:

Not new I'm afraid even 20 years ago Texas laser printers used similar devices to 'turn off' drums, waste toner bottles and toners – as did the clones (Can't remember 100% but perhaps QMS and Sharp??) These were influenced by time and not amount of resource used.

I do not believe this is correct for two reasons. One because I used to work for Sharp in the marketing department for these printers and two because my JX9685 printer is still working after over 25 years.

In fact the Texas Instrument printers were actually made by Sharp with about 10 TI to 1 of Sharp.

After having 3 ink-jet printers over the last 10 years I have now bought a Lexmark MC3224dwe colour laser MFP which is much more suited to my occasional printer use.

Richard

i

[John BaronParticipant @johnbaron31275]

Posted by Nick Clarke 3 on 31/01/2020 12:55:55

Linux is in the main community supported so if a user hasn't the skills or has no need to there will be no driver from that source – one of the issues with open source software I'm afraid.

This is unfortunately a general problem and also why people wanting to move to Linux are told to check compatibility of the hardware that they are going to use with Linux.

[Nick Clarke 3Participant @nickclarke3]

Posted by Tricky on 31/01/2020 13:27:20:

Posted by Nick Clarke 3 on 31/01/2020 10:54:49:

Not new I'm afraid even 20 years ago Texas laser printers used similar devices to 'turn off' drums, waste toner bottles and toners – as did the clones (Can't remember 100% but perhaps QMS and Sharp??) These were influenced by time and not amount of resource used.

 

I do not believe this is correct for two reasons. One because I used to work for Sharp in the marketing department for these printers and two because my JX9685 printer is still working after over 25 years.

In fact the Texas Instrument printers were actually made by Sharp with about 10 TI to 1 of Sharp.

After having 3 ink-jet printers over the last 10 years I have now bought a Lexmark MC3224dwe colour laser MFP which is much more suited to my occasional printer use.

Richard

i

From my own direct experience:

About 22 years ago the College I then taught at bought 15 TI mono laser printers. On the side of each of the toner, waste toner bottle and drum (and possibly the fuser as well – I can't recall) there were what looked like 20mm glass fuses which were in fact the time elapsed elements. They were not replaceable individually, but when you replaced the toner, bottle or whatever there was new one attached.

Your choice of a Lexmark colour laser is in my personal opinion a good 'un – as the ex IBM printer organisation they have always produced quality kit, even their cheapest models.

Edited By Nick Clarke 3 on 31/01/2020 14:49:48

[Ex contributorParticipant @mgnbuk]

I'm another who has given up on Epson printers after two in succession gave persistant problems.

I can't recall the model numbers. but both were 5 ink photo printers. The first came with roll paper adapters, which was handy as at the time I was editing a motorcycle club magazine & did quite a lot of photo printing every two months for the magazine. Getting the thing to want to work was always an issue & I reckon it used more ink cleaning & unclogging itself than it did printing. Cost quite a bit in wasted photo paper too, with failed prints happening often – not at the start of a print usually, but half way through. Gave up on it in the end and sold it on Ebay, somewhat suprisingly to the "Photo Me" photo booth operating company.

The replacement Epson photo printer cost a third of the price of the first, but couldn't use the roll paper.. That had similar clogging issues, then just died with a fatal error after a couple of years. I guess this was related to the full waste ink pad bit – annoying as the ink pad would mainly be full of ink wasted trying to unblock the thing.

Currently running an entry level Canon MG3250 3-in-1 machine. Not a photo printer as such, but does a reasonable job & doesn't seem to mind being left for periods between uses. Cartidges cost more, as they include the print head (different technology to Epson), but I am only on the first replacement pair of cartridges in two or three years so running cost are not too bad. At least with this design a duff print head is easily replaced by installing a fresh cartridge – Epson print heads (if available) seem to cost more than a new printer. Can't comment on operability of the Canon with Linux, as I haven't tried to print in my tentative forays into Linux.

I did try a mono laser printer, a Brother, but that died after two toner cartridges. The part it needed was available, but cost £90 to repair a printer that cost £50. That one just got recycled. Similarly at work – an expensive Brother colour laser printer only lasted around two years, whereas the Brother A3 inkjet 3-in-1s last 5 years or more.

I just treat them as another disposable item now.

Nigel B.

[TrickyParticipant @tricky]

Nick, If you bought the TI printer only 22 years ago then they probably were not Sharp manufactured as I don't think the Sharp models were still in production then. Also they did not have a separate waste toner bottle, just a 15,000 toner/developer cartridge and 30,000 drum.

From about 1996 Sharp concentrated on changing from analogue copiers to digital copiers and used these as a basis for their printers. One of my responsibilities was to help convert the analogue copier sales force into selling digital copier/printer/scanners – not an easy job!

Richard

[Nick Clarke 3Participant @nickclarke3]

As I said I was not certain about the branding on the clones but ours were Texas badged.

Thanks for the info,

Take care.

Nick

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