Flat living and workshop dreaming

[Andrew TParticipant @andrewt]

Query on tools for a powerless workshop

[Andrew TParticipant @andrewt]

Hi all

Silly question but as a flat renter options on workshops are severley limited (not even allowed to put up a picture without permission from landlord and not sure the wife or neighbours below would be happy with a lathe in the living room !)

I have recently rented a garage from one of the neighbours in another block of flats for storage purposes, and the idea came to mind for a little workshop …… but alas there is no power and the garage is not close to the block of flats.

I see adverts for older lathes that still have the treadle fitted come up quite frequently, are these a practical proposition ?

Other options come to mind such as:-

Hackspace shared workshops but the closest is Hackney / Brighton and being based in Redhill Surrey they are a touch too far and again not sure me dissapearing for hours at a time would go down well with the wife !

Generator but concerned the noise would upset the neighbours and loose me the garage / cost starts to add up and eat into a very limited budget

Battery power but I dont think I would get the necessary power / length of time from this options and would have to drag batterys back for charging which I believe is not a good idea in flat due to explosion risk !

Im a complete beginner (trained as a furniture maker) but my main area of interest is with medium sized stirling engines and have some ideas I would like to experiment with.

I guess I could CAD up the parts and get made but im working on basis of trial and lots of error so this cost would also quickly increase and still need some form of workshop to assemble and test out.

Any suggesttions / or local groups that run a workshop share ?

Andy

[David Clark 13Participant @davidclark13]

Hi There

Join the SMEE.

regards David

[SteambuffParticipant @steambuff]

Andy,

Is there a local ME club nearby that you could join, most have a workshop.

Dave

[Andrew TParticipant @andrewt]

Thanks will take a look into that

Andy

[Andrew TParticipant @andrewt]

Thanks will take a look into that

Andy

[David LittlewoodParticipant @davidlittlewood51847]

Robin,

Your other option is to tailor your activities to suit the space. If you made something like small stationary engines, or Gauge 0 (or even gauge 1) locos, you could do all that on a micro lathe, which you could easily put on a board and use in a spare bedroom or dining table (with appropriate permissions of course!). A Unimat or Taig/Peatol size would be easily manageable in a flat. That would give you a few years of experience, then when you have more space you would have a better idea of what your interests wer, and what to buy.

One of my fellow Gauge 0 Guild members does some fantastic work on a Unimat inside his home.

David

[joegibParticipant @joegib]

Hi Andy,

I live in a flat so I've some experience of this. Fortunately, my landlord's not unduly intrusive but your situation seems a bit more constrained. I think the key issues in this situation are:

1. Size of machinery (as David says)
2. Noise — obviously, you don't want to bring the landlord down on you via neighbour complaints.
3. Disguise — can you camouflage your kit if the landlord wants to inspect the flat?

As regards size of machinery, there are lots of small lathes, new and secondhand, you could consider. Have a look at the Lathes UK site here:

Lathes UK

Machines worth looking at are:

Emco Unimat
Hobbymat/Prazzi*
Cowells/Perris*
Peatol/Taig*
Sherline
Proxxon

On the noise front those machines I've asterisked have induction motors which means they are quiet as compared to machines with series-wound motors and DC types. You could also look at the Chinese machines e.g. the Sieg C3 — modest cost + fairly big work envelope for their size but mug up about them before committing. But I don't know how quiet they are — maybe others can comment. As a general principle favour belt driven rather than geared-head machines. Sadly, no boilermaking for you — maybe you can buy one for testing.

As regards disguise, I'm assuming that you have, say, a spare bedroom you can use. Maybe you can disguise this as a 'study' with, apart from bookshelves and stuff, a couple of stout cabinets (e.g. recycled kitchen units) forming a base for your machines and a place to hide them!

Finally, in this situation cleanliness is important, not only as part of disguise but for domestic harmony. Swarf trailed into bed is a definite passion killer!

Joe

Edited By joegib on 14/11/2012 15:58:40

[AndyfParticipant @andyf]

Though I've never used a treadle lathe, L C Mason asserts in his book "Using the Small Lathe" that it is quite practicable for a small machine, and gives instructions (mainly concerned with adding weight to the flywheel) for converting a treadle sewing machine stand to the purpose. I think he regarded a "small" lathe as being one of up to Drummond or Myford size.

If there is a significant other in your life, maybe you could convert an exercise bike and persuade them to keep fit whenever you fancy a bit of machining!

Andy

[Another JohnSParticipant @anotherjohns]

Also Kozo Hiraoka – google his name, too!

I seem to remember him having approx 8 feet x 8 feet workshop in the living room of his appartment when he was living away from Japan.

My workshop while living in The Hague was smaller than that, and I finished a Tich in there.

Noise is a problem, but the little sherline lathes are not bad at all; lots of *great* work done on sherlines. It's nice to have a machine locally, if you have to go somewhere for larger machining.

My little Tich was started on a Unimat SL, some parts done on larger machines @night school. As David says, join the SMEE, or some other society nearby.

Another JohnS.

[Andrew TParticipant @andrewt]

Thanks all, I am overwhelmed by the helpful support with my query

Currently we are renting a somewhat small 1 bedroom flat (Surrey is not cheap !) so ummm somewhat limited on space (living room has the double bed , piano (digital), and dining table / the bedroom is our living room / office due to noisy neighbours and terrible construction), coupled with my obsessive compulsion of buying books and wife's 3 filing cabinets full of scores it leaves little room remaining ! hence renting the garage for storage….

Appreciate the suggestions on the smaller machines / might just have room on the bay window for a small lathe if I come up with a smart way to have it boxed when not in use – sure the wife will not notice a few missing pot plants !

Luckily my interests at the moment are more Stirling engines / LED custom light fittings, so boiler making will be on hold at least initially !

Shame some form of community workshop system could not be set up with some form of subscription / booking system, must be plenty of schools with equipment laying idle but guess local government funding is somewhat under pressure these days + the H&S issues.

Andy

[SteveWParticipant @stevew54046]

I know I'm repeating others but try local model club and any evening classes at colleges/schools etc. These are a bit thin on the ground but if you found one you could make use of the facilities and expertiese for a fairly modest outlay.

You may even find a local modeller who would welcome some company or be prepared to give you some access in return for liquid payment

SteveW

[BazyleParticipant @bazyle]

The ME once ran a series on how to build a Stuart 10V without using a lathe. When you actually look at it a huge amount of modelling is not done at a lathe. If you are new to teh hobby maybe try making some of the non turned parts or your selected model. If you get bored or fed up and frustrated and decide not to go on you have not wasted any money on a lathe.

[Dave Jones 1Participant @davejones1]

As already suggested, a unimat would be ideal. I started out with a unimat 3 when I lived in a flat, and never had any complaints from downstairs/next door

[Sub MandrelParticipant @submandrel]

Handwork is incredibly satisfying.

Persnally though, if I was in your position it owuld be one of the tinier lathes that is no noisier or harder to store than a sewing machine. You should be able to fit a whole workshop, project and stock into a standard suitcase.

I'm sure you have the ingenuity to make some sort of protection for the work area.

Neil

[Andrew TParticipant @andrewt]

Now I like the sound of the "Suitcase Machinist" …. all good suggestions, think membership of the local model club (seems to be one in Leatherhead) / SMEE is in order

Thanks

Andy

[Ady1Participant @ady1]

I think he regarded a "small" lathe as being one of up to Drummond or Myford size

——-

Been there, tried that

I have a Drummond M series on the first floor, but it's on a wooden bench with oak skis to spread the load

A drummond lathe, cast iron driptray and legs, plus a pretty massive flywheel would in my opinion go right through the floor

With skis it would still put a LOT of weight on the floor joists and bow them

The lathe itself is fine but the rest of it triples or even quadruples the weight, the flywheel alone could be even heavier than the lathe, I could lift the lathe stripped, just, but would never even attempt the flywheel on my own

 

I started with a unimat

They're great for a beginner

If you suddenly decide you don't like oily fingers and swarf in your flesh you can stick it back in the post because there's always a ready market for them

Edited By Ady1 on 14/11/2012 22:29:42

Edited By Ady1 on 14/11/2012 22:57:13

[AndyfParticipant @andyf]

I think Mason ws thinking of a lathe mounted on a Singer sewing machine stand, Ady, sans cast iron drip tray and legs. I offer no opinion as to whether such a stand would bear the lathe!

Don't be too pessimistic about floor loadings, though; I wouldn't be too worried if three 20 stone (= 1/3 ton) rugby players stood shoulder to shoulder on my bedroom floor. Actually, that would be a rather worrying prospect, for reasons other than weight.

But as you say, Unimat or similar sized lathe would be ideal as a starter lathe for Andrew. For 20-odd years my only lathe was this £25 secondhand Perris, which can be lifted with one hand, motor and all, from a cupboard and used on the kitchen table. It would easily fit in a suitcase and has an induction motor which (as others have said) is very quiet.; in use, it's a lot less noisy than a food blender.

Other, more modern, miniature lathes which spring to mind are the Peatol and the Sherline. Or the fabulously expensive Cowells, into which my Perris has now evolved,

Andy

[Ian S CParticipant @iansc]

I would suggest a lathe a little bigger than my second lathe, a Super Adept, I bought it in 1962 for 5 pounds, Itook it home in a shopping bag. even something like the Sieg C1 could be quite useful, and if you get the table that goes with it, it would not be too hard to make a box to go over the top of it, you can then put one of the pot plants on top, WHAT LATHE? there's no lathe here! Ian S C

[Andrew TParticipant @andrewt]

If I cover the box in a Cath Kidston flowery print im sure it will be accepted !

[dcostaParticipant @dcosta]

Hello Andrew!

Here ***LINK*** and here ***LINK*** you can find examples on how to keep a Unimat 3 lathe hidden and one of them even provides a good swarf tray.
I remember I saw somewhere a lathe on a box mounted on a sewing machine stand. I searched for it but didn't found.

Best regards
Dias Costa

[Francois MeunierParticipant @francoismeunier96697]

Hi

It reminds me of a roll top desk that I recycled into a workshop: once opened, a unimat SL and many hand tools, and after removing the vertical column and the vise and closed (and locked!) the cover, impossible to guess what I was making inside.

I have spent so many pleasant hours with it; I have made many oscillating engines and even a Stuart D10. Not louder than the vacuum cleaner necessary after a turning session to clean the rain of brass swarfs. The motor does not turn the whole day anyway, many machining and fitting sessions are silent and do not prevent listening to music or the radio. Must also avoid spraying and flooding with oil and coolant, a small brush is sufficient.

Clearly, I am a lot more comfortable in my garage now, and I make much larger models, but I have spent with my desktop workshop some of the happiest moment of my life, I was also much much younger…

I still have the Unimat, I will try to find a place for it inside, like in my youth, my garage is getting pretty chilly these days…

cheers

[JC Uknz 1Participant @jcuknz1]

I remember reading somewhere that a ME hid his lathe inside a desk or chest of drawers or something a bureau? …. as a furniture makeer this should be s snitch for you ?

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