Workshop lighting / energy costs

[not done it yetParticipant @notdoneityet]

tell us how you gained access to the board.

Bigclivedotcom likely shows how it is done – probably several times over.

[Andrew TinsleyParticipant @andrewtinsley63637]

LED's are very heat sensitive an increase of 5 degrees centigrade can shorten life drastically., I was responsible for designing and manufacturing LED machine vision units. These had closely spaced LEDs and the diminution in lifetime was horrendous. It needed a total redesign to get acceptable lifetime.

Andrew.

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

I've gone for five 43W LED battens.

If I get fed up in the workshop, I will be able to take my shirt of, lie back and develop a tan.

Neil

[Anthony KnightsParticipant @anthonyknights16741]

Posted by not done it yet on 07/10/2021 13:40:22:

tell us how you gained access to the board.

I suppose it all depends on the construction of the lamp. Mine come in a pack of five from Screwfix and are about the same size and shape as the old incandescent ones. These however have a translucent plastic hemisphere at the top end, which can easily be sawn off. In the picture you can see the two pins of the driver circuit sticking out from the bottom part of the lamp. The circular board carrying the LEDs sits on this and is held in place by the three metal tabs.

[john fletcher 1Participant @johnfletcher1]

Many thanks Anthony worth knowing, I'll be getting to work with my Dremel as we have a couple of dud ones. John

[Robin GrahamParticipant @robingraham42208]

Well, it's all been a bit of an eye-opener. I've now accumulated data over 11 days during which time I've spent five or six evenings in the workshop – the pro tem adjustments I've made are hardening myself off ( I actually work faster and more efficiently with the workshop at 17 degrees than the 21-22 in which I'd been luxuriating), and directing light to where it's needed rather than flooding.

The results so far suggest that my house + workshop electricity needs should be satisfied by 2.7 MWh / year in contrast to the 7.86 MWh /year estimated by the electricity supplier. That translates to about £100 saving  – an eighth of a roll of gold wallpaper or 20 carbide inserts –  per month, depending on how you personally reckon it.

I can make further improvements by cladding the ceiling with something painted white as suggested – I have some hardboard as Dave Halford advises, but even cardboard (thanks to Amazon, lockdowns, and my reluctance to bin anything) would do.

I don't want sell the bandsaw and go back to hand sawing as Martin recommends because I think that might put an unnecessary burden on the Ambulance service, but it's an idea I suppose.

On Peter Greene's point about the reliability of LED's I too have found that for the most part the drivers fail before the LED's themselves. I posted a question about this some time ago and someone (MichaelG I think) suggested that poor quality light switches might be a factor. I have replaced my (old) house switches with MK versions, and it's made a real difference.

Robin

 

 

 

Edited By Robin Graham on 12/10/2021 01:52:00

Edited By Robin Graham on 12/10/2021 01:56:34

Edited By Robin Graham on 12/10/2021 01:59:31

[J HancockParticipant @jhancock95746]

2.7MWh/ annum ! Wow , that's some workshop you have there.

[Robin GrahamParticipant @robingraham42208]

Posted by J Hancock on 12/10/2021 08:28:23:

2.7MWh/ annum ! Wow , that's some workshop you have there.

Errm … that's projected total house / workshop consumption. Ofgem give the average electricity consumption for a 3 bedroom house as 3,000 kWh / annum – which is 3MWh / annum in my head. Have I gone wrong there? Or was that intended ironically?

The problem is my electricity supplier is projecting 7,860 kWh (or about 7.9 MWh by my reckoning) per annum based on past usage.

I think I can do better!

Robin

 

Edited By Robin Graham on 14/10/2021 00:33:29

Edited By Robin Graham on 14/10/2021 00:35:54

[J HancockParticipant @jhancock95746]

' Guess it's normal , 'us' ' lone survivors ' forget what 'normal consumption ' was.

News is Freightliner can't afford the bill anymore, so are going forward to use diesel motive power instead.

Fuel of the future.

[JourneymanParticipant @journeyman]

Posted by J Hancock on 14/10/2021 09:09:02:

News is Freightliner can't afford the bill anymore, so are going forward to use diesel motive power instead.

Fuel of the future.

'Over the Rainbow or over and out, for now? Freightliner has grounded its fleet of class 90 electric locomotives due to steeply rising energy costs.'

Interesting thing economics! *** Link to article in RailFreight.com ***

John

[SillyOldDufferModerator @sillyoldduffer]

Posted by J Hancock on 14/10/2021 09:09:02:

…

News is Freightliner can't afford the bill anymore, so are going forward to use diesel motive power instead.

Fuel of the future.

Diesel is only 'fuel of the future' until the price goes up. And at the moment, the price of oil is rising at much the same rate as natural gas. Choppy waters ahead.

Thing is, all the rules change whenever demand exceeds supply. In the near future, whatever the answer is, it's not burning fossil fuels.

Dave

[Ex contributorParticipant @mgnbuk]

7,860 kWh (or about 7.9 MWh by my reckoning)

?

Kilowatt = one thousand watts

Megawatt = one million watts

Why do you reckon that they are the same ?

You would cetainly notice the bill for 7.9 MWh consumption – about £1185000 at £0.15 per KWh !

Nigel B.

[JourneymanParticipant @journeyman]

Possibly a little confusion over ' What Watt' and decimal places. The original statement is correct (IMHO) the cost @ £0.15 per kWh is around £1185

John

[Anonymous]

Posted by mgnbuk on 14/10/2021 10:56:38:

Why do you reckon that they are the same ?

7,860kWh is the same quantity as 7.86MWh. Note the change from comma to full stop.

The bill for 7.86MWh at 15p per kWh would be £1179.

Andrew

[BazyleParticipant @bazyle]

I think a few years ago the eco-target was 10kWh per day of energy of whatever source including heating, average for the year. Unfortunately a typical house roof PV installation only gives on average 2kWh per day, and most of that not when you need it.

[SamsarandaParticipant @samsaranda]

Bazyle, pays to have batteries to store your solar energy when produced but of course that adds to the capital costs, we have 7.4 kWh storage capacity which works very well with our panels which on a sunny summers day can produce >25 kWh. Dave W

[noel shelleyParticipant @noelshelley55608]

been green for the last 10 years ! Burning waste rape seed oil in old peugeot 306 diesels ! well it's renewable ! Noel.

[Robin GrahamParticipant @robingraham42208]

Posted by Andrew Johnston on 14/10/2021 11:24:42:

Posted by mgnbuk on 14/10/2021 10:56:38:

Why do you reckon that they are the same ?

7,860kWh is the same quantity as 7.86MWh. Note the change from comma to full stop.

The bill for 7.86MWh at 15p per kWh would be £1179.

Andrew

Thanks for the sanity check Andrew, and also to Journeyman John earlier. I honestly thought I might have lost the plot what with those pesky decimal points and powers of ten.

Apologies if I muddied the waters by talking in MWh – that was because I was thinking ballpark figures out loud and it seemed an economical way of expressing the quantities to two significant figures.

It's tough thinking about mega and micro things from a human perspective. What is a Megawatt? My point of reference is a one bar electric fire – that's a kilowatt which I can see and feel. But multiply it by a thousand and I have to rely on arithmetic and imagination.

The last time I heard (maybe a week ago) wholesale gas for delivery in November was trading at 220p per therm. That's about 7.5p per kWh but even after the hike my supplier is asking me for only 6p /kWh. So when the price cap is adjusted next spring I'm expecting a hit.

Robin.

Edited By Robin Graham on 15/10/2021 02:10:57

Edited By Robin Graham on 15/10/2021 02:11:53

[not done it yetParticipant @notdoneityet]

Robin,

Milligrams to kilograms is a factor of a million. Electronics often operate at milliWatts or even microWatts. Factors in powers of ten are far easier than those b——- therms you mentioned.

Even BTUs to therms requires applying a factor of 10^5! The only ‘odd’ conversion factor in metric is the 4.18 for heating grams of water with Joules wile measuring the temperature change in K.🙂

[Author]

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