Stationary Engine for Beginner

[Deltic007Participant @deltic007]

[Deltic007Participant @deltic007]

Hi all.

I am looking at making a start in ME and would appreciate any tips on which model to have a go at first. I fancy a stationary engine from castings to start with.Any recommendations?

Thanks in advance.

[Terry LaneParticipant @terrylane]

The Stuart 10V is the classic starting point – that was my first engine, and the first for a lot of other people as well.

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

Same here the 10v or 10H are the usual suspects for a starter casting kit with teh bonus that they contain all the other materials and fixings required not to mention build book and several articles such as Harold Hall’s

 

 

J

[Sub MandrelParticipant @submandrel]

My second project was a 10V. I followed Andrew Smith’s booklet on the construction to the letter and had no problems. It has all sizes in metric and imperial so it should suit you whatever equipment you have.

 

The first was my own design… I found the piston valve and eccentric the other day, mercifully the rest is lost to posterity.

 

The 10V is still as good as the day I finished it, despite being run on real steam!

 

Neil

Edited By Stub Mandrel on 27/11/2011 21:08:17

[NJHParticipant @njh]

Stuarts are a good choice. Construction books and articles are available and the castings are good. My first one was a No. 7A which is just a bit bigger than the No.10 . At the time I didn’t have a workshop but the local college ran an evening class ( Those were the days!)

The machinery was thus bigger than normally found at home so the larger size project was an advantage. It ran quite nicely but today I have it mounted on a bit of mahogany and it sits on my desk as a paper weight!

Good luck – you are entering into a fascinating hobby- whatever your choice of project let us know how you get on.

 

Regards

 

Norman

[WolfieParticipant @wolfie]

I’m on my first engine, a Stuart S50 more or less from scratch. I wanted to build the beam engine first but decided to get my mistakes out the way on the S50. Good move.

[1Participant @1]

What to recommend depends a bit on your capabilities and engineering experience. The common theme from previous posters is a Stuart, with the 10V seeming favourite. As a recently hooked engine maker I am building a 10V as my second engine, my first being a simple oscillating motor made from stock materials. My reasoning being that any “oops” could be cheaply discarded and replacements made without waiting for the postman to travel from Guernsey with a spare casting

The thought of ruining a Stuart cylinder at the last minute after having spent a lot of time on it worried me a bit.

There are several “wobblers” which can be quickly and cheaply made and which will give confidence and, if you are already in the groove, give scope for your own interpretation and ideas based around the given design.

 

I started with http://www.steves-workshop.co.uk/steammodels/simpleoscil/simpleoscil.htm , mainly because it is drawn in metric units. There are also a number of suggestions at www.start-model-engineering.co.uk the simplest probably being http://www.john-tom.com/html/ElmersEngines.html.

 

Whatever you decide to make, good luck.

 

Jim

[Deltic007Participant @deltic007]

Thanks all.

When i was 14 i started to make an 0-4-0 tank called Gemma run in Engineering in Minature but lost interest due to girls and beer. I still have the rolling chassis and 1 day i will finish it. I started under supervision from my dad who was a machinist all his days. Now i am 43 and after all those years and family growing up i feel it is time to make the slow start to getting tooled up myself and taking the plunge. I thought if i could do something simple i would see fairly quick results and gain encouragement from them.

 

Thanks all (again) here your responses have been great.

[Bill StarlingParticipant @billstarling10428]

Dear Hirstyboy,

If you are within reach of London I can’t recommend too highly the courses run by the Society of Model and Experimental Engineers – http://www.sm-ee.co.uk/ Even if you art not a complete beginner, you will learn a lot from the ‘Polly’ course, as well as having a thoroughly good time and meeting a lot of highly skilled and friendly people.

In the light of recent comments on this forum – I have no commercial involvement with this organisation. I am merely a satisfied customer!

 

Best wishes to all the unknown contributors from whose words of wisdom I enjoy benefiting.

 

Bill.

[NJHParticipant @njh]

Hi Hursytboy

 

Posted by Hirstyboy on 27/11/2011 21:46:20:You say you ” lost interest due to girls and beer.”

 

As someone some 25 years your senior I can confirm that the interest in
girls and beer remains – however the interest in both is now of a more
theoretical than practical nature!

 

I think I set up my first workshop in my late 30’s and it has been a source of fun ever since.Be careful who you tell of your interest though as there are always those (non-engineering types) who will seek your help with that “little job” which turns out to involve hours of (uninteresting) work and which (to them) is sufficiently rewarded with a beer!

 

Regards

 

Norman

Edited By NJH on 28/11/2011 10:11:03

[Gordon WParticipant @gordonw]

I would recommend as a truly first start one made from stock material, only because the mistakes are cheaper. BTW beer and women are also cheaper.

[Anthony KnightsParticipant @anthonyknights16741]

My first model engine was/ is Stan Brays “Suum Cuirque” which was in “The Best of Model Engineer” vol 1 and no doubt appeared in said magazine before I started in this hobby. I have said “is” as it still isn’t finished. I blame MEW because they keep publishing articles which distract me from finishing it off.The latest distractions have been Michael Cox’s features on the tangential turning tool (who says tool shanks have to be square?) and the coolant system (which I have been considering for ages but the article kicked me into doing)

I will attemt to post some pictures once I have recharged the batteries for my camera.

 

I hope you enjoy making swarf as much as I do.

Regards

Tony

[TerrydParticipant @terryd72465]

Hi,

 

You could do worse than look at the Tubal Cain books on Simple Steam Engines. The SMEE course mentioned above is based on making one of these engines. All made from simple bar stock with no expensive castings to mess up and a great sense of achievement when it works. Also positive and rewarding results are quite quick to achieve unlike most ‘casting kits’ which are much more demanding.

 

You can spend months or even years on a complex kit with little return whereas a simple oscillating engine can be made in a few days with perseverance and be quite fascinating. Remember your first Mamod?

 

Whatever you decide, enjoy the hobby and don’t get too anal about it,

 

Best regards

 

Terry

[Anthony KnightsParticipant @anthonyknights16741]

As promised earlier, here is a picture (for what it’s worth) of my first attempt at a horizontal engine. The experts will no doubt notice I haven’t cut the spokes in the fly wheel yet and that nothing has been painted. It was made almost entirely from aquired scrap, the main expense being the tiny BA nuts and bolts. While this may not inspire you, it shows what can be done one the cheap.

Regards Tony.

[John Wood1Participant @johnwood1]

yep, Terryd is quite right; get hold of both of Tubal Cain’s books on simple steam engines and these will take you from the very simple oscillating engine right up to quite advanced designs. No castings and excellent instructions are invaluable when starting out and, as Terryd says, results are often quick to acheive thus providing great satisfaction. The experience gained is invaluable and helps give confidence to go on to more demanding products.

 

The main thing is to enjoy it first and strive for perfection later.

 

All the best, John

[Alex gibsonParticipant @alexgibson50133]

thanks terryd,

i’ve just ordered both books.

 

regards

alex

 

[DavidinHKParticipant @davidinhk]

The best guidance I found for a beginner to steam models was downloaded from this site and is still available . It is Tubal Cain’s series of articles entitlted Sally – Tubal Cain builds the Stuart S50. The 10 articles are at

http://www.model-engineer.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/sites/4/documents/sally-1.pdf

 

through to

http://www.model-engineer.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/sites/4/documents/sally-10.pdf

 

David in HK

[TerrydParticipant @terryd72465]

Posted by Alex gibson on 01/12/2011 17:11:34:

thanks terryd,

i’ve just ordered both books.

 

regards

alex

 

Hi Alex,

 

Glad to be of help. The best thing about the books – apart from the designs of course – are the concise but full step by step instructions. These are great for a beginner working alone. I hope that you will not be disappointed. Let us have some pictures of your efforts in future.

 

I agree with David about the S50 by Tubal Cain, but at over £70 for the kit it is an expensive way to start for a beginner when mistakes are liable to be made.  The models in the books all use bar stock and mistakes are less painful.

 

Best regards

 

Terry

Edited By Terryd on 02/12/2011 04:45:47

[Ian S CParticipant @iansc]

Is the S 50 the one Tubal Cain built as Handmaiden? Can’t remember the full story behind that, but I think it was made with minimal machining. Ian S C

[Alex gibsonParticipant @alexgibson50133]

Hi Terryd,

I’ve just finished my first engine a stuart 10v and had planned on buying a s50 kit next. however i think a bit more practice on something cheaper would be better for me. I paid approx £100 for the 10v kit but then made a mistake on the cylinder casting and had to spend another £17 to replace it. I have a reasonable selection of bar stock, so hopefully i can make a start as soon as the books arrive.

 

thanks again

alex

[DavidinHKParticipant @davidinhk]

I haven’t read the name Handmaiden anywhere so probably not the same one. Certainly the series entitled “Sally” are far from minimal machining and include a number of very sensibly thought out improvements, including case hardening the eccentric.

 

David in HK

[TerrydParticipant @terryd72465]

Posted by Alex gibson on 02/12/2011 08:05:29:

Hi Terryd,

I’ve just finished my first engine a stuart 10v and had planned on buying a s50 kit next. however i think a bit more practice on something cheaper would be better for me. I paid approx £100 for the 10v kit but then made a mistake on the cylinder casting and had to spend another £17 to replace it. I have a reasonable selection of bar stock, so hopefully i can make a start as soon as the books arrive.

 

thanks again

alex

 

 

Hi Alex,

 

These Stuart kits are often hailed as being “ideal for beginners”. However teh folks making those claims are usually experienced machinists who have forgotten all the problems of learning how to use machines. It can take years to train a master machinist but the beginner is often working on his or her own from instructions given by someone who makes many assumptions and generalisations.

 

I think that you have made a wise decision. After all if you mess up a bit of brass bar it costs pence rather than pounds. I am sure at you will become a better machinist through this route. Let me know how you get on.

 

Best regards

 

Terry

[_Paul_Participant @_paul_]

IMHO building from stock rather than castings for a starter engine is sound advice.

 

You could have a look at Rudy Kouhoupt’s video “Building a Small Steam Engine” I think the one he constructs in the DVD’s is only eight parts and is made completely from stock materials, as with all Rudy’s videos they are quite informative.

 

Regards

 

Paul

[Sub MandrelParticipant @submandrel]

My recollection is that Handmaiden was an S50 or a Victoria.

 

I would like to read the series on it.

 

Neil

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