Lathe Milling Attachment – Disadvantages?

[Nick TParticipant @nickt]

Morning All.>>

I have a Boxford CUD lathe, a 14 x 8 foot workshop and plan to build a Sweet Pea 5" loco. Over the weekend I was looking at Boxford VM30 and Tom Senior Vertical Light mills but decided that there just isn't enough space in the workshop for one, even though my dear wife said 'just get it!'>>

I have seen a Boxford lathe vertical milling attachment for about £660, which seems a lot compared to the going price of used milling machines.>>

My question is – would a lathe based mill be a real pain to use or would it be an acceptable compromise for someone who is pushed for space and just starting out in small scale engineering. Many thanks. Nick. PS: I am not rich but sold my motorbike and a load of camera gear to fund this project.>>

[Nick TParticipant @nickt]

[paul 1950Participant @paul1950]

make the workshop bigger simples

[NJHParticipant @njh]

Nick

I would try every way I could to avoid the milling attachment. So often you will find that your workflow means moving from one process to the other and the last thing you want is things that make your project more difficult.

As in all things – listen to your wife!

Good luck!

Norman

Edited By NJH on 20/04/2015 08:26:39

[Paul LousickParticipant @paullousick59116]

3/4 of my work is done on a mill and trying to do this on a lathe with a mill attachment would take twice as long or would not be possible. My advice is to get the mill.

Best of luck with your model.

Paul.

[Swarf, Mostly!Participant @swarfmostly]

Hi there, Nick,

I would endorse all that Norman has written above and also add this:

Setting up work on a milling machine does not involve fighting gravity whereas when setting up on a lathe milling attachment (i.e. verical slide) gravity does its best to thwart accurate positioning every step of the way!!!!!

Lots of people have done amazing work using the vertical slide (I've even done some myself that I was quite pleased with) but it takes ages and is a pain in the ****!!!

If you can possibly (and safely) squeeze in a milling machine, go for it!

Best regards,

Swarf, Mostly!

[Mark P.Participant @markp]

Nick I think that your wife knows best, get the mill you will find room.
Mark P.

[IanTParticipant @iant]

However, to answer your question Nick – for others who might be interested – the answer is that the main disadvantages are the size (especially length) of work you can easily mill on the vertical slide and the rigidity of the vertical slide (when compared to using the table of a mill).

As others have also mentioned – it can also be a bit more awkward to see what is going on and does also need careful planning in work flow terms – as it takes time to mount the slide and set it up between turning operations.

So obviously – having a mill (as well as a lathe) is to be preferred if you have the means to do so but for some years I managed quite well without a mill – as did many well known modellers in years past, when they didn't generally have the money and/or affordable kit that we have today.

However my modelling work is generally small (an advantage of working in a smaller gauge by the way) and so I think is also a factor in this decision. I now own two mills, both horizontals but fitted with vertical heads. The larger one gets used mainly for my workshop projects (rather than my modelling) though.

So if you can accommodate a mill – then obviously it's nice to have access to one – but they are by no means essential. Even these days I will sometimes use the vertical slide on my small (indoor) lathe rather than have to go and set up one of the mills and clean it down afterwards. It doesn't take me that long to mount the slide and fit a milling cutter.

Regards,

IanT

[John Stevenson 1Participant @johnstevenson1]

I know many people with similar machines in a shed smaller than yours. Sounds like a reorganisation is in order.

[Nick_GParticipant @nick_g]

.

You will need a 'proper' mill sooner or later. So ease your pain and somehow make room and get one.

I am not saying that it's not possible to do the job without one, but I think you will find many things will become a chore instead of a pleasure.

I have a Boxford VM30 like the one you mention. If you like I can measure the footprint and required operating room. (overhangs and movements)

Regards, Nick

p.s. you NEED a mill.!!!

Edit :- You may find this video overview helpful https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8wmKSko4n5g if you have not seen a VM30 actually 'in the flesh'

Edited By Nick_G on 20/04/2015 09:24:43

[BikepeteParticipant @bikepete]

As everyone says – a separate mill is a vast improvement on a vertical slide and, alongside the lathe, almost indispensible for a general purpose workshop. I don't think you've said what else is in the shed but really you may have to start with the lathe and mill and fit everything else around them – sacrificing bench space if necessary, or moving storage so things are stacked more vertically to use less floor space. Good luck!

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

Nick T can you confirm if its a vertiacl slide or as I think the price suggests a column and milling head that fits to the back of the lathe.

The later is a bit more versatile and easier to use than the vertical slide but if its the VM30 I saw the add for the other day the small extra cost it would be well worth paying, infact as you will also need to buy the milling table to bolt to the cross slide there is very little in.

Just make the space

Edited By JasonB on 20/04/2015 09:51:58

[RobboParticipant @robbo]

Nick,

Is the Boxford milling attachment just a vertical slide, or Boxford's more deluxe ( and larger) version with 3-way adjustment. Price seems a lot for a slide.

Anyway, I would try and shoehorn in a dedicated milling machine, perhaps a benchtop version if all else fails, though the 2 you have mentioned are excellent.

It will pay off in reduced frustration, increased ease of working and less setting up time.

[Ady1Participant @ady1]

A milling machine is always the better option, since it can also be used as a drill press and the setup is far easier

However, a good lathe with a decent milling slide has it's uses, especially if you have a really tough job to do

A good lathe gives you the option of backgear as well, very useful for drilling big holes

Personally speaking, I wouldn't recommend the milling attachment because of setting up/dismantling issues

Edited By Ady1 on 20/04/2015 11:15:22

[KWILParticipant @kwil]

One of my mills is a VM30 which I bought many years ago, an excellent machine for its size, go for it, you will not regret it.

[SaxalbyParticipant @saxalby]

I concur with all the above posts.

I bought the Boxford vertical slide when I first got my AUD. Whilst it is useful and useable for small jobs, it is fiddly to set up, difficult to see what you are doing etc etc.

Like you had a small shed, with no room for a mill. But quickly got so frustrated with using the vertical slide that i extended the shed and bought a Tom Senior Mill.

Barry

[Nick TParticipant @nickt]

Thank you all for your helpful advice, which is much appreciated.

Few points:

(i) The Boxford attachment I have seen is described as 'Boxford Vertical Milling Slide with Vice and T Slotted Table.'

(ii) I would be very grateful Nick_G if you could let me have the dimensions of your VM30. I have done some more homework and the overall foot print of the VM30 is considerably less than a Tom Senior.

(iii) The workshop is a decent size at 14 x 8 foot but a small part of it also doubles up as a garden room with french doors where my wife and I can sit on chilly spring and autumn evenings.

(iv) One last point could someone give me some tips on inspecting a used mill?

Thank you all once again. Best wishes, Nick

[Nick_GParticipant @nick_g]

.

Where abouts in the country are you Nick.?

Nick (tuther one)

[Alan Waddington 2Participant @alanwaddington2]

With 14' x 8' to play with and permission granted I would be out shopping for a Bridgeport !

on a more serious note, the biggest part of many millers is the chip tray, I've seen Tom Seniors with the tray cut

down to fit in a corner, you could probably remove it all together if you're not fussed about having flood coolant.

As others have said, I reckon you will soon get fed up with milling operations in the lathe.

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

If you haven't got room for the larger mills, even the little X0 mill would probably let you do more a than the milling attachment.

At a push, with a mill you could lose the drill press, although I wouldn't really want to do that.

Neil

[Dave HalfordParticipant @davehalford22513]

Get a Centec 2A or 2B, then you have room for a rotary table + you dont have sensitive circuit boards to blow from lack of use nor plastic gears to break from minor beginers miss-treatment.

This to watch for –

Holes in the table

A lot of backlash in the lead screws.

Gears are always noisy anyway

[BikepeteParticipant @bikepete]

"(iv) One last point could someone give me some tips on inspecting a used mill?"

Worth a read here and here.

[Howard LewisParticipant @howardlewis46836]

Not familiar with the Boxford, so unable to comment on the rigidity, but agree with all previuosly posted.

Having used a Vertical Slide, I was none too impresed with rigidity, and so bought a Rodney Milling Attachment for my Myford ML7.

I did not like the way that it shook the lathe, like a terrier with a rat.

Maybe that was my fault, for being too brutal, but made me buy a RF25 Mill/Drill. That was the largest that would fit into the shop Even that deflects under load.

But it is a Mill/Drill not a two ton Cincinatti! You get what you pay for. Just wish that I had the space for a proper knee type mill.

As everyone says "Buy a Milling Machine". One, it will outperform an accessory on a lathe, AND Two, you can use the mill to make something without disturbing the job in the lathe. (Believe me, one day that day will come!)

Howard

[RobboParticipant @robbo]

I have now seen the device you have been looking at, and I would say "Don't even consider it" – far too expensive for what it is

This is of course a matter of opinion, sellers are free to ask what they like, as buyers are free to spend their cash how they wish.

[Nick TParticipant @nickt]

Evening All,

I really appreciate all your help and advice.

Nick_G I live in Redhill, Surrey and would appreciate the dimensions.

Regards, Nick

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