Soldering to gold plating

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Soldering to gold plating

Home Forums General Questions Soldering to gold plating

Viewing 17 posts - 1 through 17 (of 17 total)
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  • #807472
    Stephen Harris 5
    Participant
      @stephenharris5

      Hi All.

      I am converting some older 00 gauge locos to “DCC ready” by adding an 8 pin decoder socket.

      The sockets have gold plated pins and I am finding it difficult to tin them successfully.

      Is there a preferred flux for this please.

      Regards.  Steve Harris

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      #807480
      Michael Gilligan
      Participant
        @michaelgilligan61133

        This is not a proper response to your question, but I would be wary of doing that

        Gold and Lead [although I’m not sure about Tin] react in strange ways

        … the word ‘embrittlement’ springs to mind

        Unplated pins would be my preference.

         

        MichaelG.

        #807488
        Julie Ann
        Participant
          @julieann

          It should be easy peasy to solder to gold plating using any standard electronics soft solder. It is common to specify an electroless nickel immersion gold finish on PCBs prior to automated assembly.

          No special fluxes are needed, so I’d question the solder being used. Or, possibly, the iron?

          Julie

          #807492
          Peter Cook 6
          Participant
            @petercook6

            This paper seems to support Michael and disagree with Julie Ann.

            #807495
            Fulmen
            Participant
              @fulmen

              Actually it confirms Julies claim. The high solubility of gold in tin should make it easy to wet. That it can lead to long term failures is another (but still relevant) issue.

              One possible explanation could be that the solder strips off all the gold, exposing a less compatible metal underneath?

              #807498
              Michael Gilligan
              Participant
                @michaelgilligan61133
                On Fulmen Said:

                […]

                 

                That it can lead to long term failures is another (but still relevant) issue.

                […]

                That was really my concern.

                MichaelG.

                #807500
                Bazyle
                Participant
                  @bazyle

                  This is a well known problem in electronic engineering circles though having been off the coal face for a couple of decades I’m a little hazy on the details. Although it seems to solder easily especially with older solder at the interface a gold/tin eutectic forms which is brittle. The compound grows over time by diffusion of the gold into the solder so can take a while to fail.
                  Our technique on gold plated copper was to apply solder (“tinning”) then wick off the solder which had absorbed the gold. Repeat 2 or 3 times which was found to be enough. When possible the gold was nickel plated as a barrier.

                  #807510
                  Maurice Taylor
                  Participant
                    @mauricetaylor82093

                    Hi,   Would this socket and lead be suitable , I’ve used these.

                    EBay 286218017391

                    Maurice

                     

                    #807512
                    Stephen Harris 5
                    Participant
                      @stephenharris5

                      Hi, Thanks for all the replies.

                      Makes me wonder why makers gold plate these if there is going to be a problem with the solder.

                      I’ve also got a pack of DCC supplies wheel pickups and they have a neat little pad( plated) to solder to.

                      I will try another solder and try to scrape the gold off the part that needs to receive the solder.

                      Again, thanks for the advice.

                      Regards.

                      #807519
                      Julie Ann
                      Participant
                        @julieann
                        On Stephen Harris 5 Said:

                        Makes me wonder why makers gold plate these if there is going to be a problem with the solder.

                        There isn’t; must be tens of billions of gold/solder joints worldwide on PCBs. The reality is that the gold layer is very thin, about a tenth of a micrometre. Even if all the gold is disolved it isn’t enough to reach the 3% or so of gold needed to cause embrittlement.

                        My practical experience is that it is very easy to solder to a gold plated pad. So scraping the gold off is just avoiding the underlying problem rather than identifying and solving it.

                        Julie

                        #807523
                        Michael Gilligan
                        Participant
                          @michaelgilligan61133

                          Stephen

                          A flash of gold plate is a very good way of keeping [say] a solder pad on a PCB free from corrosion … The devil in your case comes in the detail, as evidenced by the discussion.

                          I mentioned embrittlement [which can develop with ageing] because it could be significant in your ‘dynamic’ situation.

                          I fear that “only time will tell” … but at least you are now aware of the possibility.

                          MichaelG.

                          #807554
                          Robert Atkinson 2
                          Participant
                            @robertatkinson2

                            I’m with Julie,

                            The advantage of gold plating in terms of solderability far outweigh the tiny possibility of embrittlement. It is very common practice .
                            I’d suggest that the either the gold plating isn’t gold (very possible with new parts from the far east) or coated with someting like varnish. Also possoble that it is very thin over a hard to solder substrate and is being totally dissolved.

                            Robert.

                            #807567
                            Nealeb
                            Participant
                              @nealeb

                              Something over 50 years ago I was an electronic engineering apprentice at Marconi in Chelmsford and spent a bit of time in the wiring shop training centre. This was in the days when the discrete components – resistors, etc – that I used for building amateur radio kit at home often needed a quick pass with fine sandpaper to clean off corrosion before soldering. Semiconductors sometimes came with gold-plated leads which always soldered very easily. At Marconi, we were taught that the joint was potentially unreliable (as mentioned already) and given that they built avionics and “stuff” that went in the sharp end of missiles, that was unacceptable. So we had two small pots of liquid solder in front of us, electrically heated. You dipped the leads in pot 1, then pot 2, to remove all gold but leaving the leads tinned and ready for soldering. From time to time, someone came along and took pot 1 away for gold recovery. Pot 2 was promoted to pot 1 and you were given a new pot 2.

                              Never worried about it at home and never had a problem soldering to gold-plated leads.

                              #807573
                              Michael Gilligan
                              Participant
                                @michaelgilligan61133

                                Just found a link to some specialist SEM images

                                https://www.semlab.com/papers/solder-joint-analysis/

                                explore or ignore according to taste

                                MichaelG.

                                #807576
                                JasonB
                                Moderator
                                  @jasonb

                                  Gold plated connectors are common for the RC market to get the best from your batteries and RC gear, can’t get much more dynamic than high performance RC cars, planes, boats, helis etc.

                                  #807585
                                  Michael Gilligan
                                  Participant
                                    @michaelgilligan61133

                                    Having jumped-in with my comment at the start

                                    … may I presume, Stephen, that you are doing something like this … but soldering direct to the socket pins

                                    MichaelG.

                                    .

                                    #807708
                                    Stephen Harris 5
                                    Participant
                                      @stephenharris5

                                      HI.

                                      Yes, Michael Gilligan,

                                      I am doing exactly as the video you sent, thanks.

                                      I have used a different flux and some other solder which I have and results are much better now.

                                      Once again thanks to everyone for your comments.

                                      Regards, Steve Harris.

                                       

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