WIN 10 again!

[Clive HartlandParticipant @clivehartland94829]

My Acer laptop was fine until Microsoft sent another download, now the laptop only boots up to the opening screen and you cannot go further. Many instances of people having the same problem after an update, cannot get into the laptop or PC..Lots of info. on the net but when I try to do it as said it's a failure.

Anyone having the same fun ?

[Clive HartlandParticipant @clivehartland94829]

Download locks up laptop.

[EmgeeParticipant @emgee]

Not the same problem but my Lenovo ideapad 110S uses W10 OS and now needs 8Gb diskspace to update the system, problem is there is less tan 8Gb space on the drive and the W10 updating tools will not use a 14Gb flash drive to update to although the MS pages state it can be done.

When I bought it I mistakenly thought 27Gb would be loads of space but now find W10 uses 19.5Gb for the OS alone. So it seems I am stuck with an OS that can't be updated with security patches.

Emgee

[I.M. OUTAHEREParticipant @i-m-outahere]

My pc got the blue screen of death after an update a couple of months back, ended up having to boot up in safe mode and do a system restore to a point before the update . Once it was sorted i did the update again and it has been fine since , in the end the issue ended up being something to do with google and windows security not letting it start up iirc.

[Clive HartlandParticipant @clivehartland94829]

I cannot even get into the Laptop, it just sits there showing time and date. I have tried using the method of stsrting/stop.statr /stop 3 times but cannot get into the page to do a repair. F numbers have no effect and I am stumped. Oh for XP to leap back into my life!

Clive

[Ady1Participant @ady1]

Oh for XP to leap back into my life!

I use XP and 8.1

8.1 is better at file and comms stuff with smartphones and wireless bits

[mechman48Participant @mechman48]

Just had similar probs signing in to my pc; put password in 3 times & still got 'wrong password' message tried to change password via link' … ' 'please wait' & blue screen appeared. switched pc of for approx 3 min then rebooted,
signed in ok this time.

​Seem as though MS always have a problem with initiating updates, always creates problems on pc / laptops etc. am seriously thinking of going over to Apple laptop with stable OS when my desktop goes belly up.

George.

[mechman48Participant @mechman48]

p.s. MS don't seem to be aware of the idiom ' if it aint broke don't fix it '… I'm with Ady1… +1 for XP & 8.1

George.

[Speedy Builder5Participant @speedybuilder5]

I wonder why I changed from Windows m/cs to MAC 4 years ago ?
BobH

[martin perman 1Participant @martinperman1]

Posted by Clive Hartland on 07/04/2018 08:26:25:

I cannot even get into the Laptop, it just sits there showing time and date. I have tried using the method of stsrting/stop.statr /stop 3 times but cannot get into the page to do a repair. F numbers have no effect and I am stumped. Oh for XP to leap back into my life!

Clive

Clive,

I think I had the same problem, I sorted it by unplugging the power and removing the battery pack, I then put it back on and conected the power and the laptop booted up again.

Martin P

[RobinParticipant @robin]

The MIcrosoft Edge browser just blew up, I can run it but it shuts down and closes it's Window after precisely 14 seconds. Unfortunately it seems I am the only person on the planet so afflicted because they are not repairing it.

I couldn't be bothered to fix it and downloaded Firefox which seems okay. Then I discovered that there is no way to uninstall Edge. There is no directory you can wipe, it is a permenant feature and Explorer 11 is no longer supported.

I do get a bit miffed with WIndows telling me that I, "Do not have permission", to do stuff and they keep making it harder to work around. Right buttoning and scanning with Defender seems to remove objections but how long will that last?

Renaming an exe as an exex is enough to get that download unexcluded and renaming back to an exe is so clever and devious they can't seem to catch it. There you go.

[VicParticipant @vic]

Posted by Emgee on 06/04/2018 23:04:07:

Not the same problem but my Lenovo ideapad 110S uses W10 OS and now needs 8Gb diskspace to update the system, problem is there is less tan 8Gb space on the drive and the W10 updating tools will not use a 14Gb flash drive to update to although the MS pages state it can be done.

When I bought it I mistakenly thought 27Gb would be loads of space but now find W10 uses 19.5Gb for the OS alone. So it seems I am stuck with an OS that can't be updated with security patches.

Emgee

Wow, 19.5 Gb just for the OS is bonkers, are you sure?

[Fowlers FuryParticipant @fowlersfury]

The amount of web space consumed by complaints about Win10 updates is staggering.
So much unwanted 'junk' consuming resources you don't want and can't delete e.g. Cortana.
I'd have swtiched to Linux years ago but for previous investment in progs which will only run in Windows.
As for the HDD space it takes up, excluding the vast number of other files & folders it creates:-

[OldironParticipant @oldiron]

I admit that MS is not the best at updates. BUT is it all their fault. All users get a warning when updates are due. I suggest that you let the PC update as soon as it wants to and not tell it to wait until later. If you do not allow the update you are going to get it at some time as W10 is a service and not a free program you can deny updates too. If you do deny updates you will eventually get to the stage when the PC is almost unusable. When you buy W10 you do not buy a program you buy the W10 service with its updates. Most updates happen in the back ground but some are bigger than others and need time to configure themselves. Most times if the pc will not boot straight away just leave it alone. The worst thing to do is keep banging keys or switching it on and off. The more you do that the longer it takes to configure.

MS does updates on a Tuesday or Wednesday in the middle of the night. Most PC's are set to do updates at around 3am or as soon as you turn on the PC thereafter . I never turn off any of my PC's so all I need to do is put in the password to boot into windows 10 when I get up if there has been an update I have failed to install manually. I have several PC's running for different uses and cannot remember the last time I had a problem with updates.

Oh and don't get me going about all those backups/repair disc we have of our system (not ) to get us out of trouble. Just boot from the repair disc and follow the instructions and all will be fixed.

Most people expect their PC/Laptop to boot up as soon as they switch it on but if an update has been scheduled this will not happen. The PC needs to be given time to install & configure the updates. I have a sister in law that phones me every month or 2 and tells me her pc will not start. I ask when was the last time she used it and the answer is always " a couple of weeks ago" I have lost track of the times I have told to her to turn it on and walk away from it for half an hour. It always works when she does that.

I have been a Windows Insider since that program was released and the most common fault on the W10 platform that I see is people's impatience. I also think that the W10 platform is excellent and a breeze to use. It cannot be easy to bring a program that has to cater to 1000's of different types and models of PC/laptop/printer etc etc.

OK so W10 does not easily run very old programs or some times not at all. Should we expect it too ? I personally do not think so. All things have a finite life. The CAD and other programs we have used for many years have run their course. Time we all started to realise that technology is overtaking us dinosaurs and update to something newer.

How many people complaining about MS W10 are using a ripped/cracked copy not only of the OS but programs such as MS Office, Autocad etc ?. I have seen it time and time again. If its ripped expect problems updating or being so far out of date as to be useless

If a PC or laptop is more than 5 years old it has had its time except to run older programs. Use them as a 2nd pc to do that.

For everyday use and to keep up with advances in technology the pc needs mechanically updating/replacing on a regular basis as well.

People who go on about how good an Ipad is at updating should try to update an Ipad one. Ha Ha no chance. unless you cheat and use the Redsnow jailbreaker or similar.

Anyway these are my thoughts on the subject for what they are worth.

regards.

[I.M. OUTAHEREParticipant @i-m-outahere]

Posted by Clive Hartland on 07/04/2018 08:26:25:

I cannot even get into the Laptop, it just sits there showing time and date. I have tried using the method of stsrting/stop.statr /stop 3 times but cannot get into the page to do a repair. F numbers have no effect and I am stumped. Oh for XP to leap back into my life!

Clive

It sounds like it isn't shutting down fully , try holding the power button down for 5 seconds or more or (even better) if on the screen there is a power icon click on it and select shut down . I wouldn't recommend pulling the battery out because if it is the old type hard drive the reader head may not be in the safe position and it can damage the drive , not sure on ssd – may cause data corruption ?

My pc went into the automatic troubleshoot mode but couldn't fix the problem but after a few tries it bought up the repair mode where you can boot into safe mode and do a restore , i never used the F keys for my issue – cant remember if it was F8 , 11 or 12 on boot up but i can check in my motherboard manual if required .

[I.M. OUTAHEREParticipant @i-m-outahere]

Oldiron,

Other than one stuff up i have zero problems with win10 .

When i first fired it up after building the pc i plugged the wifi receiver for my mouse and keyboard then my two printers that are around 4 yrs old and both worked straight up – no need to load drivers etc . I origianally wanted win7 as i have the OS disk but win7 lacks some features that the i7 chip uses , it would work but not at optimum speed and win7 is no longer supported for updates anyhow .

I will never understand the hoohaa that some carry on with over different versions of windows because if you dig around in "c" drive deep enough you will see that under the flashy wraping of the newest version you will find that win xp through to win 10 all share a common platform and microsoft has only dressed things up and added a few things here and there .

Wish i could update my beloved ipad 2 up to ios 11 ! Bastards had to find a way of making me buy a new one but i will fight to the bitter end ! ( not sure if that will be the end of me or my ipad though )

[MuzzerParticipant @muzzer]

All the predictable huffing and puffing about "how much space??!!" and endless updates – and the Linux old chestnut. But when you can get a modern solid state drive for £50 that will accommodate all that, it's not an issue how big the install is – and that's how you get a lot of the new features you probably don't even know of or need.

It's a bit of a bugger when your machine gets locked out – wish I could suggest a fix to rescue Clive but sometimes it just isn't going to happen. These days I make sure anything important is either held on the NAS (network drive) and / or (god forbid) my Onedrive or Google Drive. I've lost enough stuff over the years to have learned to have a fall back and that includes things like failed, dual redundant NAS (yes, running Linux) and bricked PCs as a result of anti virus and OS updates.

Get a second hand copy of W10 Pro from ebay for £4 (yes, it's perfectly legal) and a new SSD for £40-50 and make a fresh install. You can read up on how to make a minimal, cleanish install if you really don't want all the other stuff. No need to worry about space or speed of booting. It will transform your PC to how it was originally and the installation process these days is so quick and easy compared to the likes of XP, W7 etc. Leave XP to the Luddites and Linux to the attitudinal rebels. I like to think we are engineers and can use the tools that are at hand without getting an attitude.

Murray

[I.M. OUTAHEREParticipant @i-m-outahere]

A lot of the cheap chinese engravers and mach3 still use XP so it still has its use and as the newer machines come through that use usb and a later OS those older engravers get cheaper . One good thing about old computers is they give you time to make a cuppa while they wake up !

[KWILParticipant @kwil]

Had the same Win10 problem as Clive, clean install cleared it all up. PITA My laptop is only switched on when required so updates are automatic, when noticed.

[Ian S CParticipant @iansc]

The only problem I have since I went over to W 10 from W 7 is that the computer will not recognize my 12 year old Sony DSC-W5 camera.

Ian S C

[Rik ShawParticipant @rikshaw]

Hope nobody minds if I put in a good word for win 10. No problems with any of our machines. I put my downstairs tower together with bits I bought. CPU Intel core I7 Kaby Lake – 32gb RAM – 2TB HDD, etc. etc..

There are two other PC's in the house both high spec. and two high spec laptops we use for travelling. Could it be that win 10 steams more freely when it is not burdened with older "rolling stock"?

Rik (Now I've stuck my snout above the ramparts somethings bound to go wrong)

[Peter G. ShawParticipant @peterg-shaw75338]

Specifically to Oldiron.

If equipment is running well, and doing what is required, why should the user spend good money to replace it? My main machine is 10 years old this year, and does all that I need. It's true that I added extra RAM (to make it the same as my backup machine) and I changed the hard drive (same reason), and a few years ago I had to dismantle it to clean the exhaust outlet (it's a laptop and was overheating), nevertheless it does all that I want and need.

I use Linux Mint v.18.1 and regularly receive updates: these are performed at a time convenient to me, not at 3.00 am, or whatever time Microsoft dictates. I also use old versions of some software because a) they do the job I want, and reliably; and b) I have paid for them. One of the programs is indeed obsolete, with no equivalent replacement, therefore I would have to learn a new program, for which I have neither the time nor the inclination, especially as the program does what I want. The other old program could be updated – at a cost, but why should I when the old one is adequate for my needs?

The other software that I use is open-source and as such gets updated as and when necessary by the program support team at nil cost.

I have to say that when I hear, or read, people saying that you should update because of whatever, I do feel that these people have more money than sense. I also feel that this is a symptom of today's throwaway society. I absolutely will not replace equipment, of any sort, just to keep up with the Jones: this is why we have, for example, a 18 year old washing machine, a 20 year old caravan, and until we were forced into it due to incompatibilities, a 17 year old television. Yes, I'm well aware that modern equipment is supposedly more efficient, but if you take the overall cost of making the item in the first place, I do wonder just how much is being saved? Just consider this: There has been a lot of hoo-ha over lighting – incandescents wasting electricity in the form of heat, but were they? That heat was helping to warm the room. So we changed to CFC's. Vastly more expensive to buy, contained as I understand it, mercury, and the part that "they" didn't tell you, a gradually diminishing light output. Today, the buzz word appears to be LED's. Ok, we have a room which is dark at the best of times so last September we obtained three of the most powerful LED's available. Since then, one has failed (flickering and replaced under warranty), and now another appears to be failing (flickering again). At £15 each one has to wonder. Using incandescents, we never had a problem, other than the short life span.

Back to computing. I actually have three laptops, with the one written about above being the oldest, as my main machine. Of the other two, the backup is a better machine, bought S/H, but still old, whilst the third was rescued before my daughter sent it to the tip. It is now doing sterling service as an experimental machine, even if does have the wrong keyboard, the DVD player is somewhat duff, and the ethernet port doesn't seem to work properly.

It isn't that I can't afford to buy new – I just cannot see the necessity of scrapping something that does what is required.

And yes, I do understand that new software includes new facilities. My 5 year old car, bought new, has features on it which I have never used. That says it all.

Regards,

Peter G. Shaw

[martin perman 1Participant @martinperman1]

Posted by Peter G. Shaw on 07/04/2018 16:12:45:

Specifically to Oldiron.

If equipment is running well, and doing what is required, why should the user spend good money to replace it? My main machine is 10 years old this year, and does all that I need. It's true that I added extra RAM (to make it the same as my backup machine) and I changed the hard drive (same reason), and a few years ago I had to dismantle it to clean the exhaust outlet (it's a laptop and was overheating), nevertheless it does all that I want and need.

I use Linux Mint v.18.1 and regularly receive updates: these are performed at a time convenient to me, not at 3.00 am, or whatever time Microsoft dictates. I also use old versions of some software because a) they do the job I want, and reliably; and b) I have paid for them. One of the programs is indeed obsolete, with no equivalent replacement, therefore I would have to learn a new program, for which I have neither the time nor the inclination, especially as the program does what I want. The other old program could be updated – at a cost, but why should I when the old one is adequate for my needs?

The other software that I use is open-source and as such gets updated as and when necessary by the program support team at nil cost.

I have to say that when I hear, or read, people saying that you should update because of whatever, I do feel that these people have more money than sense. I also feel that this is a symptom of today's throwaway society. I absolutely will not replace equipment, of any sort, just to keep up with the Jones: this is why we have, for example, a 18 year old washing machine, a 20 year old caravan, and until we were forced into it due to incompatibilities, a 17 year old television. Yes, I'm well aware that modern equipment is supposedly more efficient, but if you take the overall cost of making the item in the first place, I do wonder just how much is being saved? Just consider this: There has been a lot of hoo-ha over lighting – incandescents wasting electricity in the form of heat, but were they? That heat was helping to warm the room. So we changed to CFC's. Vastly more expensive to buy, contained as I understand it, mercury, and the part that "they" didn't tell you, a gradually diminishing light output. Today, the buzz word appears to be LED's. Ok, we have a room which is dark at the best of times so last September we obtained three of the most powerful LED's available. Since then, one has failed (flickering and replaced under warranty), and now another appears to be failing (flickering again). At £15 each one has to wonder. Using incandescents, we never had a problem, other than the short life span.

Back to computing. I actually have three laptops, with the one written about above being the oldest, as my main machine. Of the other two, the backup is a better machine, bought S/H, but still old, whilst the third was rescued before my daughter sent it to the tip. It is now doing sterling service as an experimental machine, even if does have the wrong keyboard, the DVD player is somewhat duff, and the ethernet port doesn't seem to work properly.

It isn't that I can't afford to buy new – I just cannot see the necessity of scrapping something that does what is required.

And yes, I do understand that new software includes new facilities. My 5 year old car, bought new, has features on it which I have never used. That says it all.

Regards,

Peter G. Shaw

Peter,

Re Computers I must agree with you, I recently bought another Laptop for no other reason other than the previous one died, it was over five years old and it was cheaper to buy a new one, otherwise I would still be using it.

As to cars, I've never been able to buy a new one, particularly for what I need, so I search for what I can afford that will last and last May I bought a one owner 2009 Subaru Forester with only 25000 miles on the clock and until I dont need to tow up to two ton will see me out unless I change my hobby. I replace because I have no choice not because I can.

Martin P

[OldironParticipant @oldiron]

Posted by Muzzer on 07/04/2018 13:28:14:

All the predictable huffing and puffing about "how much space??!!" and endless updates – and the Linux old chestnut. But when you can get a modern solid state drive for £50 that will accommodate all that, it's not an issue how big the install is – and that's how you get a lot of the new features you probably don't even know of or need.

It's a bit of a bugger when your machine gets locked out – wish I could suggest a fix to rescue Clive but sometimes it just isn't going to happen. These days I make sure anything important is either held on the NAS (network drive) and / or (god forbid) my Onedrive or Google Drive. I've lost enough stuff over the years to have learned to have a fall back and that includes things like failed, dual redundant NAS (yes, running Linux) and bricked PCs as a result of anti virus and OS updates.

Get a second hand copy of W10 Pro from ebay for £4 (yes, it's perfectly legal) and a new SSD for £40-50 and make a fresh install. You can read up on how to make a minimal, cleanish install if you really don't want all the other stuff. No need to worry about space or speed of booting. It will transform your PC to how it was originally and the installation process these days is so quick and easy compared to the likes of XP, W7 etc. Leave XP to the Luddites and Linux to the attitudinal rebels. I like to think we are engineers and can use the tools that are at hand without getting an attitude.

Murray

——————————————————————————————–

Exactly what I was trying to say Murray. Upgrade for a few £'s or be left behind. Win 10 does much more and much quicker than all the old OS's put together. Backup or repair disc is essential. Keep your old machine for the older programs that Windows told you would not run when you ran the upgrade advisor.

I hope Colin gets his machine running again ok.

regards

[Peter G. ShawParticipant @peterg-shaw75338]

Martin P,

The main reason why I bought a new car (first in 45 years incidentally) was because a) I finally realised I can't take it with me; and b) because I was absolutely sick of the previous car & its problems, so rather than risk another s/h car and problems, we bought new. I only wish I had bought new 4 years previously.

Murray,

A question. Why should I, being as I was a reasonably happy XP user, have to fork out good money to upgrade fully working hardware just because Microsoft decide to produce an OS which will not run the programs I use. I object strongly to being forced into spending my hard-earned money just because of Microsoft's attitude. Don't refer to me as a an attitudinal rebel just because I favour Linux over the tyrannical monolith known as Microsoft which wants nothing more than to control every single PC on the planet, and thus control what you may, or may not do with your computer.

As it is, I have gained at least an extra 4 years or so of life out of my equipment by converting to Linux. And I expect to have at least another three years. And all without having to spend my money at Microsoft's behest.

Peter

ps. I should point out that I have no objection to spending money if a good case can be made for it, but as yet, no-one has made a good case for upgrading what I already have. Lots of "keeping up with the Jones", yes, but not a good financial case. It doesn't matter whether SSD's are readily available or not. I ask again, other than "keeping up with the Jones" where is the financial case?

[Author]

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