Cooling Fan Pedestal

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Cooling Fan Pedestal

This topic has 15 replies, 11 voices, and was last updated 16 February 2016 at 20:36 by Chris Evans 6.

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14 February 2016 at 16:15 #225357
martyn nutland
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@martynnutland79495
Hello All. This is never going to win any prizes at any engineering shows anywhere.

But, it is my interpretation of the Birmal fan pedestal that company made in the thousands for the magneto-fired Austin Seven. The point is, I made it with the advice and guidance of members of this forum, and it fits and works perfectly.

For the benefit of the armchair experts and 'tyre-kickers' I do know that you can now buy them for 12 quid, which is about a third of what it cost me to make mine (who cares?).

Yes, and I do know these would not have been machined at the works. They would have been Birmal castings costing ha'pennies!

Onwards and upwards,

Martyn

Edited By martyn nutland on 14/02/2016 16:17:10
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14 February 2016 at 16:15 #8005
martyn nutland
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@martynnutland79495
Austin Seven fan pedestal
14 February 2016 at 21:15 #225397
Chris Evans 6
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@chrisevans6
I hate to see rows of "restored bikes/cars" all wearing the same pattern parts. Much better to see something the owner/restorer has made to keep the vehicle running.
15 February 2016 at 07:08 #225429
martyn nutland
Participant
@martynnutland79495
Hello Chris

You almost certainly take monetary value off the vehicle by doing this sort of thing rather than preserving 'originality' with a replica as-fitted-by-the-manufacturer part. And I do like to maintain the originality if I can, or at least, only modify in period – no 12V Volkswagen electrics on an Austin Seven, for example or Nyloc big end nuts. But I've never been very into 'what's it wurf'. 32m Euro for a Ferrari in Paris last week left me rather disgusted and not from envy! So, I've made lots of parts for my Austins and have really enjoyed the process.

Martyn
15 February 2016 at 09:54 #225440
Ian S C
Participant
@iansc
If you must use locking type nuts on an engine, including the big ends, never use Nyloc nuts, you can use metal lock nuts, these use a distorted part of the thread to lock them. Big ends, split pins, or lock wire.

If you can't get the original part for a car, why not make your own.

I can remember our Machinery Club visiting "Auto Restorations" in Christchurch NZ, they were restoring for the Donington Collection, a 1921 Sunbeam TT Pair with a3L 8 cylinder double OHC motor (two 4 cyl Sunbeam engines joined)They only had one Claudel Hobson up draught carburettor, they made three more, as they had enough spare parts to build another car. Quite a few parts were made in Christchurch. I doubt if anyone could tell which carby was the original, and which were the new.

Ian S C

Edited By Ian S C on 15/02/2016 10:29:02
15 February 2016 at 10:56 #225450
Ian P
Participant
@ianp
Posted by martyn nutland on 15/02/2016 07:08:46:

Hello Chris

You almost certainly take monetary value off the vehicle by doing this sort of thing rather than preserving 'originality' with a replica as-fitted-by-the-manufacturer part. And I do like to maintain the originality if I can, or at least, only modify in period – no 12V Volkswagen electrics on an Austin Seven, for example or Nyloc big end nuts. But I've never been very into 'what's it wurf'. 32m Euro for a Ferrari in Paris last week left me rather disgusted and not from envy! So, I've made lots of parts for my Austins and have really enjoyed the process.

Martyn

Martyn

When you say 'this sort of thing' what is it you are referring to? as it seems odd if its about the part you made.

'In period' modifications is another interesting subject. I have what is now classed as a classic car, it has many modifications that I carried out when the car was only one year old. Whilst the changes are in period the 'must be kept original' brigade would downgrade the car value significantly although it matters not a jot to me as its a car for life.

Its ironic that if I replaced the modified parts with newly made items the car would be less original but worth more!

Ian P

Spelling corrected

Edited By Ian Phillips on 15/02/2016 10:57:06
15 February 2016 at 12:53 #225465
martyn nutland
Participant
@martynnutland79495
What I mean is, Ian, that the sort of modifications you made to your car, were 'in period'. They were not provided by the manufacturer but were available from somewhere like Halfords during the currency of the model, or, during what was considered to be it's reasonable or natural life expectancy. Thus, in the 30s one may have bought a gear lever extension for an Austin Seven, may have fitted 'helper springs' to the rear axle, purchased a bulb horn or even fitted an overhead valve cylinder head. In my view it is legitimate to present the car with those kind of enhancements – as you are doing – but, again in my view, it is not legitimate to be fitting to an Austin Seven pistons from some 1990s Japanese model of car or lawnmower, giving it a clutch from something similar Oriental or introducing carbon fibre components to its suspension. All these practices are relatively common, nothing to do with 'in period' modifications and hardly in the spirit of the hobby.

What I meant by 'this sort of thing' is, as I said in my original post – someone looking at my project car will immediately notice that the fan pedestal did not originate from either Birmal or the Austin Motor Company. They will suspect that some 'Joe' made it in his garden shed and, in the vast majority of cases, will not be impressed.On the other hand, I could have bought a new pedestal that would be indistinguishable from Longbridge's and look, although not be, original. And, as you say, the 'value' of the vehicle is influenced 'by this sort of thing' – by my pedestal and all the other little bits and pieces I have made – oil filler caps, petrol filler lids, control pedals, oilers etc etc. But then I don't want to sell the car!

Hope that helps clarify.

Martyn
15 February 2016 at 13:32 #225469
Michael Gilligan
Participant
@michaelgilligan61133
Martyn,

May I, as an impartial observer, comment ?
- Your pedestal appears to be a well-made 'functional replacement' for the original.
- It makes no pretence to be original, or replica; it is simply an honest substitute [rather like a pin-compatible integrated circuit]
- In that case, I find it difficult to understand how it could devalue the car by any more than the aforementioned twelve quid.
- Frankly; I think you may be 'tilting at windmills' … but if your perception is correct, then maybe you should buy a replica casting whilst they are available … keep it in a box, ready to sell-on with the car.
- Originality is one thing … fake "originality" is something else.
Keep up the good work.

MichaelG.
15 February 2016 at 14:42 #225483
Gordon W
Participant
@gordonw
I used to argue about this sort of thing, but now I just can't be bothered. I am of an age when Austin 7's and Ford pops etc. were plentiful and cheap. Very many mods were done just to get to work next day. My common mod was uprating to 12v, Just a battery and a bunch of bulbs to buy, some of the dynamos would charge, sometimes had to get a 12v dyno. Helped a lot with stasrting. Another common one was fitting a water pump, if it was found today who would know if it was of the period ?
15 February 2016 at 18:19 #225515
Tim Stevens
Participant
@timstevens64731
I would not use Nyloc big-end nuts for another reason, Martin.

The oil temperature can easily be higher than the softening temperature of nylon, and if the insert is shaken out the soft nylon can get into places where is could create havoc (eg a sump filter or oil pump).

Cheers, Tim
15 February 2016 at 18:36 #225519
michael darby
Participant
@michaeldarby61557
The comment"this sort of thing" is typical of people who consider "originality" to be the be all and end all .When these vehicles were popular, modifications and upgrades were done all the time. similar things happened to motorcycles. and is still happening today. usually these mods are done for good reasons, better handling,better braking,more power or just asthetics for the owner.if I see an early car or motorcycle, I dont care what its had done to it, its just nice to see it on the road. I have myself a Norton 1959, with clip ons, rearsets and a 5 gallon ally tank and its beautiful. its value? dont care its mine and I bought it new. I would sooner sell the house than my bike.
15 February 2016 at 19:27 #225527
clogs
Participant
@clogs
HI all,

originality is just fine in a Museum ……for those of us who use em, have ur fun make ur parts….I'd definitely prefer a a quality home made part than a cheap copy bought in from China…..it's hard enough as it is to keep em going…

…….as for the new owner of that Ferrari (I believe it'a a footballer) nuff said…..

I have 4 vehicles and 2 motorcycles from 1928-1947 and some of the parts are just not available at ANY price…..

what ever keeps them going safely has just got to be OK………

I have found that the only people that want originality are just investor's out for a profit….

oil on yer shoes, bees in ya hair…….clogs
16 February 2016 at 09:21 #225587
Ian S C
Participant
@iansc
Tim, you are right about the Nyloc nuts, I didn't stress that point in my little rant, but anywhere on an engine is no place for Nyloc.

Ian S C
16 February 2016 at 12:53 #225632
Neil Wyatt
Moderator
@neilwyatt
My (otherwise totally original and spotless) Manta got marked down at a show because I had plastic deflectors fitted to the windscreen wipers.

Neil
16 February 2016 at 14:13 #225645
Mark P.
Participant
@markp
It is like the prices asked for older motorbikes and cars in my view just because it’s old (60’s 70’s and 80’s) doesn’t make it worth what they expect. Most were made in their thousands and were nothing special, historic machines are a different can of worms.
Mark P.
16 February 2016 at 20:36 #225718
Chris Evans 6
Participant
@chrisevans6
clogs, my thoughts exactly "not available at any price" I am rebuilding a bike from 1929 and have had to make/modify parts to suit. It is done to ride not please the dreamers and purists. If anyone has a piston for a 1929 3.49HP BSA Sloper twin port deluxe put my name on it. The one going in my bike is err not correct…..
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