Oil or Grease?

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Oil or Grease?

This topic has 40 replies, 18 voices, and was last updated 5 July 2011 at 12:23 by Lawrie Alush-Jaggs.

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27 June 2011 at 13:02 #5554
EtheAv8r
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@etheav8r
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27 June 2011 at 13:02 #70871
EtheAv8r
Participant
@etheav8r
Should I use oil or grease to lubricate chuck jaws and scroll when cleaning/changing jaws?
27 June 2011 at 13:40 #70874
Steve Garnett
Participant
@stevegarnett62550
When I was wondering the same thing recently, I found that a lot of people recommended thin smears of Dow Corning G-N Metal Assembly paste in appropriate places. I’ve yet to purchase any, though. Does anybody have any idea where you can get it from?

The big snag with anything oily is that if you spin the chuck at a respectable rate, it goes everywhere. Conversely, anything too greasy retains swarf. So something like this assembly paste may well be a good compromise.
27 June 2011 at 14:39 #70875
Spurry
Participant
@spurry
Pratt Burnerd, who have been known to make the odd chuck or two, do put their name on some grease specifically for the purpose.

Whether this grease is really special or just ordinary stuff in a posh tube, I have no idea.

I got some from Rotagrip to try.

Pete
27 June 2011 at 17:12 #70880
KWIL
Participant
@kwil
I always use the Pratt Burnerd black stuff obtained from Rotagrip (The chuck people). It is a bit like Rocol moly, but more “sticky” so doea not fly off. Only a suggestion of grease is all that is required. Just make a habit of cleaning the jaw guides and scroll each time you change the jaws or after you have machined stock creating a lot of fine swarf (esp CI).
27 June 2011 at 19:30 #70890
Gray62
Participant
@gray62
Whenever I clean my chucks, I use a fine brush and apply a very thin film of copper grease to all mating surfaces. I find that this does not fly off at high speed and also is thin enough not to attract significant build up of debris.

regards

Graeme
27 June 2011 at 23:26 #70906
Steve Garnett
Participant
@stevegarnett62550
The copper grease (Copaslip) seems like a good idea. Especially when you consider the price of the Rotagrip stuff. That tube it’s in must be gold plated!
28 June 2011 at 11:02 #70931
EtheAv8r
Participant
@etheav8r
Thanks chaps… Copaslip sounds good as I already have some!
28 June 2011 at 21:05 #70962
blister
Participant
@blister
Does anyone know if ‘Copaslip’ is the same as ‘Kopa-Kote’ in Australia

I use Kopa-Kote on everything I assemble including high temperature and in harsh environments.

Just wonderin’

Regards,

Phil
28 June 2011 at 21:31 #70969
Sub Mandrel
Participant
@submandrel
Sounds like it, Phil. You Aussies have curious names for everything, especially Sellotape!

Neil
28 June 2011 at 21:43 #70970
Clive Hartland
Participant
@clivehartland94829
Phil, if its copper coloured then it must be!

Clive
28 June 2011 at 21:50 #70973
Steve Garnett
Participant
@stevegarnett62550
Posted by blister on 28/06/2011 21:05:41:

Does anyone know if ‘Copaslip’ is the same as ‘Kopa-Kote’ in Australia

Interesting. When I looked it up, it said that there was no such stuff! What it referred me to instead was ‘Kopr-Kote’. But as far as I can tell, it’s exactly the same stuff, yes.

The other product I found that would almost certainly be suitable, even though chucks aren’t mentioned by name is Molyslip Liquid Grease. This is also reasonably cheap in small quantities, and you really wouldn’t need too much of it for chucks.

Edited By Steve Garnett on 28/06/2011 22:04:20
28 June 2011 at 22:47 #70984
blister
Participant
@blister
Many thanks gentlemen for the response(s)

Neil

I think I know what you are referring to and it is rather odd what we normally call sellotape. It does though conjure up a vision that you just need to get rid of.

Steve,

Clearly it is time to get my eyes tested. You are right, it is Kopr- kote

I will see (after I get my eyes checked of course) if the Molyslip Liquid Grease is available locally.

Clive,

Bloody obvious really when you think about it.

thanks again

Regards,

Phil
28 June 2011 at 23:59 #70988
blowlamp
Participant
@blowlamp
I wouldn’t recommend Copper Grease for lubricating a chuck as it’s really an anti-sieze compound for things like exhaust bolts and wheel nuts.

Surely just a clean to remove the chips, followed by the wipe of an oily rag should do to provide enough lube to keep it running smoothly?

Martin.
29 June 2011 at 10:30 #70998
Steve Garnett
Participant
@stevegarnett62550
Posted by blowlamp on 28/06/2011 23:59:23:

I wouldn’t recommend Copper Grease for lubricating a chuck as it’s really an anti-sieze compound for things like exhaust bolts and wheel nuts.

In an ideal world that’s true, of course. But copaslip is better than no lubrication at all, and having a bit of anti-seize around the scroll is almost certainly a good thing, especially if you are using coolant around the chuck. But, all things considered, I think that the Molyslip Liquid Grease would be better, because it’s a grease that doesn’t displace under high pressure – and that’s the other thing you get at the contact points between the scroll and jaws – high pressure points and a displacing motion. ‘Ordinary’ oil, especially in small quantities, doesn’t have the same properties at all and will displace quite readily.

And having done a bit more checking, it appears that at least in the UK, you can get this grease relatively cheaply. My take on this is that decent chucks are quite expensive, and if you can prolong the life (and inevitably accuracy) of one by using an appropriate lubricant on it without spending a fortune, then you should!

Edited By Steve Garnett on 29/06/2011 10:38:53
29 June 2011 at 11:09 #71001
EtheAv8r
Participant
@etheav8r
Molyslip Liquid Grease sounds perfect – and I see MacKays in Cambridge stock it. I shall get some.

Thank you.
29 June 2011 at 11:28 #71005
Anonymous
Posted by EtheAv8r on 29/06/2011 11:09:53:

MacKays in Cambridge

Blimey, there’s a name from the past! It’s years since I’ve been there. Last things I bought in Mackays were a quality 7/16″ Whitworth spanner and some cheapo clamps at a pound a pop for DIY bodges. I also wanted some riffler files, but they didn’t stock them.

Regards,

Andrew
29 June 2011 at 11:31 #71006
blowlamp
Participant
@blowlamp
I don’t think any grease should be used on the scroll or jaws because it will hold on to the swarf.

Perhaps one of these Teflon lubricants that spray on and evaporate would be OK though.

In my experience, Copper Grease dries out quite quickly to a leave a paste that just gums things up if used as a conventional grease. It is a good anti-sieze compound and that’s what I use it for.

Martin.
29 June 2011 at 12:53 #71017
EtheAv8r
Participant
@etheav8r
Posted by Andrew Johnston on 29/06/2011 11:28:07:

Posted by EtheAv8r on 29/06/2011 11:09:53:

MacKays in Cambridge

Blimey, there’s a name from the past! It’s years since I’ve been there. Last things I bought in Mackays were a quality 7/16″ Whitworth spanner and some cheapo clamps at a pound a pop for DIY bodges. I also wanted some riffler files, but they didn’t stock them.

Regards,

Andrew

And to think that you live so much closer to MacKays than I do!

Posted by blowlamp on 29/06/2011 11:31:50:

I don’t think any grease should be used on the scroll or jaws because it will hold on to the swarf.

My Wabeco lathe has fresh, clean light coloured grease on the scroll – delivered as such from new, prepared and ready to go.
29 June 2011 at 13:20 #71022
blowlamp
Participant
@blowlamp
Posted by EtheAv8r on 29/06/2011 12:53:12:

Posted by blowlamp on 29/06/2011 11:31:50:

I don’t think any grease should be used on the scroll or jaws because it will hold on to the swarf.

My Wabeco lathe has fresh, clean light coloured grease on the scroll – delivered as such from new, prepared and ready to go.

Well naturally it’s your call, but if you bore say a brass bush in your chuck, you’ll get a lot of swarf accumulating on the inside which will work its way towards the scroll. Once it’s there it sticks to the grease and is carried around by the scroll when the job’s released.

Could that grease be for corrosion protection during transport?

Martin.
29 June 2011 at 14:03 #71023
Clive Hartland
Participant
@clivehartland94829
I have looked at my lubricant that I use and it is, ‘ G Rapid Plus’, made by Molykote and distributed by Dow Corning.

It is described as an ‘Assemblt paste’ with anti sieze properties.

This is a Graphite paste and I use it sparingly applying with a cotton bud.

It dries out and adheres to the scroll and teeth of the jaws and so far nothing has stuck to it.

Clive
29 June 2011 at 14:08 #71024
EtheAv8r
Participant
@etheav8r
Posted by blowlamp on 29/06/2011 13:20:55:

Posted by EtheAv8r on 29/06/2011 12:53:12:

Posted by blowlamp on 29/06/2011 11:31:50:

I don’t think any grease should be used on the scroll or jaws because it will hold on to the swarf.

My Wabeco lathe has fresh, clean light coloured grease on the scroll – delivered as such from new, prepared and ready to go.

Well naturally it’s your call, but if you bore say a brass bush in your chuck, you’ll get a lot of swarf accumulating on the inside which will work its way towards the scroll. Once it’s there it sticks to the grease and is carried around by the scroll when the job’s released.

Could that grease be for corrosion protection during transport?

Martin.

The grease was not the transport gunk… and this was a fully prepared ready to fly machine, unless that job was not done thoroughly?

Which is why I made the Original Post – Oil or Grease – but opinion seems to be mixed…. The idea of a dry lubricant makes a lot of sense to me – but there again I am not an engineer and basically I know nothing…
29 June 2011 at 14:18 #71025
Ian S C
Participant
@iansc
I use ordinary general purpose grease inside the chuck, not on the scroll side, that gets oiled. I clean it out at least once a year, depending on the amount of use, and whether I’v been turning a lot of cast iron. Grease is what was in there, so gease is what goes back in there! Ian S C

Edited By Ian S C on 29/06/2011 14:22:59
29 June 2011 at 14:24 #71026
blowlamp
Participant
@blowlamp
OK, but it may help to remember that grease is just oil that has been thickened in consistencey to help it stay put.

So if you can put a film of oil on something and have it stay there, why would you use grease?

All I’m arguing is that a thin layer of oil is sufficient to keep your chuck running smooth, without the tendency for swarf to stick.

I agree with those that advocate dry(ish) lubricants for this application.

Martin.
29 June 2011 at 16:41 #71031
Keith Long
Participant
@keithlong89920
Hi

Has anyone tried powdered graphite for this application – you can still get it from locksmiths.

Keith
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