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My Toyo ML1

This little beauty will be a work in progress as I add to it.

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Pete Gilbert 115/07/2014 22:48:19
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33 forum posts
10 photos

toyo ml1.jpg

Purchased off Ebay for £285 plus shipping. Swiss Army knife shown for size comparison.

I've already cut stainless steel, brass, ABS and nylon. In fact the stainless was being reduced within 10 mins of unboxing at home. (I always have important stuff delivered at work, as I once found eight quids worth of high speed RAM sticks under the bush by the door!!)

Oh, and this arrived today, from Axminster Tools

Axminster SIEG C0 Compound Slide

comp slide.jpg

The locator on the underside is too big, so I'll have to modify it at work. 12mm dia with the T slots being only 8mm.

slide locator.jpg

The T slot nut is rubbish as it's been tapped at an angle to it's own flats! So I'll be making another. Ironically, it has an 8mm locator flange, unlike the slide base!

This item is new, the red/orange bits here and there are what remains of the storage grease that I mostly washed off in the parts wash.

I'd really like a quick adjust tool post, but beggars can't be choosers at this stage.

Primary work for this machine will be improving or re-making various items for my RC planes. Such as eccentric propeller adaptors and light weight wheels etc.

It's all fun. face 23

Michael Gilligan15/07/2014 23:03:13
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16638 forum posts
725 photos

Pete,

You have preumably seen the lathes.co.uk pages, but you might like to look at the Toyo Cameras ... which is what Mr Sakai originally designed it for.

I look forward to seeing what you make of it, and what you make with it.

MichaelG.

Pete Gilbert 116/07/2014 19:46:58
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33 forum posts
10 photos

Yes indeed Michael. Thanx for reminding me though. smiley

They made 'proper' large format cameras for expert photographers. And then decided to make their own mini lathes for in house use, eventually selling them to the public too. They made a mini stand drill previous to that. And I think I read somewhere, they are now also a mainstream automotive component maker, making oil pumps. The history of this little machine was one of the main aspects that prompted me to jump in and "Buy It Now"! Even though I could have had what appears to be higher spec and a brand new Draper micro lathe for a similar price. I was also convinced by seeing quite a few complimentary posts about the quality ML1 on various forums too.

I'll confess that I didn't realize just how many decades ago this little lathe was made, 1974 to 1980 no less. But it's quality shines through. It's completely usable, everything works, ( longitudinal slide is slightly stiff).

But I shall be stripping it down shortly to give everything a once over and some TLC and oil.

Edited By Pete Gilbert 1 on 16/07/2014 19:50:28

Michael Gilligan16/07/2014 20:39:28
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16638 forum posts
725 photos
Posted by Pete Gilbert 1 on 16/07/2014 19:46:58:

The history of this little machine was one of the main aspects that prompted me to jump in and "Buy It Now"! Even though I could have had what appears to be higher spec and a brand new Draper micro lathe for a similar price.

.

Pete,

A very wise choice, in my opinion.

I managed to get a Pultra 1770 but, until then, the Toyo ML1 was the other one high on my wish-list.

MichaelG.

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 16/07/2014 20:40:31

Michael Gilligan16/07/2014 21:38:41
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16638 forum posts
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For anyone interested in following Pete's adventure ...

here, for background, are a few manuals for the Toyo Cameras.

MichaelG.

Windy16/07/2014 22:20:04
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793 forum posts
153 photos

Hello Peter I recognize the lathe it was one I had a few months ago until someone bought it off me it seems to put on EBay.

They are good but too small for my projects I started making some Zeroing hand wheels but never stamped them or finally finished them that is how I recognized it.

They are very handy a bit like on the super 7.

Have you found the small backlash eliminator for the crosslide.

If you can rig up a power feed for the carriage it would be very useful.

Hope you get plenty of pleasure from it.

Paul

Pete Gilbert 117/07/2014 18:53:55
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33 forum posts
10 photos

Thanx for the input guys! thumbs up

Windy, well would you Adam and Eve it! It's a small world. No . . wait . . It's a small lathe! laugh

And it's my first 'home' machine.

All I can say Mr Wind sir is, this machine must have been your baby, because the condition is excellent for something made pre-1980. I had much pleasure when I took it out of the box ,plugged it in and cut metal! heart

Ah, I have to confess that I decided to 'test' it's metal, so to speak, and took some 1mm cuts in a brass bar at 1000rpm and managed to trip my domestic breaker!

Hahahahah! I had to laugh after I realized what had happened. I didn't break the lathe, I broke the house! face 20

We have three Hardinge manual lathes at work. Two have rotating tool turrets and then there's the "village bike", as we call it, for general bits and bobs.

I intend to bring the Toyo up just a little from it's current capabilities. The compound slide is the first bit, and a power feed would be nice too, (much better finishes with that than I can achieve manually). So we'll see how it comes along.

Thanx for keeping this Toyo in such nice condition Paul. I will check out that backlash eliminator.

elixir oliver26/01/2015 03:01:55
15 forum posts
11 photos

G'day,

I just recently become a proud owner of Toyo Sakai ML-1. The lathe cosmetically comes with quite a bit of surface rust on the lathe bed. It is running properly. I can't wait to use it, but it comes without a toolpost and two wheel that need helicoil or rethreading.

As this is my first lathe, my limited understanding is trying to get original spareparts. But after reading this post, it seems I could use toolpost from other lathe.

I am welcome to any suggestion for any available toolpost model that would fit.

And perhaps about doing the helicoil on the turning wheel such as the size and measurement or whether it is important to set it on 0 (zero).

Again, my machining skill is almost zero no pun intended, and perhaps starting on the wrong foot on getting this lathe as the first one. but mate, I just can't resist it.

Thanks!

elixir oliver26/01/2015 10:52:12
15 forum posts
11 photos

toyo ML-1.jpg

toyo ML-1 top.jpg

Lathe bed rust is similar to the rust on the chuck from the photo above. It doesn't look too bad because of the lighting. The rust on the body itself has gone through the paintworks. I'm thinking of just cleaning it up with WD-40 and 0000 steelwool. any suggestion? I was afraid that it will affect the accuracy if I use steelwool on the lathe bed.

Both of he the handwheel for the carriage has no threading. As shown on picture one of the wheel is placed on the carriage.

I am also wondering what sort of Chuck key I could use, since it is also missing.

Apart from that, it runs quite silent and smooth.

Ian S C27/01/2015 09:27:51
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7468 forum posts
230 photos

If you are worried about the steel wool being a bit fierce, try a Scotch Bright, pot scrubber, with either WD-40, or kerosene/paraffin.

Ian S C

Edited By Ian S C on 27/01/2015 09:28:39

Michael Gilligan27/01/2015 10:15:34
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16638 forum posts
725 photos
Posted by Ian S C on 27/01/2015 09:27:51:

If you are worried about the steel wool being a bit fierce, try a Scotch Bright, pot scrubber, with either WD-40, or kerosene/paraffin.

.

Just a word of warning ...

Some of the ScotchBrite pads are very agressive ... the fibres have Aluminium Oxide abrasive grit bonded onto them

... Before using on anything important; try rubbing one crosswise on some "brushed" Stainles Steel.

MichaelG.

Pete Gilbert 127/01/2015 12:30:51
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33 forum posts
10 photos

I think 0000 grade steel wool should be ok. You can add oil to it to reduce it's effectiveness, even engine oil. We use it at work for deburring and polishing precision aluminium parts, so there's no need to worry about your steel bed guides. In fact the steel in the wire wool is probably the same hardness as the steel you're going to clean, so it shouldn't really be able to affect it.

All genuine Scotch Brite, also used at my workplace, has alminium oxide as it's abrasive and only the industrial graded white coloured one is graded as being the same as 0000 wire wool. All scouring pads let go of their abrasive during use, but cheap scouring pads are unregulated and shed their abrasive onto your workpiece rapidly. So you MUST clean off all that grit before you even think of reassembilng your lathe.

Edited By Pete Gilbert 1 on 27/01/2015 12:31:47

Pete Gilbert 127/01/2015 13:35:29
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33 forum posts
10 photos
Posted by elixir oliver on 26/01/2015 10:52:12:

Both of he the handwheel for the carriage has no threading. As shown on picture one of the wheel is placed on the carriage.

I am also wondering what sort of Chuck key I could use, since it is also missing.

Apart from that, it runs quite silent and smooth.

Curse you for saying it's quite silent! Mine isn't. sad

I have two chuck keys and although they look different they both seem to work the main chuck and the drill chuck ok.

The handwheels have no M6 internal thread?

In that case I would bore them out to around 9 or 10mm, reduce the face that touches the carriage by 2mm and make up a top hat sleeve with a 2mm brim plus M6 internal and press them into the 9/10mm bore, with the 2mm brim replacing the material that was removed.

If you don't currently have access to another lathe, I'd be happy to make 'em for you. We have a small hand press at work, so I can make them a friction fit and press them in. Problem solved mate.

Drop me a PM if you need to. face 1

elixir oliver28/01/2015 04:21:05
15 forum posts
11 photos

Hi, it's seems to be quite alive here. I appreciate the responses, and a bit of a crowd

@ Ian and Michael.

Thank you for you suggestion. I guess I'm going to mix a fair bit of everything. Scotch Brite and Steel wool with WD 40. For other part I guess I would need just the good old toothbrush and kerosene.

@ Pete

Fair point on the Industrial grade Scotch Brite being similar to 0000, otherwise our Teflon cookware won't even last a year .

Don't get too jealous on my lathe, I haven't run it properly yet. I could see the sparkling shine on your lathe paintwork and the chuck and all. Almost dentist like Good work.

Thank you for your offer, I might need that. I'm just starting out, so half of your description still new to me. When I got to clean it a little I will let you know. I think one of the handwheel has been bore out previously, and bloody off centre too! No, it hasn't got any threading. Just gaping hole.

On the tailstock, I have got a drill chuck, and most likely is aftermarket brand and the key is pretty small. I'm not sure originally (like yours) comes with live center or dead center.

Anyway, will have day off tomorow and have a go at it. I will keep udating as I go.

Cheers!

Michael Gilligan28/01/2015 08:29:41
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16638 forum posts
725 photos

Posted by elixir oliver on 28/01/2015 04:21:05:

I guess I'm going to mix a fair bit of everything. Scotch Brite and Steel wool with WD 40. For other part I guess I would need just the good old toothbrush and kerosene.

.

To your list of materils; may I suggest adding Autosol [previously known as Solvol Autosol]

The MSDS is not particularly helpful regarding its ingredients, but it works well with [worn] Scotch Brite and with Steel wool.

MichaelG.

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 28/01/2015 08:30:53

elixir oliver28/01/2015 08:45:13
15 forum posts
11 photos

@ michael

I did a little cleaning up just with rag and WD-40 since I can't find my steel wool. cool.

Turns out the rust isn't that bad at all. I reckon with a bit of regular use, it will cleans itself a bit. It seems ok now, I think I just focus on getting the mechanical parts. So, gentleman, I change my mind. But I will get on with cleaning soon after, since Pete got an awfully good looking machine. However, Autosol is great stuff. Use that a lot on my motorbike before.

Will head to hardware store to get some more supplies, as for now I only have plenty of elbow grease.

Michael Gilligan28/01/2015 08:58:02
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16638 forum posts
725 photos

Posted by elixir oliver on 28/01/2015 08:45:13:

Turns out the rust isn't that bad at all.

.

Great News

MichaelG.

Pete Gilbert 128/01/2015 09:18:19
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33 forum posts
10 photos

Good to hear that Oliver. The lack of density of the rust probably indicates that it wasn't in damp conditions for too long and, obviously the good quality of the metal.

The paint on the ML1 seems to be like a Hammerite finish. So any rust that appears to show through is probably just due to the 'spots' that occur as the paint dries.

Both my chuck keys have 12 teeth, a 15mm diameter and a just under 4mm dia pilot (nose). They do look quite different, but both work in the lathe chuck. I'm guessing that the one on the left is the original. I can't imagine that Toyo Sakai would not have followed standard available specs for this sort of thing.

chukkey.jpg

elixir oliver28/01/2015 11:05:18
15 forum posts
11 photos

@ Pete

You seems to be right. It is actually pretty good still. Considering it has been round about 30 years.

Thanks for the chuck key photo, and counting the tooth That would make it easier for me to find it.

The handwheel is a bit of an issue, hence the fun.

image.jpg

image.jpg

image.jpg

image.jpg

The one on the left is the one without threading. As you can see, it is drilled off center. I could understand that perhaps the previous owner can't find the center when drilling, and perhaps he shouldn't use a drill.

It seems the new hole is drilled from front and back, and it doesn't meet. On the picture 4, the close up shows where the two holes meet. They seems to be drilled different size too, the hole from the back it's 8.95mm, and from the front is 8.33mm. What is your suggestion? Still able to be saved?

I am wondering if the numbers on the handwhe iel is important at all to be line up or where it should start, but I guess getting the wheel attached to the carrier is more important now.

Ta'

Michael Gilligan28/01/2015 11:52:07
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16638 forum posts
725 photos
Posted by elixir oliver on 28/01/2015 11:05:18:

... It seems the new hole is drilled from front and back, and it doesn't meet. On the picture 4, the close up shows where the two holes meet. They seems to be drilled different size too, the hole from the back it's 8.95mm, and from the front is 8.33mm. What is your suggestion? Still able to be saved?

.

[that was addressed to Pete, so I hope you don't mind me jumping-in]

Take it steady, and this should be a reasonably simple repair.

First thing is to bore the hole out to some reasonable size.

[Centre it by refererence to the outside diameter of the wheel]

MichaelG.

 

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 28/01/2015 11:54:20

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