By continuing to use this site, you agree to our use of cookies. Find out more
Forum sponsored by:
Forum sponsored by Forum House Ad Zone

Warco Super - Major Vario inaccuracy

All Topics | Latest Posts

Search for:  in Thread Title in  
Geoff Manship15/07/2012 11:49:59
23 forum posts

I purchased a WM-14 mill/drill from Warco in March. It took me a while to reorganise my tiny workshop, but I eventually got things organised and started to make a few simple things to get to know the mill.

Some operations didn't go quite according to plan. Accuracy was very difficult to achieve, particularly when trying to drill holes centrally in jobs. My setting up method was to grip the job in the machine vice leaving a short section of jaw showing and clock-up between the two vice jaws to set the mill spindle in the middle of the work. After drilling and reaming the resulting hole I checked that it was central, a discrepancy of about 0.010” was evident.

I re-trammelled the table (with the quill fully raised) and found that everything was fine. I put an angle plate in the table, put a clock in the drill chuck and moved the whole head up and down – that was fine. Then with the clock still in the chuck, I moved the quill up and down the angle plate. Over the full length of the quill travel the clock showed a run out of 0.0” to 0.015” top to bottom. How can this be?

After a couple of days of measuring and adjusting, I have now tracked the problem down to play in the quill of about 0.003”. This doesn't sound much, but when the length of the drill chuck and drill is added it accounts fully for the error. The reason that it doesn't show up when trammelling the table is that when I did this the quill is fully up and the further the quill is lowered so the error increases due to the reduced support it receives from the bore in the head. The quill of the WM-14 has quite a strong return spring so that when fully up the flange at the bottom of the quill is forced against the underside on the head, thus squaring up the spindle and when trammelling the table all appears to be ok.

Sorry for the long rambling explanation - now finally I can get to my questions.

Has anyone else had similar problems and if so, what if anything did they do about it? Is this typical of small mill/drills? Is this all we can expect of Chinese engineering?

I intend to speak to Warco, but wanted to understand the problem first.

Regards

Geoff Manship

John Stevenson15/07/2012 12:34:38
avatar
Moderator
5068 forum posts
3 photos

You obviously understand the problem as you have posted about it, see what Warco have to say about it first.

Terryd15/07/2012 13:00:11
avatar
1936 forum posts
179 photos

Chinese machine tools are usually very good. My equivalent mill shows no substatial error and my Warco WM280 VF variable speed lathe is just about as accurate as you can expect from any non toolroom precision spec lathe.

Terry

Edited By David Clark 1 on 16/07/2012 14:49:31

blowlamp15/07/2012 13:10:31
avatar
1658 forum posts
106 photos

Here's a quote from the Warco website about you miller :-

"Each machine is fully tested by a member of our engineering team and comes with an individual accuracy test report."

Do you have the report so you can compare it against your findings?

Martin.

Crocadillopig15/07/2012 13:22:39
30 forum posts
4 photos

Hello Geoff

I own a WM-16 which has served me well. As far as I know these machines are very similar in all but size. On mine there is a facility to angle the head to 90 degrees either side of vertical, if this is out of alignment it would cause the type of error you have described. To check this place a cranked bar with a DTI fitted in the chuck and, with the table centralised and in contact, swing the DTI to its full extent and check the reading at both extremities of its travel. If the reading is not the same amount then the head is half that amount out of true and should be adjusted. I beleive later models had a locating pin to align the head, this may have been machined incorrectly or be a loose fit.

Regards Russ

Geoff Manship15/07/2012 13:33:38
23 forum posts

Thank you all for your swift replies.

I have just sent Warco an email which I shall follow up with a phone call tomorrow.

The machine did come with a test report. The figure quoted for the vertical movement of the spindle is 0.02mm (0.0008" in both directions, but it doesn't make clear if the movement is applied via the quill movement or the head. But either way, I make my error about 19 times their quoted error!

Regards

Geoff Manship

Geoff Manship15/07/2012 13:45:43
23 forum posts

Hi Russ,

Iv'e set that up already. That's what I mean by trammelling.

Regards

Geoff Manship

Michael Gilligan15/07/2012 14:11:18
avatar
20289 forum posts
1064 photos

Geoff,

As John says ... you appear to have already diagnosed the problem .

It would be best to give Warco the opportunity to put things right, before doing anything yourself.

Meanwhile however, it may be worth comparing notes with John Waterhouse

... he has a review of the earlier model on his website, and makes some useful comments.

[ no connection; I just found his site on t'internet ]

MichaelG.

JasonB15/07/2012 14:20:54
avatar
Moderator
23070 forum posts
2769 photos
1 articles

If its anything like my X3 then there are a set of lock nuts that adjust the bearings that the spindle run in. Mine had a lot of play when first purchease but once the nuts were adjusted to take out the play I have not had to touch them again in about 5 years.

Geoff Manship16/07/2012 10:41:47
23 forum posts

Jason,

Thank you for your posting. The WM-14 is similar to the X3 in as much as the spindle is carried in taper roller bearings that are adjustable. But, on the Warco, the spindle is carried in a conventional quill that raises and lowers independently of the head. The quill runs directly in a bore machined directly in the cast iron head and this is where the play is.

Regards

Geoff Manship

David Clark 116/07/2012 14:53:53
avatar
3357 forum posts
112 photos
10 articles

Hi There

Please give Warco a chance to sort this problem out. Most of these foreign machines are fine for what they are built for as long as you go through them and make sure they are set up correctly and are properly adjusted. Things can vibrate loose when shipping them from China, they may get shaken about a bit and so require adjusting.

I doubt Warco answer emails on Sunday so please wait a reasonable time for replies before posting on here.

regards David

Edited By David Clark 1 on 16/07/2012 14:54:47

Geoff Manship16/07/2012 15:38:40
23 forum posts

Hi David,

Warco phoned this morning to say that realise that much error is not acceptable, they are working on a solution for me and will get back to me soon.

Regards

Geoff Manship

David Clark 116/07/2012 15:51:52
avatar
3357 forum posts
112 photos
10 articles

Hi Geoff

They would want to rectify any errors because they are a reputable company.

regards David

Geoff Manship22/07/2012 14:32:49
23 forum posts

Hi all,

Problem solved!!!

Warco have been great... on Friday their engineer delivered and fitted a replacement head. He knew his stuff and in a short time the mill was performing the way it should. Everyone that I spoke to at the company was very friendly and helpful.

If anyone has reservations about Warco's after sales service, have no fears, they are good people to deal with.

Thank you Warco.

Regards

Geoff Manship.

Springbok22/07/2012 19:25:35
avatar
879 forum posts
34 photos

Great to hear

Bought my first bit of equipment from Warco over 40 years ago from Roger's father when they were in Esher at that time the telephone number was Esher and 4 digits.. never failed me now all but one of my machinery in the workshop is supplied by Warco and all give sterling service. Some at first needed a little bit of tweaking and as David (our editor) says comeing from tiawan and china the shippers are not the most gentle handlers. Also I know you Myford et all; diehards will be up in arms but but even a Chester rep once admitted to me once that the machinery was taken to bits copied and improved on. I have converted all my kit (except the metal bandsaw and that has worked perfectly and accurately for about 10 years.) to 3 phase well worth it.

So this is my defence i of Roger Warren and his company my only gripe would be that ALL our UK suppliers who import this machinery should be like Grizzly in the USof A and produce there own readable manuals. What a UK PR first that would be.

Bob T

 

Edited By Springbok on 22/07/2012 19:26:49

Edited By David Clark 1 on 23/07/2012 09:57:40

John Stevenson22/07/2012 21:58:53
avatar
Moderator
5068 forum posts
3 photos

In defense of UK suppliers Ketan at ARC puts build manuals on the web site which are better than anything that Grizzly or anyone else does.

Edited By John Stevenson on 22/07/2012 22:00:44

Edited By David Clark 1 on 23/07/2012 09:57:58

DerryUK23/07/2012 08:45:03
125 forum posts

<Ketan at ARC puts build manuals on the web site>

I found the manual for the C3. What about Arc's operation manuals though John, any good?

Maybe we need a new thread, 'Best UK mauanuals'.

My warco manuals (I have a lathe and mill) don't tell you how to start the macine. When I received both machines I had to phone them up to find out how to start them.

It's obvious now of course, but at the time this fool couldn't do it!

DerryUK23/07/2012 08:46:54
125 forum posts

For some reason this website stops my spall chucker working, I must complain to Dave <s>.

John Stevenson23/07/2012 09:07:08
avatar
Moderator
5068 forum posts
3 photos
Posted by DerryUK on 23/07/2012 08:45:03:

<Ketan at ARC puts build manuals on the web site>

I found the manual for the C3. What about Arc's operation manuals though John, any good?

Maybe we need a new thread, 'Best UK mauanuals'.

My warco manuals (I have a lathe and mill) don't tell you how to start the macine. When I received both machines I had to phone them up to find out how to start them.

It's obvious now of course, but at the time this fool couldn't do it!

.

Just bought a new van the other month.

Decent manual with it but that didn't tell me how to drive it either ?

Martin W23/07/2012 09:48:55
921 forum posts
30 photos

DerryUK

Why not enable the spell checker supplied on this forum wink 2 ?

Look at the the top set of icons/buttons on the post a reply box, click on the one containing the ABC and on the drop down menu click to enable SCAYT. The SPOOL chucker will then underline all mistakes in red and with a click of the right hand mouse button suggest corrections idea.

Cheers

Martin

All Topics | Latest Posts

Please login to post a reply.

Magazine Locator

Want the latest issue of Model Engineer or Model Engineers' Workshop? Use our magazine locator links to find your nearest stockist!

Find Model Engineer & Model Engineers' Workshop

Sign up to our Newsletter

Sign up to our newsletter and get a free digital issue.

You can unsubscribe at anytime. View our privacy policy at www.mortons.co.uk/privacy

Latest Forum Posts
Support Our Partners
Dreweatts
Eccentric July 5 2018
cowells
Rapid RC
Eccentric Engineering
Subscription Offer

Latest "For Sale" Ads
Latest "Wanted" Ads
Get In Touch!

Do you want to contact the Model Engineer and Model Engineers' Workshop team?

You can contact us by phone, mail or email about the magazines including becoming a contributor, submitting reader's letters or making queries about articles. You can also get in touch about this website, advertising or other general issues.

Click THIS LINK for full contact details.

For subscription issues please see THIS LINK.

Digital Back Issues

Social Media online

'Like' us on Facebook
Follow us on Facebook

Follow us on Twitter
 Twitter Logo

Pin us on Pinterest

 

Donate

donate