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How on Earth Do I Sort This Lot Out?!

Steam Engine parts etc

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Martin King 225/05/2022 12:53:31
1005 forum posts
450 photos

Hi All,

Local chap just dropped by and asked me:

"Is this lot any good to you before I chuck it in the scrap?"

I said it was and we had a deal for not very much but twice what he asked for it.

steambits 1.jpg

steambits 3.jpg

steambits 4.jpg

steambits 5.jpg

steambits 6.jpg

steambits 2.jpg

Looks like bits from several engines in various states of construction but how on earth do I sort it all out?

Any help most welcome.

Cheers, Martin

JasonB25/05/2022 12:58:47
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22749 forum posts
2653 photos
1 articles

Top are parts for the Sanderson beam, the fluted column in the second photo belongs with that as does the larger flywheel on the right. Bed plate for this is top of 3rd photo

Most of the other bits in the second photo are the ME Beam engine, bed plate the bottom of 3rd photo. Not the bronze flywheel

4th photo some bits for the sanderson and a horizontal which looks like it is built on the flat steel plate

Penultimate photo not specific to an engine

Last one too small to see

Martin King 225/05/2022 13:59:10
1005 forum posts
450 photos

Thanks Jason,

Could you please let me know which bits are for the Sanderson n the 4th pic?

I will then update the photo with all the parts.

Interestingly, some of the small parts in the plastic bags are labelled in Braille!

Cheers, this is a big help. Martin

JasonB25/05/2022 16:31:43
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22749 forum posts
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Actually looking again I think they are bits for the ME bean, the cranked rod is the governor linkage, eccentric and rod, the rods that convert horizontal eccentric movement to vertical valve movement all marked X and possibly the parallel motion marked?

Bottom row looks all to be for the horizontal - box of bits, conrod, eccentric rod, Valve chest and bearing blocks, chest cover and crosshead guides and finally cylinder

me beam.jpg

Martin King 225/05/2022 16:52:06
1005 forum posts
450 photos

Thanks Jason, I have now separated out the Sanderson bits, 30 castings + 3 small machined parts.

sanderson 1.jpg

Looks like a full set which is nice?

Cheers, Martin

John Purdy25/05/2022 18:22:56
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349 forum posts
204 photos

Martin

The rod at the top right of your 4th pic is the part finished crank shaft for the Sanderson. Still needs the square section machined on the right hand end. Also in your last posted pic there are a few parts I don't think are from the Sanderson. The rectangular item with a rectangular opening in the middle looks like a steam chest but not for the Sanderson, it's the piece above it. The two rectangular blocks, one at 8 o'clock to the flywheel and the other to the right of the valve chest aren't Sanderson, neither is the oval ring with a screw in it.. The semi circular casting to the left of the con rod looks like the casting for a valve, there was no valve casting in the Sanderson casting set, it has the shape of the valve for a Stuart Turner #9 engine ( or maybe a #1 ). Also one bearing cap is missing.

John.

John Purdy25/05/2022 19:46:02
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349 forum posts
204 photos

A correction to my last. I should have said there is one "extra" main bearing block cap , not one missing.

Martin King 225/05/2022 22:16:34
1005 forum posts
450 photos

Thanks John, I will resign the photos to show your amendments.

Obviously I want to try and get this right so whoever ends up with these gets the right parts.

Cheers, Martin

John Purdy25/05/2022 23:47:50
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349 forum posts
204 photos

After another look some more observations:

- There seems to be two extra bearings for the valve actuating cross shaft, they are the ones at the bottom right just above the 15 on the tape measure. The two above the oval piece with the screw are extra.

- I can't identify the small piece above the 8 on the tape, I don't think it belongs.

- The small circular bronze piece looks like the part machined gland for the piston rod.

- The stepped turned shaft left of the con rod might be the pivot pin for the beam ( should be 3/8 and 1/4" dia )

- Missing are the bronze eccentric strap casting and the inner governor bracket bronze casting. ( The latter looks somewhat like the valve cross shaft bearings but is flat on one side and has a round section at the top extending out the other for a bearing for the governor drive shaft ). Also the 6 gears for the governor ( 4 mitre gears and a set of 3:1 bevel gears, 32 DP 22 T and 36/12 T respectfully ).

Other than the above the only thing missing from the set of castings as supplied by Clarksons is an ~ 3" by 1/18" dia. stick of cast gun metal for the bearings.

John

 

Edited By John Purdy on 25/05/2022 23:58:17

Martin King 226/05/2022 09:10:54
1005 forum posts
450 photos

Hi John

Thanks for the update, am in the process of rejigging the main photo with your amendments.

I may possibly have a suitable piece of gun metal to make up for the missing piece

The 2 "extra" bearing castings seem to be a bit smaller and are cast iron NOT bronze or GM, here is a close up:

sanderson 2.jpg

Cheers, Martin

Martin King 226/05/2022 09:35:47
1005 forum posts
450 photos

Hi,

Just found some more parts in another small box?

sanderson 3.jpg

Circlip26/05/2022 10:43:49
1510 forum posts

Good that you gave a fairer price Martin.

Regards Ian.

Martin King 226/05/2022 11:46:54
1005 forum posts
450 photos

Ian, The guy was quite shocked when I offered him more than he asked!

Nigel Graham 226/05/2022 12:04:18
2133 forum posts
29 photos

Perhaps the seller had acquired them among the effects of a deceased relative or friend, and genuinely had no idea of their identity or worth beyond perhaps something to do with model engines.

Some of the fittings in the penultimate of the first photos look as if they have been used, but others are still as new.

Anyway it's good that Mr. Local did think to ask you and not simply weigh them in for scrap or just chuck them in the local Council metals-skip. Clearly he didn't expect the very pleasant financial surprise! You never know, he might find more for you...

Martin King 226/05/2022 13:03:40
1005 forum posts
450 photos

Nigel, the chap is a local house clearance guy who often brings me items, a useful contact.

cheers,Martin

John Purdy26/05/2022 19:25:13
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349 forum posts
204 photos

Martin

To help, here is the list, from one of Clarkson's last catalogues, of the castings that made up the set as supplied by them.
Description                                   Qty       Material
Bed Plate                                        1             AL
Column (Fluted )                           1             CI
Beam Bearing                                2             CI
Beam                                               1            CI
Main Bearing                                  1             CI
Main Bearing (outer )                    1            CI
Crank                                               1              CI
Flywheel                                          1              CI
Connecting Rod                             1              CI
Cylinder                                           1              CI
Steam Chest                                  1              CI
Cylinder Cover                                1              CI
Support Bracket                             1              CI
Parallel Motion Bracket                 1              CI
Valve Gear                                        2            GM
Gov. Drive bracket (inner )             1            GM
Gov. Drive Bracket (outer )             2           GM
Eccentric                                           1             CI
Eccentric Sheave                             1           GM
Stick of Gun Metal for Bearings     1           GM
Main Bearing cap                             2            CI
Main Column Bracket                     1            CI
Set of Six Governor Gears
Plans 3 Sheets

I believe this is slightly different from what is currently supplied by Blackgates.

John

Edited By John Purdy on 26/05/2022 19:57:07

John Purdy26/05/2022 20:10:16
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349 forum posts
204 photos

Martin

As far as the 4 bearing castings go they look like they are all the bearings for the valve cross shaft but I would use the CI ones as the others look like pretty poor castings. Here's what mine look like, original Clarkson's in bronze. The one at the bottom is the inner governor bracket which seems to be missing along with the eccentric sheave from your lot. Maybe it's hiding away in some of the other stuff.

The eccentric for the Sanderson doesn't have a boss on it so I don't think what you have labeled as possible is for the Sanderson. There is a casting for it in your first picture.

Sorry about the formatting in my previous but no matter how I tried to edit it it just got worse. I ended up deleting the whole thing and re-posting it!

 

img_6728.jpg

Here is what the eccentric sheave ( strap ) looks like. The bit below is the latch on the end of the valve rod to disconnect the valve gear so it could be manually moved to start the engine as there are no barring teeth on the fly wheel.

ecc strap.jpg

Edited By John Purdy on 26/05/2022 20:23:52

Edited By John Purdy on 26/05/2022 20:25:16

Martin King 227/05/2022 07:48:27
1005 forum posts
450 photos

John, Again, many thanks!

Nearly three with the final photo, just need names for the bits with an X and any mistakes I have made to be corrected please.

sanderson 5.jpg

Cheers, Martin

Edited By Martin King 2 on 27/05/2022 08:05:51

John Purdy27/05/2022 18:16:47
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349 forum posts
204 photos

Martin
The circular item at the top left of the con rod is the casting for the eccentric sheave. Has a chucking piece on it and should finish at 5/16" thick and 1 7/16" over the flanges. The weird shaped one at the bottom of the con rod is the "parallel motion bracket". It is the support for one end of the drag links of the parallel motion and sits on top of the "support bracket". The one at the bottom beside the bearing caps is the "main column bracket" and is fastened into 3 slots machined in the main column towards the top and provides a seating for the "support bracket" which goes between the column and the top of the cylinder. The item to the left of the cyl. cover is the crank connecting the crankshaft to the con rod. The items you have labled "supports" are the bearing pedestals. The two to the left are for the crankshaft (outer, longer, and inner which sits on the bedplate hence shorter ) they mate with the bearing caps. The other two are the bearing supports on top of the column for the beam (they are over long as the cap is part of the casting and is sawn off before machining. )

Hope this makes all sense?

John

Martin King 227/05/2022 19:56:17
1005 forum posts
450 photos

John,

Makes perfect sense, I will edit and improve the photo, thanks so much for your help.

As these will be offered for sale I wanted to be as accurate in my description as possible which is not easy when knowledge is a bit scarce!

I am sure someone will enjoy making the model from these and it is good that they will not be scrapped.

Cheers, Martin

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