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Not enoughh CO2 ?

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J Hancock27/09/2021 10:21:16
724 forum posts

Just highlights what a brilliant decision France made back in the 50/60's to invest in nuclear/hydro projects.

Led by technocrats , not bankers.

RMA27/09/2021 10:31:13
282 forum posts
4 photos
Posted by Oven Man on 21/09/2021 09:09:41:

Looks like wev'e run out of wind recently as well. When are we going to realise that the most reliable source of renewable energy is tidal power. I am not anti wind power but I do consider it to be only an interim solution to our energy "problems".

Peter

Agree with tidal power, but I guess it's not considered because none of the politicians have any financial interest in it!

Wind power is a joke, but creating wealth for a few!

Until the world accepts it's vastly overpopulated, the demand for everything will perpetuate all these problems and no doubt cause other's in the future. Tackle the cause, stop tinkering with the effects.....some hope of that?

Edited By RMA on 27/09/2021 10:31:35

SillyOldDuffer27/09/2021 11:20:22
Moderator
7549 forum posts
1680 photos
Posted by Graham Meek on 22/09/2021 18:29:23:

By what I was told today, petrol is also in short supply in certain parts of the country.

Regards

Gray,

Lots of panic buying where I live. Yesterday my local Tesco ran out of fuel and so were the three independents between me and my son (10 miles away). I'm sure no forum members have disgraced themselves by topping-up unnecessarily, but it seems the rest of the nation's drivers are a mob of selfish, hysterical wets! So much for Dunkirk spirit. I think corporal punishment is the answer: six of the best on the forecourt for anyone who queued for less than a third of a tankful!

devil

The problem is due to HGV Driver Shortages and a government minister assuring us there's no shortage of petrol at the refineries. I wonder how many of those queuing realised that electric cars are immune to this problem - they're recharged at home...

Dave

JA27/09/2021 11:45:09
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1222 forum posts
73 photos

Since this topic has moved on to fuel, I have a simple question.

When will the refineries start shutting down because they have run out of storage capacity?

Looking back, I suppose all this was inevitable with "just in time", efficient working, tight timetables etc. There is not the slack in the system (whatever system you look at) to accommodate real problems.

JA

Edited By JA on 27/09/2021 11:46:05

Robin27/09/2021 11:47:02
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488 forum posts

I don't quite understand how CO2 can affect the climate without warming it???

"Overall the globe has cooled substantially since the last El Nino ended in 2016, and it now appears the cooling trend will persist another year as the CFSv2 is forecasting a La Niña to continue into spring 2022".

A bit of a cheat there because there was a spike in the 2016 temperature, but with the global warming freaks getting the screaming ab dabs about anywhere on the globe having warm weather, you can't really blame them.

The extra CO2 continues to have a dramatic effect on my garden where the plants are on a binge and are growing quite out of control. My lawn has tussocks.

SillyOldDuffer27/09/2021 14:05:15
Moderator
7549 forum posts
1680 photos
Posted by Robin on 27/09/2021 11:47:02:

...

"Overall the globe has cooled substantially since the last El Nino ended in 2016, and it now appears the cooling trend will persist another year as the CFSv2 is forecasting a La Niña to continue into spring 2022".

...

Robin, that's a blog misusing NOAA data, fake news! The source is actually about forecasting weather anomalies, and climate deniers won't like what it really says about the likelihood of unusually bad weather in the USA next year.

This graph shows global temperature to be rising and is cause for concern because it appears to be accelerating in line with theory, which is bad, bad, bad for everyone.

globaltemp.jpg

As climate deniers have successfully delayed attempts to reform our foolish ways over the last 30 years, humanity is stuck with the consequences. Robin thinks CO² helps his garden grow: I'm worried about the risk of Bangladesh flooding. There, rising sea-levels could create 163,000,000 refugees at the same time as North Africa becomes uninhabitable due to desertification.

When the experts predict Climate Catastrophe, they really mean it. I used to think global warming could be managed sensibly into a soft landing, now I believe the future is out of control. The milk is spilt. Prime Minister Macmillan was once asked why governments failed to deliver on their manifesto promises. He replied, 'events dear boy, events...' We are three square meals away from chaos!

Dave

 

Edited By SillyOldDuffer on 27/09/2021 14:05:54

J Hancock27/09/2021 15:32:57
724 forum posts

I have a book , Resources and Man, produced by the National Academy of Sciences , started in '66, printed in '69.

Written before ' the Internet' , Containerisation , and China , became the 'go to' for everything manufactured ,

It foresees and predicts everything that is happening , now , with chilling accuracy..

With resources finite , the conclusion is inevitable.

I quote , " The inescapable conclusion is that both population control and better resource management are mandatory and must be effected with as little delay as possible."

pgk pgk27/09/2021 15:36:53
2317 forum posts
293 photos
Posted by SillyOldDuffer on 27/09/2021 11:20:22:I wonder how many of those queuing realised that electric cars are immune to this problem - they're recharged at home...

Dave

Any smug feeling is destroyed by the hike to come in leccy pricing which hardly encourages the uptake.

Paul Kemp27/09/2021 20:31:16
689 forum posts
18 photos
Posted by SillyOldDuffer on 27/09/2021 14:05:

This graph shows global temperature to be rising and is cause for concern because it appears to be accelerating in line with theory, which is bad, bad, bad for everyone.

globaltemp.jpg

As climate deniers have successfully delayed attempts to reform our foolish ways over the last 30 years, humanity is stuck with the consequences. Robin thinks CO² helps his garden grow: I'm worried about the risk of Bangladesh flooding. There, rising sea-levels could create 163,000,000 refugees at the same time as North Africa becomes uninhabitable due to desertification.

When the experts predict Climate Catastrophe, they really mean it. I used to think global warming could be managed sensibly into a soft landing, now I believe the future is out of control. The milk is spilt. Prime Minister Macmillan was once asked why governments failed to deliver on their manifesto promises. He replied, 'events dear boy, events...' We are three square meals away from chaos!

Dave

Edited By SillyOldDuffer on 27/09/2021 14:05:54

Whatever was going on between about 1898 and 1910 we need to do more of? What caused the peak around 1942? What happened pre 1880?

Paul.

Robin27/09/2021 21:43:36
avatar
488 forum posts

Pre-1880 pre-dates Phileas Fogg so the error bars widen wink

John Reese27/09/2021 21:58:46
986 forum posts

There was a proposal to build a CO2 pipeline to collect CO2 from the numerous ethanol plants in the midwest US. The intent was to convey the CO2 to a location where the geology was suitable for underground injection. Strangely the environmentalists are violently opposed to it.

Michael Gilligan27/09/2021 23:02:15
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18924 forum posts
942 photos

Posted by SillyOldDuffer on 27/09/2021 14:05:15:

[…]

This graph shows global temperature to be rising and is cause for concern because it appears to be accelerating in line with theory, which is bad, bad, bad for everyone.

globaltemp.jpg

.

Credit where credit’s due … Here’s a link to the NASA page : **LINK**

https://climate.nasa.gov/vital-signs/global-temperature/

… and a quick reminder of Lowess smoothing : **LINK**

https://www.statisticshowto.com/lowess-smoothing/

MichaelG.

.

P.S. __ if you want to play with different fits, the data table can be downloaded using the link below the Xaxis

Paul Kemp27/09/2021 23:32:15
689 forum posts
18 photos
Posted by Michael Gilligan on 27/09/2021 23:02:15:

Posted by SillyOldDuffer on 27/09/2021 14:05:15:

[…]

This graph shows global temperature to be rising and is cause for concern because it appears to be accelerating in line with theory, which is bad, bad, bad for everyone.

globaltemp.jpg

.

Credit where credit’s due … Here’s a link to the NASA page : **LINK**

https://climate.nasa.gov/vital-signs/global-temperature/

… and a quick reminder of Lowess smoothing : **LINK**

https://www.statisticshowto.com/lowess-smoothing/

MichaelG.

.

P.S. __ if you want to play with different fits, the data table can be downloaded using the link below the Xaxis

With respect it was a genuine question. However you want to 'play' with fits of the curve the data sets themselves still show a significant trough around 1910 and a significant peak around 1942. You could manipulate the curve according to the data for the trough to be a little deeper and the peak to be a little higher but it's fine as presented, it still shows a larger short term variation than the period of reasonably steady increase say 1962 (ish) to present? Given the efforts to eradicate CFC's over the last 10-20 years coupled with efforts to reduce CO2 certainly over the last 10 years there is no real hesitation in the rate of rise. Hence my question.

Paul.

Michael Gilligan27/09/2021 23:37:50
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18924 forum posts
942 photos
Posted by Paul Kemp on 27/09/2021 23:32:15:

With respect it was a genuine question. However you want to 'play' with fits of the curve the data sets themselves still show a significant trough around 1910 and a significant peak around 1942. You could manipulate the curve according to the data for the trough to be a little deeper and the peak to be a little higher but it's fine as presented, it still shows a larger short term variation than the period of reasonably steady increase say 1962 (ish) to present? Given the efforts to eradicate CFC's over the last 10-20 years coupled with efforts to reduce CO2 certainly over the last 10 years there is no real hesitation in the rate of rise. Hence my question.

Paul.

.

There is no need for ‘respect’ Paul … I wasn’t attempting to address your question.

I was simply pointing-out [as Dave had not done so] where the data could be found.

MichaelG.

.

Edit: __ I do try to make it clear to whom I am responding, and in that instance it was not you

… I quoted Dave’s post, not yours.

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 27/09/2021 23:44:43

J Hancock28/09/2021 08:58:02
724 forum posts

The '1940' blip on the chart could be a result of the colossal destruction, and then use of oil/coal , to effect the outcome of WW2.

Circlip28/09/2021 09:12:54
1353 forum posts

Wonder how much more impact is generated by repeating the same graph three times?

Regards Ian.

Graham Meek28/09/2021 10:35:55
398 forum posts
259 photos

It was reported yesterday that 2/3rds of forecourts in the UK were without fuel. The shortages I reported on the 22nd were well in advance of the "Panic at the Pumps". This shows me that there is an underlying problem. A problem which should have been thought about Pre 2020, and addressed long before now. The scenes in the streets of the queues of cars, look more like those in the early 70's, all over again, and as usual nothing as been learned.

We must be the laughing stock of the World as we bumble from one crisis to another.

Regards

Gray,

J Hancock28/09/2021 10:52:00
724 forum posts

Daily Tel item 26/7/2013 Imports of oil gas rise to record high.

43% of fossil fuels come from abroad.

Petrol £1.34/litre.

Wind contributed 1% of electrical energy., target for 2020 is 15%.

Ady128/09/2021 10:55:38
avatar
4728 forum posts
714 photos

Britain has always specialised in "Fire Brigade Management"

Its in our DNA

We only ever get properly organised if there's a World War

Peacetime business-as-usual is corruption, incompetence and dogma

plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose

not done it yet28/09/2021 11:43:46
6322 forum posts
20 photos
Posted by Robin on 27/09/2021 21:43:36:

Pre-1880 pre-dates Phileas Fogg so the error bars widen wink

Post 1880 might indicate volcanic activity over the next 40 years?

Krakatoa likely started the fall?

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