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Install & commission of a Chester Cub 630 (Warco GH750)

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Bazyle23/05/2021 21:54:52
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5896 forum posts
218 photos

I think you will find the lifting holes are 1 in as it is made for the American market. I would first of all get some allthread to go through those holes to attach an anti-tip framework or at least an outrigger so that when it falls over it doesn't land on the cross slide handle.
Perhaps get it off the pallet onto two 2x6 lengthways bolted on with the foot holes will give a better runnning surface for scaffold poles and scaff planks on the ground will sort that surface out. Worth getting new planks as the timber can be used for benches etc after. If you make the pieces under the lathe mentioned above over long you can bolt anti-tip bars to them.
A farmer with a telehandler might loan it in exchange for a repair job - farmers always need something repaired.

Howard Lewis24/05/2021 16:08:23
4859 forum posts
12 photos

Ideally when Palletline deliver, ask if the lathe can be lifted clear of the pallet to insert a 15 mm or thicker board under it, before strapping to the pallet.

When you come to move the lathe, strapped to the pallet, over the grassed area, lay down boards for the rollers to run on. You will need at least three rollers. 50 mm scaffold pole will make movement quite easy over boards or level concrete. (Once had a Colchester try to run away from me on scaffold poles on a level floor when I pushed too hard! )

Two sturdy boards, 15 mm thick, minimum, will allow you to move the machine easily, as long as the uphill gradient is not too steep. Once off the first board, it can overtake the second, and so on, until the machine reaches hardstanding.

Apply the push or pull as low down as possible. The higher the forces, the greater risk of toppling over!.

Better to be longer doing the job than spending time trying to get it upright again to inspect the damage to machine or human!

Once in the workshop, and close to the intended position, I would suggest pushing the lathe, on the board, off the pallet , endways. A prybar should aid skidding sideways to put the machine into position.

Once that is done, you can start setting the machine level so that the bed is free of twist.

Howard

Calum Galleitch11/06/2021 14:37:09
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36 forum posts
9 photos

While I wait for delivery and electrics to be sorted out, I'm looking at what else I need to do before I can press the on button.

One thing that I am havering about a little is that there is a D1-5 4 jaw chuck on eBay for £170 with delivery at the moment, and looking at the prices of D1-5 accessories I am half thinking I should just snap it up, even though the 4 jaw is less immediately necessary to get things up and running.

Onto the shopping list. I'm ignoring small items that are easily got via eBay - centre drills and the like.

  • Centres: a live, dead, and half centre (MT3)
  • A set of 12mm HSS turning tools
  • Measuring: micrometer, dial indicator, dial test indicator, magnetic stand
  • Oiler (recommendations welcome!)

Oils. The GH750 manual I have, written in slightly broken English, states "machine oil" and "machine oil no. 20". From what I gather, I want ISO32 oil for gearboxes, and ISO 68 for ways and everything else.

  • I see both these being sold under various use names (eg ISO68 as slideway, hydraulic, vacuum pump, air compressor, etc). Does this matter or is it all the same stuff?
  • What quantity of oil will the gearboxes need (headstock, feed, and apron)?
  • How much way oil/ISO68 do people get through? Warco sells it in 500ml bottles which feels a bit stingy.

Also on oil - what's the right way to dispose of it? Will recycling centres that take motor oil take it? I'm guessing the oil in it has never been changed so I expect one of the first things to do will be a complete oil change (tips welcome!)

Calum Galleitch11/06/2021 15:00:44
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36 forum posts
9 photos

Then the other topic, which I haven't yet planned in detail, is levelling the machine. Unfortunately, the concrete floor is anything but flat. A rough measurement suggests the floor is 2" lower on the left than on the right. This is big enough that I'm thinking maybe the best thing to do is install a concrete pad for it to sit on so the two cabinet feet are both sitting on a flat surface.

When it comes to levelling itself, what do I need in terms of measuring level? A Starret 4" level is £90; but the quoted accuracy is 4-5 minutes of arc, not much better than a digital box that can resolve 0.1 degree. Or there are the Chinese made ones that claim 0.02mm over 200mm, which is less than a hundredth of a degree - hmm!

Clive Foster11/06/2021 17:57:21
2699 forum posts
96 photos

Concerning oils the ISO number is the viscosity of the base stock, low numbers means it flows easily and is thin, high numbers flows less easily and is thick.

Variations between recommended applications for oils of the same nominal viscosity are due to the additive package with is tuned to work best at that job. For example slideway oils have additives to help them stick to surfaces so, for example, the oil doesn't just run off vertical slides and others to stop it oxidising when sitting around in thin layers for long periods. Motor oils and similar tend to turn into a varnish like coating over the eyars. Especially older type. Slideway oils made specifically for machine tool use are tolerant of cutting oils, suds et al and the water used to dilute it.

Hydraulic oils generally have anti-foam additives so it doesn't become aerated inside pumps, anti wear additives so sliding cylindeers don't wear out too fast and be formulated so the seals can easily scrape excess oil off.

Vacuum oils are tuned to minimise any out gassing of components under low pressure. Compressor oils, made for reciprocating compressors, can stand the relatively high loadings on big and little end bearings. Also made to minimise leakage past piston rings. Oils for rotary compressors such as screw and hydrovane types tend to be a bit exotic with prices to match.

Consensus seems to be that for any home workshop compatible lathe an ISO 32 hydraulic oil with anti wear additives is good for bearings, gear boxes and oil nipples on the machine et al. ISO 68 dual rated slideway / bearing oil for the bed, drop gear train and possibly apron. Castro technical department suggested that I use Hyspin AWS32 and Magna DB 68 many years ago. Not seen any reason to deviate despite several machine changes. The Magna makes a great general purpose oil can oil for "honey doo" and similar general lubrication jobs as it stays in place for long periods. Magna strings impressively when applied to open gears and quickly spreads over the teeth but doesn't drip unless you overdo things. Equivalents can be got from most oil makers.

Proper slideway only oils are heavy duty beasts and rather too sticky for our machines.

Clive

Clive Foster11/06/2021 18:34:41
2699 forum posts
96 photos

Levelling is a vastly over discussed subject.

For folk like us its most relevant to the lighter range of machines, Myford, Boxford, Southbend and smaller, where careless bolting onto a strong but un flat bench can distort the bed.

Similar considerations apply to larger machines with the old fashioned pedestal at the headstock end, legs at the tailstock end and unsupported bed between. Maybe with a chip tray bolted in place. If the floor is insufficiently flat you end up with it sat on three points with one leg, almost invariably at the tailstock end, hanging in the air. Packing the hanging leg to equalise the loads side to side on the feet is sufficient to take out the stress on the bed. The machine mass won't bend a bed that big. Users choice how level you want it.

Lathes solidly bolted to sturdy cabinets, whether sheet and angle frame like yours, or fully cast boxes like my Smart & Brown 1024, are essentially unbendable and untwistable by any forces folks like us can apply. So assuming the maker hasn't had a Friday afternoon moment and twisted things by making the mounting points out of parallel the machine will be quite happy so long as the mounting points are shimmed to equalise loads as mentioned above. Being close to level is nice on a lathe but frankly carpenters level or wixley type digital is good enough.

Taking the time to get a mill table really level is worth it as being properly level makes many set ups easier.

I've always found it quite sufficient to use a thin metal sheet, preferably shim, between two lubricated plates in conjunction with a screw jack to judge loads on the mounting points. Basically settle the machine down on the plate stack and judge how much of a turn on the jackscrew it takes to lift one or the other corner enough so the ship plate is stiff to move. I reckon around 1/10 turn between fully loaded and slides when testing alternately is close enough. Change the stack for proper solid shim once you have the adjustments sorted.

Did both my P&W model B, pedestal-leg type, and S&B 1024, cast box underneath, that way. Both within a few seconds of level when checked afterwards with my favourite WW 2 gunners clinometer.

clinometer 1.jpg

30 seconds of arc per division. Small so you can turn it end for end to test. Calibrated tilt adjustment so you can work your way down.

Super precision levels are a pain to use because the bubble is slow to settle and mostly parks itself at one end so little help until really close. Carpenters and wixley style digitals are, objectively insufficiently accurate if you really want level.

But with a lathe so long as the bed is unstressed out of level, within reason, matters little.

Clive

Edited By Clive Foster on 11/06/2021 18:37:27

Howard Lewis12/06/2021 14:50:22
4859 forum posts
12 photos

Unless you are planning to use flood coolant, having the lathe EXACTLY level is not important.

If using flood coolant the lathe should be levelled, obviously, so that coolant runs towards the return to tank.

More important is that the bed is free from twist. If twisted, the lathe is liable to cut a taper.

You can use a sensitive level to show how much twist is present. This will show you directly in which direct to adjust the tailstock end of the bed.

Or you can use the method advocated by Myford, and by Ian Bradley in his book, "The Amateur's Workshop"

Pages 27 and 28 apply.

Basically, you adjust / shim at the Tailstock end, when the lathe is firmly bolted down..

If using the "bobbin" method, is used, cuts should be light, only 0.002" (0.050 mm).

The tool must be on the centre height of the lathe for any cutting. It will not cut properly, unless it is.

The basic material (Usually mild steel ) should be 1" (25 mm ) diameter, so that it is stiff and unlikely to deflect under cutting forces. Also, for this reason, the cuts should be light,

Measure the diameters at the Headstock and outer ends of the bobbin.

Only a little more than 6" (150 mm ) should protrude from the chuck.

If the bobbin is larger at the outer, unsupported end, place shims, or adjust upwards, under the FRONT foot at the Tailstock end.

If the outer end is smaller, insert shim, or adjust upwards, the REAR foot.

Having made the adjustment, take another light cut and remeasure the diameters of the ends of the bobbin.

Repeat the shim/adjust and light cut procedure until both ends are the same diameter. The bed is then without twist.

HTH

Howard

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