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Electric vehicles

Are they joking

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JasonB19/11/2020 12:20:40
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PGK, does the Telsa have regenerative braking? I was looking at the Peugeot 308SUV as there was one parked opposite yesterday and that has two options for the level of braking that the driver can select, no doubt ideal for going down Welsh hillsides and another way the distance between charges can be extended.

I expect as more motorsport goes electric the petrol heads and boy racers will be more willing to go electric, DTM is going electric in 2022 and there are things like the Extreme E off roaders, TT has had an electric bike class for a few years and they don't hang about.

Andy_G19/11/2020 12:49:50
83 forum posts

Re questions about emergency response:

**LINK**

Howard Lewis19/11/2020 13:03:02
4176 forum posts
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Politicians make promises for others to keep. (Example: U k's "World Beating" Test and Trace system ) If you are really lucky, they actually know what they are talking about.

Fact

Burning fossil fuels pollutes the environment. But so does extracting the materials to make anything.

Fact

We are past peak oil

Fact

No one tells us the complete environmental life cycle cost (ground to ground ) of anything,

(IF they know it )

Fact

A lot of travel is not necessary (Holiday flights, pleasure motoring, Importing food that we could grow at home and so on,)

We choose to run small less polluting vehicles (Euro 6 compliant ) We don't tow a trailer or caravan (Our vehicle manufacturer specifically forbids fitting a tow bar ) A brim full petrol tank will take 4 of us well over 400 miles, and takes only a few minutes to fill.

One day battery, electric motor, control and vehicle technology will match or exceed that.

Currently the costs of electric vehicles are too great for us.

Vested Interest? YES

Diesel engines, in various forms, throughout my working life, have provided.the means by which we are now able to live comfortably. We are not rich, but have no pressing needs.

Will the ban on ICE cars cause us problems? Probably not, unless anticipating a telegram from Buckingham Palace.

But it will seriously affect our Daughter, Son in Law, and their children. So our leaders need to get their act together, correctly, and soon, for their sakes.

Unusually, they will have to act totally out of character, to take an overall view, and think logically

Howard

bernard towers19/11/2020 13:25:54
77 forum posts
62 photos

Sorry Jason but the ‘e’ tat is/was a farce as it was only a two lap race and you needed two bikes to do that. The last race only had about 4 entrants which led to it being scrapped for the foreseeable future. It’s fairly obvious to me that bike manufacturers are not embracing electric except for commuters especially as the tt races were usually won by private innovators.

pgk pgk19/11/2020 13:38:43
2033 forum posts
290 photos
Posted by JasonB on 19/11/2020 12:20:40:

PGK, does the Telsa have regenerative braking?....

Indeed it does and can be adjusted between 'light' and 'normal'. Coming down the hill between Bala and Llanfyllin I 'recover' 3-4 miles range. It also leads to minimal use of brakes..paradoxically it's advised to use them heavily every few weeks to keep the discs clean and service them throughly every year in damp british climates but the pads will last for ages as will the brake fluid. One pedal driving.

KWIL My local Fireman pal tells me they carry a book of how to deal with various cars when needng to cut/pull folk from wrecks. The Tesla has an emergency 'frunk' opening pull and in there is another emergency cut-off for the 400V. The latest EV's go up to 800V .

Peter G. Shaw Some Teslas are tow capable (well they all are but some are actually EU approved for it). One Tesla forum member frequently tows his glider around the UK. Yes there's a hit on range as there would be with petrol and a limit on nose weight.

edit - For petrol heads... my 'slow' Tesla is 0-60 in 4 secs (not that I do that after the intitial playtime of ownership). The fastest Tesla is 0-60 in 2.3secs and the Roadster is claimed will be 0-60 in 1.9secs or better and will even be capable of being fitted with booster rockets for off-road use to bypass rubber on road limits. The limitation will be one's willingness to detach your retinas and stay concious. So 10 second cars as production cars under £150K should satisfy the most demanding nutters...

pgk

Edited By pgk pgk on 19/11/2020 13:44:16

JasonB19/11/2020 13:42:23
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Yes range was a bit limited, think it was actually down to one lap in 2019 but speed was not bad considering they weigh about 80kg more than a petrol bike Similar with things like formula E where they run two races at a meeting rather than one longer race which can make for more entertainment.

HOWARDT19/11/2020 13:54:51
654 forum posts
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I think that the car manufacturers need to come up with a cheap solution to replace the batteries. How many cars have we on the roads that are around ten years old in the UK. If useable battery life is currently around seven years, we need a cheap replacement technology to extend vehicle life. Who wants to buy a five or six year old car that they then have to pay more for a new battery than the price of the car. Also odd cells can go bad within the pack, does the manufacturer replace the whole pack or just the defective cell to prolong the life. Perhaps we should go down the route of one design of basic drive train and only make the body work different, thus all drivetrain parts can be cheaper as there is only one type in manufacture then make it that all updates have to be able to be retrofitted to the original design.

Nicholas Farr19/11/2020 14:08:35
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Posted by not done it yet on 19/11/2020 11:40:10:

NF,

silly thread?

READ THOSE TWO WORDS AGAIN, PLEASE.

It does actually say thread, not post. Obviously too subtle for you to grasp?

I was actually referring back to the ostentatious joker that started this thread - a confirmed petrol-head with a distinct anti-BEV agenda.

Hi NDIY, sorry I don't understand your comment. Where in my post that you are referring to, in this thread, did I mention post. You said "this silly thread" which, I understood you were referring to this thread, which was started by the OP, to whom I believed you were referring to in the paragraph that I quoted in my post that you have commented about.

Please correct me if I've miss understood what you were actually saying. If I have got it wrong, then I apologise.

Regards Nick.

Robert Atkinson 219/11/2020 14:10:39
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885 forum posts
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One thing that concerns me about binging this forward is that it will force some OEMs to make what I call "Hardly Hybrid" cars like the new Fiat 500 and Panda. Thes basically replace the starter and alternator with a small belt driven starter generator and 11Ah (123Wh) battery. This is little better than stop start. Longer development time would allow better solutions. The advertising is also confusing What's the differentce between a mild hybrid and a "self-charging Hybrid" ? All hybrids are self charging so I guess they mean "not a plug-in"

I currently drive a large plug-in hybrid bought used. My prevous car was a large Fiat with 2l 150hp turbo diesel. Plug-in does better MPG all round without plugging in. When going into the office (pre Covid) I could normally get a charging spot and that meant all electric to and from work on one (free) charge.

Robert G8RPI

DMB19/11/2020 14:15:21
1054 forum posts

Steve said couldnt believe amount of a/c fuel.

Try reading paperback title Vulcan, about bombing Stanley a /p in Faulklands.They used relays of umpteen Victor tankers to mid air refuel each other and the bomb carrying Vulcan, the empty Victors returning to Ascension. How many tons of fuel for that long range op? Think it was 8000miles each way from RAF Waddington.

Howard Lewis19/11/2020 14:16:32
4176 forum posts
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Well, Stevie really has thrown a very large rock into the otherwise still pond.

It has brought out a lot of facts, but not everyone wants to be confused by them!

Howard

DMB19/11/2020 14:20:16
1054 forum posts

"Vulcan 607" Lots of copies avail. from on line bookshops. Good read

DMB19/11/2020 14:30:35
1054 forum posts

Sub surface garden heat pumps NOT the answer; they 'suck' out so much heat as to cause a perma frost. They then suffer reduced efficiency and maybe fail completely.

Peter G. Shaw19/11/2020 14:34:25
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1232 forum posts
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pgk,

Yes I am aware that, eg, the Toyota RAV4 hybrid will supposedly tow my caravan. I must admit that I'm not too sure about the Tesla models mainly on the grounds of cost.

At the moment, assuming my health holds out, and how well the present car is running, I might be looking to change it in about 3 years time. Given that it is a Toyota with, as I understand it, a more or less bomb proof older design of engine, it may well be longer. One thing is more or less certain and that is that I don't really want a petrol engined car with a turbo-charger, more efficient they may well be, but after having had a diesel with a turbo on it blow up, no thank you. Of course, I may have no option when it comes to change time.

Peter G. Shaw

Nigel McBurney 119/11/2020 14:52:48
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Ever since earl engineers tried steam carriages on the road,the powers that be in this country have been against the population being mobile,the rich had their horses but wanted to keep the rest of us static so that they were in command,now they are at it again forcing us to run around in milk floats,after these comments the serious side of it is how will cars be convenienly charged,take the thousands of coronation street style houses, every house would need a point on the edge of the road,cannot lay cables across the pavement from house to car,how long will it be before thieves find it profitable to nick the charging cables or thieve cars just to get the batteries. regarding efficiency cars have been around for around 130 years and its taken all that time to arrive at cars which have good fuel consumption and reliability,how long will it really be before the electric car can deliver a similar overall performance and cost.

pgk pgk19/11/2020 15:17:40
2033 forum posts
290 photos
Peter G. Shaw

I'm not actively recommending Tesla's - more using them to illustrate what can be done. As to turbo's.. well my 27yr old 200SX has never blown a turbo (touch wood) although I did blow the big ends for an expensive rebuild.

Tesla have good points but their customer service is often woefully poor and without a dealership network it's 90 miles to my nearest service centre (they are building some new ones) and any repair costs out of warranty will be breathtakingly expensive/ The biggest plus is their supercharger network which beats the others into a proverbial cocked hat plus range and acceleration. Biggest minus is often build quality and leaving owners to report problems without new vehicles being PDI'd. I was lucky.

HOWARDT

The downside to an industry standard battery and motor system is the halting of innovation. Again using Tesla as the example they have made dramatic strides in improving performance from their packs and cooling systems although recent reports suggest that Lucid Motors have made some incredible advances in motor cooling by figuring out dead spots in the magnetic fields where they can route coolants? Again not a cheap car but 1000BHP with 500+ mile range shows what can be done. And what can be done will trickle down to economy cars in time.

pgk

Samsaranda19/11/2020 15:41:18
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I think we have to reluctantly accept that progress will mean changes in our modes of transport, I think the new 2030 deadline is too soon and not practical for numerous reasons, least of all that our ageing electricity infrastructure, I.e. the cables under our streets will be severely challenged with trying to charge everyone’s personal chariot unless major upgrades take place. My preference would be a hydrogen hybrid which would mean less problems with range and home charging would not be necessary if no home charging point was available. Our energy infrastructure is going to be severely challenged with the latest edict from on high that states that there is a target of 100,000 gas boilers to be ripped out each year from existing installations and replaced with air source heat pumps, yet more electrical loads, heat pumps can devour significant amounts of electricity. I will be interested to see how gas boilers will be replaced in blocks of flats with heat pumps, not a lot of room for them; it was also mooted that homes with air source heat pumps would need to have super efficient insulation in order to function with acceptable temperatures generated inside. I accept that change will happen but I am not sure those in the political arena have fully understood the implications of the changes they wish for, this will all be taking place with the economy having to recover from the COVID Pandemic, not yet over, and already estimated to be an astronomic cost to be spread over many years in the future, the costs of the proposed innovations will therefor have to be met by huge increases in personal taxes, there is only a finite amount of money in the system. Are we all up for paying the price?
Dave W

Steviegtr19/11/2020 16:05:39
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1800 forum posts
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Posted by not done it yet on 19/11/2020 11:40:10:

NF,

silly thread?

READ THOSE TWO WORDS AGAIN, PLEASE.

It does actually say thread, not post. Obviously too subtle for you to grasp?

I was actually referring back to the ostentatious joker that started this thread - a confirmed petrol-head with a distinct anti-BEV agenda.

What the hell is wrong with you.

I am not anti BEV. I live with her.

Steve.

bevs evoque.jpg

derek hall 119/11/2020 16:11:47
125 forum posts

Well I am thinking to myself to what I would be doing if I was a silly teenager with his mates coming out of the pub/nightclub late at night when every sensible person is asleep in 2031........."look at all them electric cars being charged...lets unplug em all for a laugh"...........

Que, chaos in the morning as all the cars down that street have no charge due to them being deplugged!

What fun !

Regards to all

Derek

Steviegtr19/11/2020 16:26:29
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1800 forum posts
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Posted by derek hall 1 on 19/11/2020 16:11:47:

Well I am thinking to myself to what I would be doing if I was a silly teenager with his mates coming out of the pub/nightclub late at night when every sensible person is asleep in 2031........."look at all them electric cars being charged...lets unplug em all for a laugh"...........

Que, chaos in the morning as all the cars down that street have no charge due to them being deplugged!

What fun !

Regards to all

Derek

That was one thing i thought would become anti social in a few years time. It will happen for sure. Along with a few claims of tripping up. I know there is a looksee into induction charging ,with a mat buried in the tarmac.

Does anyone know how many countries are doing a change over to electric. Like the big countries. America. India. Arab states etc. ????. Hope it's just not us.

Steve.

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