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Sanitizer

Meth's ?

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David Noble18/03/2020 17:11:48
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A bit of a divergence from my usual questions here but does anyone know the difference between meth's and surgical spirit? I'm thinking along the lines of hand sanitiser. I can buy meth's but not surgical spirit. Thanks.

David

Edited By David Noble on 18/03/2020 17:12:05

Steviegtr18/03/2020 17:19:30
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1164 forum posts
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Not sure what meth's would do to your skin. Maybe dry it out too much.

Steve.

David Noble18/03/2020 17:24:45
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Posted by Steviegtr on 18/03/2020 17:19:30:

Not sure what meth's would do to your skin. Maybe dry it out too much.

Steve.

More than soluble oil?

I could add a tad of glycerine maybe.

David

Rod Renshaw18/03/2020 17:25:13
88 forum posts

AFAIK both meths and surgical spirit are about 90% alcohol and both will dry out the skin. So both could be used as sanitizer in an emergency, but best to use moisturiser as well.

Rod

John Paton 118/03/2020 17:34:56
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And maybe add to that Isopropyl Alchahol which is what most of the gels smell of. I do believe there is an antiviral additive required and that antibacterial doesn't do what we currently need.

If anyone is unable to buy hand sanitiser, there is a specialist firm down in Dorset who is producing it - Wessex Chemical Factors. I don't mind plugging heir name as I have found them incredibly friendly and helpful and on occasion they have make up a cocktail to suit my requirements (true chemists).

I have just bought 5l of hand sanitiser , 5L of anti bac hand wash and 2L of antibac surface cleaner (to be diluted) for use in the village by people volunteering to assist neighbours. Delivery within Dorset is not dear but maybe worse by courier.

Currently I use their cutting fluids for lathe and mill, car screen wash, workshop hand cleanser (with granules), teak restorer (brilliant for garden furniture), pressure wash cleaning additive and have also obtained oil for Myford, Boxford and Centec lubrication from them (tell them what it should have and they will source the appropriate equivalent)

I think their website is currently undergoing 'redevelopment' so you might need to ring them and maybe request their catalogue.

Martin Connelly18/03/2020 17:35:04
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Methanol is added to make the alcohol poisonous. As it can be absorbed through the skin and make you blind it is probably not a good idea to use it as a sanitizer on skin.

Martin C

pgk pgk18/03/2020 17:36:28
1729 forum posts
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What Surgical Spirit contains: The active substance is Methyl Salicylate. The other ingredients are Castor Oil, Diethyl Phthalate, Industrial Methylated Spirit.

..as i recall supposedly designed to taste awful and cause tummy pain if drunk

Meths (back when i was at school) was ethyl alcohol with 10% methyl and purple colourant but Google tells me it can now have IPA instead of ethanol. I can't say I've ever tried tasting it.

I'd guess the mode of action of alcohol is both dehydration and defatting when it comes to topical antisepsis. There should be other viricides about that haven't been scavenged off supermarket shelves - local farm stores would be a good start and possibly garden centres.

pgk

David Noble18/03/2020 18:24:11
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Ok thanks everyone. Maybe not a good idea then!

David

John Haine18/03/2020 18:30:43
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According to this article soap is a highly effective viricide against COVID. It basically makes the virus fall apart.

David Noble18/03/2020 18:37:24
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Posted by John Haine on 18/03/2020 18:30:43:

According to this article soap is a highly effective viricide against COVID. It basically makes the virus fall apart.

Hello John, yes soap is the answer but the sanitiser was for when I'm not near any washing facilities.

David

pgk pgk18/03/2020 21:33:49
1729 forum posts
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Posted by Martin Connelly on 18/03/2020 17:35:04:

Methanol is added to make the alcohol poisonous. As it can be absorbed through the skin and make you blind it is probably not a good idea to use it as a sanitizer on skin.

Martin C

For 40yrs every surgical site I prepped got shaved, scrubbed with antiseptic soap and finally flooded with surgical spirit. None of those animals went blind as a result of it.
Perhaps industrial exposures on a daily basis for a prolonged period might do it but I'd be very suprised if ocassional rinses did. Heck I must have had my own hands in the stuff when dealing with my patients although i grant that at 70 I now wear glasses.

pgk

John C18/03/2020 21:45:24
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Assumption here - very dangerous! If the OP is thinking about sanitising due to the Corona virus, the current advice seems to be that good old fashioned soap is the best defence - something to do with the way soap interacts with the virus. If this assumption is wring, please ignore.

John C18/03/2020 21:47:23
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Wring = wrong!

David Noble18/03/2020 21:59:31
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Posted by John C on 18/03/2020 21:45:24:

Assumption here - very dangerous! If the OP is thinking about sanitising due to the Corona virus, the current advice seems to be that good old fashioned soap is the best defence - something to do with the way soap interacts with the virus. If this assumption is wring, please ignore.

Hi, yes, I'm under no illusions, soap and water is the business. This is for when I'm out of reach of soap and water.

David

Simon Williams 318/03/2020 22:04:32
499 forum posts
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I've been doing some armchair research into alcohol as a sanitiser, and I seem to have concluded that the alcohol content needs to be 90% or higher to be effective against the coronavirus.

I've also investigated the published information about methylated spirit, de-natured alcohol, rubbing alcohol and IPA (iso propyl alcohol)

With the possible exception of IPA (though it seems a big vague what you are actually buying) the others don't seem to necessarily meet the 90% alcohol criterion, so I conclude they are not necessarily effective against this particular virus. I'd hate to put my faith in something which turned out to be ineffective.

As others will by now have followed, the virus hates soap as its outer shell is a fatty protein and breaks up on contact with soap or detergent. I think this is why the medical advice has been that hand washing is the preferred and effective countermeasure against contamination, and alcohol based sanitisers are a second best expedient in the event that proper washing is impractical.

Soap, liquid soap, detergent, washing up liquid, shower gel, shampoo, take your pick, whatever is to hand.

HTH, stay safe!

Rgds Simon

Robert Atkinson 218/03/2020 22:09:08
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Note that 100% alcohol is not fully effective. Between 50 and 80% is much better.

Robert G8RPI

Robin Graham18/03/2020 22:15:28
691 forum posts
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Posted by John C on 18/03/2020 21:45:24:

Assumption here - very dangerous! If the OP is thinking about sanitising due to the Corona virus, the current advice seems to be that good old fashioned soap is the best defence - something to do with the way soap interacts with the virus. If this assumption is wring, please ignore.

There's a good explanation of why soap and water works here . It's not difficult to make DIY handrub - the WHO gives a recipe here . The ingredients for the isopropanol based mix were still widely available when I last looked. I can't see why the ethanol based version wouldn't work with meths, provided one adjusts proportions to give at least 75-80% ethanol in the final mix,

Robin.

Robin Graham18/03/2020 22:27:34
691 forum posts
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Posted by Robert Atkinson 2 on 18/03/2020 22:09:08:

Note that 100% alcohol is not fully effective. Between 50 and 80% is much better.

Robert G8RPI

Can you cite a source for that info Robert? I'm not saying you're wrong, but because there is so much misinformation about this stuff out there (sticking a hairdryer in your mouth?) it's useful to give authoritative sources to allow people to make informed judgements.

Robin

Robin18/03/2020 23:56:53
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340 forum posts

The best defence against corona virus would seem to be quinine based malaria treatment. Some bod spotted that anywhere malaria is endemic they do not have a corona problem. How odd is that?

Paul Lousick19/03/2020 00:28:25
1377 forum posts
532 photos

Washing with soap is the best defence against the virus but I use the hand sanitisers when I am in a shopping centre when I have to touch a trolley, etc.

Washing fruit and vegetables in warm water with detergent and rinsing and drying is recommended

Methylated spirits would probably work to kill the virus if you could put up with the smell. On the otherhand it could be a better alternative as it would keep people from getting too close to you.

Paul

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