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Why does everyone disagree with you

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Steviegtr27/01/2020 01:06:27
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474 forum posts
126 photos

I have been & am a member of many forums. But this one is very special in that if you need help, you get expert info. Which is very good. But if you post any info of your own there are lots of negative comments. Is it the old mans, I know better & do not need any new input. This is going to be bad I know but come on give it your six peneth.

Ditty. I remember fish & chips being 1 & a penny what do you remember.

Steve.

phil gardiner27/01/2020 01:23:54
16 forum posts

Oh i thought it was only me that felt this way.

Kiwi Bloke27/01/2020 01:49:13
300 forum posts
1 photos

When people disagree with me it's invariably because they haven't thought it through adequately...

The Canadian psychologist Jordan Peterson has become somewhat infamous, and has attracted much hate, by daring to challenge political correctness and many widely-held 'truths', which are in fact no more than dogmas. You can find many videos of his talks and interviews on YouTube. He frequently prefaces answers in interviews with 'Well, it's complicated'. How true! Life is complicated, science is complicated, logic is complicated and there is so much that can be shown to be true, whilst being disconcertingly counter-intuitive.

The sad fact is that most people have not been educated to think critically, or even to think for themselves. With the explosion of 'the media', it's too easy for the ignorant or devious to broadcast garbage. It's also too easy to soak up, passively and uncritically, pre-packaged ideas and opinions, rather than to think or learn. Hopefully, knowledge and wisdom, and an appreciation of how complicated things are, comes with age, which is why, I suggest, the older I get, the more exasperated I become with idiot politicians (etc.), whose simplistic evaluations result in knee-jerk 'solutions', and inflexible following of political dogma. I don't think I'm alone. Grrr!

I'd better stop now, calm down, and take my pills...

Simon Collier27/01/2020 04:49:13
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314 forum posts
52 photos

There aren’t enough pills in the MIMS index to calm me down. Only avoidance of the news media helps. You have pretty much said it all. The lack of logic and critical thinking is most of the problem. The subversion of the education system is where it starts. Dogma, and politically correct truths, not open minds and hearing all sides. Climatology is the obvious current example, where an impossibly complex system is reduced to absurdly simplistic notions.

Plasma27/01/2020 07:51:00
350 forum posts
43 photos

I agree that there is a definite negative aspect to this forum regarding information or advice.

I dont know why but one feels a sense of dread when venturing an opinion or asking a "stupid" question. Some of the responses make you feel like a schoolboy being paraded in front of the class for his stupidity. We may as well have a little dunce hat icon for clever members to attach to posts which dont meet their standards.

I'm a member of an American forum and it is so different to this one. Universally supportive, knowledgable without being pompous and good natured even when a little fun is injected.

I recently asked for advice on their forum and was inundated with good, practical and some incredibly technical advice. I know I would not have received the same level of support here.

Some of our mandarins need to think before they post in response to others. For example when I know it's a stupid question but I need to know the answer. Or when I am being funny, ironic, a bit cheeky there is no need to bite my head off.

I'm not sure if it's an english thing or a facet of our hobby which sneers at a lack of knowledge. But this kind of thing will kill the hobby. Its the same at clubs; where shall I go for a good argument and a fall out? Oh yes my local ME club.

Theres my two penneth, make of it what you will.

Danny M2Z27/01/2020 08:17:53
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784 forum posts
282 photos
Posted by Steviegtr on 27/01/2020 01:06:27:

This is going to be bad I know but come on give it your six peneth.

No it isn't Argument

* Danny M *

Brian H27/01/2020 08:28:48
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1392 forum posts
100 photos

You must be a young'un Steve, as a child my chips were 3d (proper money) a bag!

Brian

Bill Chugg27/01/2020 08:30:32
1004 forum posts
7 photos

Steviegtr, I can remember when petrol was 2 shillings and sixpence per gallon.

There are a few who come across as know it all and seem to have done it all, and yes we do have the Myford and Unimat bashers, but fortunately they are outweighed by the majority. of helpful members. Ther are some members who are outstandingly helpful with their advice, even posting pictures to show you how to do it.

Plasma, I agree with you 100% as I also am a member of an American forum and it is so different to this one. Universally supportive, knowledgable without being pompous and good natured even when a little fun is injected. - Excuse me quoting you, but your wording better than mine.

And yes, ther are times when I ask a question in the Beginners section and dread the response. This is a good section, as I consider I will always be a beginner in terms of knowledge and experience.

Bill

Danny M2Z27/01/2020 08:45:28
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784 forum posts
282 photos
Posted by Brian H on 27/01/2020 08:28:48:

You must be a young'un Steve, as a child my chips were 3d (proper money) a bag!

Brian

Mine were wrapped in newspaper and we ate them on the way home on a single decker #108 bus from Bow to Homerton.

Lots of vinegar and if I was good mum paid for a huge pickled onion.

Ask away Stevie, you shall soon learn who are fair dinkum and who are the keyboard warriors.

* Danny M *

Tony Pratt 127/01/2020 08:52:26
987 forum posts
3 photos

Hi Steve, can you give us an example of what you mean?

Tony

Gerard O'Toole27/01/2020 08:53:34
36 forum posts
3 photos
Posted by Danny M2Z on 27/01/2020 08:45:28:
Posted by Brian H on 27/01/2020 08:28:48:

You must be a young'un Steve, as a child my chips were 3d (proper money) a bag!

Brian

Mine were wrapped in newspaper and we ate them on the way home on a single decker #108 bus from Bow to Homerton.

...

* Danny M *

What, you had buses!

Ady127/01/2020 09:03:35
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3503 forum posts
513 photos

Just take the bits you find useful and filter out the bits you don't

 

We are all treading different paths, sometimes these paths cross, sometimes they don't

 

Posted by Brian H on 27/01/2020 08:28:48:

You must be a young'un Steve, as a child my chips were 3d (proper money) a bag!

Brian

 

Mine were sixpence,  acquired by liberating a bit of copper from a muddy puddle in Leith Docks and taking it to a metal dealer on the way to the chip shop

Edited By Ady1 on 27/01/2020 09:10:56

Hollowpoint27/01/2020 09:11:39
277 forum posts
30 photos
Posted by Steviegtr on 27/01/2020 01:06:27:

I have been & am a member of many forums. But this one is very special in that if you need help, you get expert info. Which is very good. But if you post any info of your own there are lots of negative comments. Is it the old mans, I know better & do not need any new input. This is going to be bad I know but come on give it your six peneth.

Ditty. I remember fish & chips being 1 & a penny what do you remember.

Steve.

I completely agree, I often give my opinions and include logic and reason but some seem to think anything that differs from their own advice is wrong. Take the following common debates:

New machines vs old

Carbide vs hss

Morse taper vs r8

If you answered old, carbide and morse taper you are categorically wrong im the eyes of some people. 🙄

Mick B127/01/2020 09:15:04
1357 forum posts
75 photos

Ultimately this is a political issue and will probably get curbed or locked.

It has to do with the majority of members living in a country of declining economic and technical prowess, which induces an environment of cutthroat competition for gainful work, where the outcome doesn't always - or even mostly - reflect merit. This leaves many capable individuals close to or beyond the end of their working careers with issues, which will play out in some form in any communication they engage in. That's my two-penn'orth, anyway.

Barrie Lever27/01/2020 09:27:50
325 forum posts
2 photos
Posted by Steviegtr on 27/01/2020 01:06:27:

But if you post any info of your own there are lots of negative comments. Is it the old mans, I know better & do not need any new input.

Steve.

Steve

This is because a number of the denizens of the forum don't know as much as what they think they do !! they continue to live in a bubble and don't look at what is happening around them, preferring to stick to old clichés that support their inadequate thinking and knowledge.

The forum is actually riddled with inaccuracies and bad advice, some of it from higher echelons of the forum.

Having said that the forum is worth reading if you are amused at the above mentioned wallowing way out of their depth.

There is a small percentage of useful and accurate information but don't think for one moment that it is in the majority of posts, of course that could include this post of mine !!

Maybe the problem stems from the editorial direction of the parent ME magazine, the ME is a pale shadow of it's former self, I have a complete year set from 1918 and a complete year set from 2018, there is absolutely no comparison in the quality and breadth of content, 1918 winning by a country mile. The bulk of my ME collection is from 1950 to 1970's and the content was broader and more useful in those magazines than is the case now.

B.

Michael Gilligan27/01/2020 09:38:31
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14777 forum posts
635 photos

Question posed by the thread title : Why does everyone disagree with you

Response : Probably an invalid question [false premise], and therefore unanswerable

...

Slightly more helpful :

Because this is a forum ... which, by definition, is a place where people declare opinions

Because some contributors have strong ‘pre-conceived notions’

Because some people are naturally disposed to ‘preach’ rather than to discuss

etcetera, etcetera

.

Keep it coming, Steve ... I, for one, am enjoying your posts.

MichaelG.

Daniel27/01/2020 09:39:08
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257 forum posts
39 photos
Posted by Ady1 on 27/01/2020 09:03:35:

"Just take the bits you find useful and filter out the bits you don't

We are all treading different paths, sometimes these paths cross, sometimes they don't";

Very well put Ady.

That's my take on it.

ATB,

Daniel

Gerard O'Toole27/01/2020 09:48:21
36 forum posts
3 photos

Steve, I read your post which I think gave rise to this topic and I understand why you are a little put out at some of the responses.

For what it is worth, I still think they are in the minority here. I for one enjoyed your post

Ady127/01/2020 09:55:31
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3503 forum posts
513 photos

If you look back at the ME postbag over the previous 90 years you will find some amazing cagefights fought literally for months between various individuals

The language was often deeply respectful and oldy worldy while they fought to the death over the subject matter

IanT27/01/2020 10:00:15
1415 forum posts
140 photos
Posted by Michael Gilligan on 27/01/2020 09:38:31:

Question posed by the thread title : Why does everyone disagree with you

Response : Probably an invalid question [false premise], and therefore unanswerable

...

Slightly more helpful :

Because this is a forum ... which, by definition, is a place where people declare opinions

Because some contributors have strong ‘pre-conceived notions’

Because some people are naturally disposed to ‘preach’ rather than to discuss

etcetera, etcetera

.

Keep it coming, Steve ... I, for one, am enjoying your posts.

MichaelG.

You will often see quite different opinions voiced here and it's partly I think because we are a very broad church in the interests we pursue. So you have people with a very wide range of experience who work on projects ranging from horology to full-sized locomotive repair. What makes sense to one will not always make any sense at all to others. This is why one mans "toy" lathe is another persons dream machine.

I try to explain what I do and why within a context (being part machinist & part small scale modeller). My machining methods work for me but might not for others. I need good results but I don't need micron precision. My machinery is mostly old and has seen better days - I occasionally curse it but haven't yet been tempted to change it. Fortunately, I don't need to make a living at what I do (or I'd starve). Whilst I can afford most of what I need and/or want these days, that wasn't always true and I'm still reluctant to spend big money if I can find cheaper ways...

So I am therefore somewhat unique in what I do and the way that I do it - as are most folk on this Forum. We are all different in many small (and sometimes large) ways in both our preferences and experience. I don't see that as a problem - more an advantage - but it would sometimes help if folk put their suggestions into context - e.g. tractor or clock....00 or 71/4"

Regards,

IanT

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