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Blimey! It's never straightforward...

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Roderick Jenkins31/10/2019 12:33:05
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I hadn't done any 3D printing for a couple of months. So, I fire up Cura and, as usual, download the latest version (4 in this case). I started printing something but after about 5 minutes the PLA filament stopped feeding and broke. Right, I thought, the filamant is old, I'll get some new stuff. Same problem. OK, we'll try a new hot end. Same problem. Close scrutiny of the filament end showed tell tale marks from the drive splines - it seems to be reversing. Go back to Cura 3 and problem solved. After about 1/2 hour the print separated from the bed. I've tried everything I know but the nice new black filament will not stick. I go back to the old filament. Success! Great adhesion, so much so that when I separated this print it brought half the glass bed with it:

platten tear out 1.jpg

platten tear out 2.jpg

I had a spare.

Anyway, this idea from Neil's book worked very nicely.

quick handle.jpg

Still can't get the new black filament to stick though sad

Rod

Bandersnatch31/10/2019 13:26:57
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That's why I'm still using Cura 15.04.6. It does what I want and installing a new version wants to overwrite all my previous settings.

I'm not looking for trouble.

Andrew Johnston31/10/2019 13:35:47
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Rod: At least you got a file out of the system. I need to do some printing for work. So this morning I downloaded the latest Cura (4.?) on the new computer. Ducking useless! All it did was whinge about a disc not being in some obscure imaginary drive. It never started properly and I couldn't get rid of the annoying pop up about the drive. Had to restart the computer in the end. The "new" versions of Cura did this a few months ago when I last tried updating. So I reverted to 15.? on the old computer. That didn't seem to display brims properly. So I gave up and used the g-code file I already had.

Sadly it seems that Ultimaker have gone the way of many start ups in believing their own hype. So we get over-complicated software with unwanted "features" that plain don't work. Worse than a chocolate teapot - at least you can eat the teapot.

Andrew

Brian G31/10/2019 14:49:13
613 forum posts
25 photos

I never delete the most recent working version of Cura when I "upgrade" it. That way I can always go back to see if a problem is with the slicer, and I can open both versions alongside each other to confirm that they are using the same settings. Turned out useful when Cura 4.3 wouldn't recognise the printer files for my Kossell and I had to copy the settings over from 3.6 one by one. Oddly, 4.3 prints brims or skirts but like Andrew, I cannot get it to display them.

Brian

Bandersnatch31/10/2019 15:45:57
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Posted by Brian G on 31/10/2019 14:49:13:

I never delete the most recent working version of Cura when I "upgrade" it.



... but does the new version want to overwrite your previous settings?

I can install, independently, a newer version than my 15.04.6 but if I try to run it, it says the configuration file is incompatible and won't run unless I allow it to be overwritten.

[ It's possible that this only happens when moving from the old (15.x) series to the newer (3.x / 4.x series) ]

Brian G31/10/2019 16:38:10
613 forum posts
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Posted by Bandersnatch on 31/10/2019 15:45:57:
Posted by Brian G on 31/10/2019 14:49:13:

I never delete the most recent working version of Cura when I "upgrade" it.



... but does the new version want to overwrite your previous settings?

I can install, independently, a newer version than my 15.04.6 but if I try to run it, it says the configuration file is incompatible and won't run unless I allow it to be overwritten.

[ It's possible that this only happens when moving from the old (15.x) series to the newer (3.x / 4.x series) ]

I couldn't remember exactly what I had done, so I have renamed my Ultimaker Cura 4.3 folder and then repeated the update to check it. I would suggest that you rename any Cura folders to protect them before trying any of what follows. This is what worked for me but no guarantees it works for you, hence my suggestion to protect your old version.

I had the same message about resetting when going from 3.6 to 4.3 but instead of clicking "reset" just closed the message box. Then I manually copied the .def.json configuration files for my printer and its extruder (in my case these were anycubic_kossel_plus.def.json and anycubic_kossel_plus_extruder_0.def.json I assume that yours will be similar but with the name of your machine) from the Ultimaker Cura 3.6/resources/definitions folder into the newly created Ultimaker Cura 4.3/resources/definitions folder. I then launched Cura 4.3 without getting warning message and it allows me to select the printer and create valid gcode that is printing now.

I haven't got Cura 15.xx but looking at the earlier versions that are on my PC, I notice that in the past each printer only had a .json file, whilst 4.3 uses .def.json files. You could perhaps just try renaming the extensions of your copied files to suit? Sometimes new file extensions are just a proprietary name for an existing file type. I have absolutely no idea whether this is done to protect an application from revisions to the existing file type, to allow for changes, or just to obscure things.

BrianG

Bandersnatch31/10/2019 17:28:35
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Thanks, BrianG .... I'll take another look at some point.

The recollection I have is that each version of Cura wrote something at the same location in the /user/ folder rather than (or as well as) the install location and it was that which gave me the problem. Although I could have renamed what was there each time, I was trying to end up with both the earlier (15.x) and later (3.x / 4.x) versions easily usable as alternatives for comparison which didn't seem possible (without continual renaming).

Versaboss31/10/2019 17:29:49
428 forum posts
51 photos

Forget that Cura, and download PrusaSlicer from the Prusa website for free. I did so, and forgot my non-working example of Simplify3D. Although I often think I should really make a screen-video and show the world how useless that (not cheap) slicer is.

Regards,
Hans

XD 35131/10/2019 18:57:59
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1362 forum posts
118 photos

Can’t say i have ever had any of these problems with Cura ! Are you certain that you are not downloading new installation rather than updating the old version ? To update i click extensions and then update checker and if a new version is there I install it , it usually gives a pop up window asking do i want to delete setting files which is a NO !

once it is installed i usually have to drag the icon for the new version to my desktop and delete the old one , once i fire up the new version sometimes i have to click the little pencil icon at top left of screen to make the dropdown window for my settings appear and it has never changed any settings in that on me .

Rod ,

Have you measured the new filament ? It may be a little thicker and jamming up causing som under extrusion on the first layer . Is the new filament the same brand ? I recently changed brands from cheapie stuff to ultimaker brand and the difference was like chalk and cheese and i had to adjust my first layer flow considerably as it started over extruding . With the cheap stuff if i left it in the tube overnight it would snap inside the tube but the ultimaker stuff doesn’t and the finish is much better also .

Like Sol says in the Castrol ad Oils aint Oils and i guess filaments aint filaments !

Bandersnatch31/10/2019 21:06:36
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1280 forum posts
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Posted by XD 351 on 31/10/2019 18:57:59:

Can’t say i have ever had any of these problems with Cura ! Are you certain that you are not downloading new installation rather than updating the old version ?

If you're replying to me XD (hard to tell) that's exactly what I was doing (deliberately) .... downloading a new installation rather than updating the old. To recap, I wanted to run the new version while still keeping the earlier version. The earlier one works well for me and I wouldn't want to lose it until I've proven the new version is satisfactory (to me).

Unfortunately, it seems the two versions "see" each other via entries in the \user\ directory.

XD 35101/11/2019 07:57:48
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1362 forum posts
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Hi Bandersnatch,

Not directly to you as Andrew has had similar issues .

I think (and i'm no computer expert ) that trying to run duel versions of the same programme will lead to registry issues as they will be trying to use the same address or files .

When i upgrade Cura it is running the uninstal wizard so it is completely uninstalling the programme but if you click yes to save settings when it pops up it should save your settings and re load them into the new version which is what i have found works for me .

What would be really nice is if these slicers could be loaded onto one of the various forms of SD storage devices and used like that then you can switch slicers at will , a bit like changing the OS on a Raspberry PI .

From what i have seen the Prusa slicer has come a long way and i was watching Angus from Makers Muse on Youtube use primitives to delete the top and bottom layers on a print so he ended up with a sieve - not that i have looked but does cura or any other slice do this ?

SillyOldDuffer01/11/2019 09:35:07
4843 forum posts
1018 photos
Posted by XD 351 on 01/11/2019 07:57:48:

Hi Bandersnatch,

Not directly to you as Andrew has had similar issues .

I think (and i'm no computer expert ) that trying to run duel versions of the same programme will lead to registry issues as they will be trying to use the same address or files .

...

What would be really nice is if these slicers could be loaded onto one of the various forms of SD storage devices and used like that then you can switch slicers at will , a bit like changing the OS on a Raspberry PI .

...

Whether or not multiple versions of a program will ordinarily run side-by-side is a developer design decision. For example, Python2 and Python3 co-exist because they have been deliberately built to do so. Finding out if a particular application can be installed in parallel needs research, it may be clear in the documentation, or it may require a non-trivial conference with the vendor.

Unfortunately most applications won't naturally coexist. One reason is that user configurations are almost always carried forward and tweaked between updates, which scuppers the old code. Another is the need to prevent undefined behaviour due to new code using old components and vice versa. The easiest way of keeping everything clean is for the installation to simply destroy older executables and modify the original configuration settings.

Overwriting is great as long as the new version does what the old one did, not so good if it's buggy.

It is possible to maintain multiple versions of software not built to do it, but it's done at the cost of new bother by adding a separation layer to isolate all the components. One way is to create an entire Virtual Machine in which the computer hosts another complete operating system and environment alongside the real one. This feels over the top for this requirement.

More practical might be a Sandbox environment like Sandboxie. Sandboxes create separate working spaces in which programs can be installed and run blissfully unaware of other copies. Because each version runs in it's own space, each has to be set-up independently. This is often useful, for example when the same version of a program is needed to drive two completely different set-ups. Many sandboxes can be set up if that's useful.

Although tools like Sandboxie try hard to make sandboxing easy, it's not always straightforward, for example if the software license detects and blocks multiple copies. The user also has to remember which sandbox he needs to engage!

Pure theory - never needed to sandbox anything myself. But as the technology exists and is respectable, it's worth a try.

Dave

 

Edited By SillyOldDuffer on 01/11/2019 09:37:06

Neil Wyatt01/11/2019 15:22:47
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16740 forum posts
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Hi Rod,

My printer came with a bit of ordinary mirror as the bed. In the end a similar thing happened, due partly to impatience.

I now use a sheet of borosilicate glass with a thin coating of 50/50 PVA/water.

I don't have any issues with adhesion (except for a sample of Rigid Ink I couldn't get to adhere for love nor money!)

I find things self-release (with a click) if I leave them long enough to cool to room temperature.

The glass is also MUCH tougher and less likely to crack or spall.

Neil

Neil Wyatt01/11/2019 15:24:11
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Posted by Bandersnatch on 31/10/2019 13:26:57:

That's why I'm still using Cura 15.04.6. It does what I want and installing a new version wants to overwrite all my previous settings.

I'm on Cura 4.2.1 (started on 14) and it's always carried over my settings,. just make sure the is ticked box when upgrading.

Neil

Neil Wyatt01/11/2019 15:29:10
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Posted by Brian G on 31/10/2019 14:49:13:

Oddly, 4.3 prints brims or skirts but like Andrew, I cannot get it to display them.

Brian

At the top it says 'prepare' 'preview' 'monitor'

If you choose 'preview' it will show brims, skirts and support material.

Neil

Neil Wyatt01/11/2019 15:35:22
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Well I'm downloading 4.3.0 I will report on any issues!

Bandersnatch01/11/2019 16:20:40
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Posted by SillyOldDuffer on 01/11/2019 09:35:07:

More practical might be a Sandbox environment like Sandboxie.



I never thought of that .... and I do have Sandboxie installed. Could give that a try.

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