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Notre Dame

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Nicholas Farr16/04/2019 10:53:02
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Posted by Alan Waddington 2 on 16/04/2019 09:11:34:

Can’t help thinking the money it will take to rebuild could be better spent elsewhere, its just a building when all’s said and done.

Hi, but that may not attract valuable tourism.

Regards Nick.

Martin Kyte16/04/2019 11:28:51
1393 forum posts
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Posted by Nicholas Farr on 16/04/2019 10:53:02:
Posted by Alan Waddington 2 on 16/04/2019 09:11:34:

Can’t help thinking the money it will take to rebuild could be better spent elsewhere, its just a building when all’s said and done.

Hi, but that may not attract valuable tourism.

Regards Nick.

Well the 100,000,000 euro's just pledged by a single family wasn't on offer before this happened so you cannot really demand it be spent at all let alone on something else.

regards Martin

XD 35116/04/2019 11:36:44
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1210 forum posts
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As tragic as it is losing one of the worlds icons / treasures and many of the pieces of art and artifacts within thankfully no one died !

We had our ( fortunately) now ex Leader here in OZ come out and ask for a fund to be set up to rebuild it even though we could use that money for Hospitals , Education and probably a million other things we desperately need here - the guy is a di@# head and thank god he is gone !

Ian Johnson 116/04/2019 11:44:52
37 forum posts
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Posted by Mike Poole on 16/04/2019 01:10:53:

A little clarification for you Hopper, the National Mototorcycle museum is at Bickenhill near Birmingham and the National Motor Museum is at Beaulieu, the motorcycle one burnt down but is now near fully restored. Just had an entertaining 3 hour talk from Norman Hyde on his days as a development engineer for Triumph which seemed a good excuse to race Triumphs, they had great success for a low budget operation with Doug Hele leading the team.

Mike

You are right Mike I misread the post, I didn't notice the Beaulieu reference

Peter G. Shaw16/04/2019 11:53:31
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946 forum posts
39 photos

Yes, it's amazing just how much folk will give for something like this, but when it comes to health, education etc, not a penny, cent, peso or whatever. It does seem to me that priorities are wrong.

Peter G. Shaw

Ian S C16/04/2019 11:56:37
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7262 forum posts
227 photos

I heard that the place was also known as the forest because of the amount of timber used in it;s construction, and it was the wood that was the thing that was being worked on as it was in a bad state, worry about the roof falling in, and that sort of thing. I think from what I'v heard here, "we have a cathedral here that needs rebuilding after the earthquake 8 years ago (well 2 Cathedrals actually, C of E, and RC).

Ian S C

Mike Poole16/04/2019 12:14:34
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1812 forum posts
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The Hindu community in London built this magnificent temple in Wembley, I think they had to bring some of the skilled people from India but I am sure the skills exist worldwide to restore Notre Dame to its former glory.Wembley Temple.

Mike

ChrisB16/04/2019 13:12:02
261 forum posts
106 photos
Posted by Alan Waddington 2 on 16/04/2019 09:11:34:

Can’t help thinking the money it will take to rebuild could be better spent elsewhere, its just a building when all’s said and done.

Let's be honest - No, it's not "just a building" if it were, no one would care. It's history, a thousand years of it - that's why it will be restored. Every country in the world worth it's name will do it's best to preserve it's history.

Let me say that I agree with part of your comment that there's money which could be better spent elsewhere - that money could come from governments who spend multiple billions yearly on armaments etc.

 

Edited By ChrisB on 16/04/2019 13:12:29

Roger Williams 216/04/2019 13:57:04
328 forum posts
2 photos

Alan Waddington 2, well said. Makes me angry when I see people on street corners in the rain collecting money for cancer research, when they will now spend billions on a building which is just a monument to human stupidity.

Clive Hartland16/04/2019 13:58:56
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2414 forum posts
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They say the lead roofing has melted, what a mess with molten lead if that is so!

Gas_mantle.16/04/2019 17:24:50
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356 forum posts
269 photos
Posted by Roger Williams 2 on 16/04/2019 13:57:04:

Alan Waddington 2, well said. Makes me angry when I see people on street corners in the rain collecting money for cancer research, when they will now spend billions on a building which is just a monument to human stupidity.

Well said, if someone has a few million to spare isn't it sad they haven't had the urge to want to put it to use helping the starving, sick etc.

Guy Lamb16/04/2019 17:48:21
35 forum posts
Posted by ChrisB on 16/04/2019 13:12:02:
Posted by Alan Waddington 2 on 16/04/2019 09:11:34:

Can’t help thinking the money it will take to rebuild could be better spent elsewhere, its just a building when all’s said and done.

Let's be honest - No, it's not "just a building" if it were, no one would care. It's history, a thousand years of it - that's why it will be restored. Every country in the world worth it's name will do it's best to preserve it's history.

Let me say that I agree with part of your comment that there's money which could be better spent elsewhere - that money could come from governments who spend multiple billions yearly on armaments etc.

Edited By ChrisB on 16/04/2019 13:12:29

It's very much open to debate, do we recreate a building/locomotive/ship &co to replace the lost artifact or repair what is left of the original ? If we rebuild totally all you get is a facsimile, however good. If we repair, to which particular point in time do we choose, as a building like N D changed very much over its 850 years. BTW I believe the spire was a 19c construction contemporary with Baron Haussmanns rebuilding of Paris.

Guy

ChrisB16/04/2019 18:30:42
261 forum posts
106 photos

As far as I can tell from the news the damage, although extensive did not render the cathedral a ruin. So imho it makes sense to repair the damage. I won't get into how it should be done as I'm no restorer nor a history expert.

What amuses me is people suggesting one should not donate to have it fixed. I mean, why should it be a sad thing to donate for such a cause if one had the means? It's a good cause, just as much as donating to the poor...which I believe they all do!

Samsaranda16/04/2019 18:50:24
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618 forum posts
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Guy, I didn’t realise the spire was a 19th century addition, probably explains why it looked ridiculous perched up on the roof, it was totally out of character with the form of the building, hope they choose not to reinstate it but then I suppose they will want to recreate an exact facsimile.

Dave W

Cornish Jack16/04/2019 18:58:17
868 forum posts
111 photos

Two possibilities??

Clean up the remains and leave as is ... like the original Coventry Cathedral.

or

Rebuild as was BUT ... it will only ever be a replica!!

As to available craftsmen - check on the Guedelon site - **LINK**

Genuine original skills AND French, to boot!

rgds

Bill

duncan webster16/04/2019 19:18:41
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1960 forum posts
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Never noticed it before but Samsandra is right, leave the spire off it's out of place. as to repairing it, throughout the history of these buildings bits have been mended or replaced, one end of Hexham Abbey was a complete ruin until the Victorians rebuilt it, should they have left it alone? I think not. As long as they don't fit a flat felt roof.

Nigel McBurney 116/04/2019 19:23:19
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building & restoration work again the probable cause of the fire,and accidents keep on happening, and it will happen again because people involved are careless and there do not appear to be any one constantly checking buidings after work for the day has finished,lot cheaper than total disaster. Watching the news last night,one view along one side of the building only showed one hose on a hydraulic tower ,whats the use of one jet of water on a fire that size,look back on any film of the London blitz and the large numbers of hoses in use and the streets filled with hoses all pumping water,noawadays there appears to be just like the local councils ,ten firemen and their bosses looking on and just one bloke with a hose. My old man was in the brigade after the war,and it was usually two appliances and ten men and they put fires out ,on the dailly news it now takes an awful lot more me and they never appear to get stuck in,I expect half the time is taken up with risk assesments.

And why spend all that money on rebuild on something that is of no real practical use.

Bill Phinn16/04/2019 20:46:10
158 forum posts
35 photos
Posted by Nigel McBurney 1 on 16/04/2019 19:23:19:

And why spend all that money on rebuild on something that is of no real practical use.

I could give you a long disquisition on various needs and yearnings that make us human, but Francis Thompson summed it up more eloquently in his sonnet "O nothing in this corporal earth of man...", particularly in the closing lines:

"...Our towns are copied fragments from our breast,

And all man's Babylons strive but to impart

The grandeurs of his Babylonian heart."

Notre Dame is one such Babylon.

SillyOldDuffer16/04/2019 20:55:52
3996 forum posts
810 photos
Posted by Nigel McBurney 1 on 16/04/2019 19:23:19:

... Watching the news last night,one view along one side of the building only showed one hose on a hydraulic tower ,whats the use of one jet of water on a fire that size,look back on any film of the London blitz and the large numbers of hoses in use and the streets filled with hoses all pumping water,noawadays there appears to be just like the local councils ,ten firemen and their bosses looking on and just one bloke with a hose.

...

And why spend all that money on rebuild on something that is of no real practical use.

I can see 3 hoses in one picture, all on giant cherry-pickers. Not an item of kit the average fire brigade would have.

Notre Dame's spire is about 175m high, and the lower roof about 60m up. An ordinary fire engine would have no chance of squirting water that high effectively.

Tourism is worth €77bn per year to the French economy and Notre Dame is a major attraction. For that reason alone it's worth repairing.

Gas_mantle.16/04/2019 21:00:07
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356 forum posts
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Posted by Bill Phinn on 16/04/2019 20:46:10:

I could give you a long disquisition on various needs and yearnings that make us human, but Francis Thompson summed it up more eloquently in his sonnet "O nothing in this corporal earth of man...", particularly in the closing lines:

"...Our towns are copied fragments from our breast,

And all man's Babylons strive but to impart

The grandeurs of his Babylonian heart."

Notre Dame is one such Babylon.

I'm sure the starving millions will sleep happily tonight after reading that sonnet and knowing the money is being put to good use

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