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Why don't we make models of things like this?

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Neil Wyatt05/03/2017 21:44:12
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I just turned up this on Wikipedia:

An electric motor with as much character as a steam engine? More character than a totally enclosed uniflow steam engine!

So why don't we (generally) see models of things like this?

What other oddities do people think would make good models?

Neil

John Haine05/03/2017 22:23:13
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Cos it's electrickery.....

Phil P05/03/2017 22:33:00
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We do make stuff like that.

workshop 012 11-05-14.jpg

And its going to be driven by a Uniflow engine.

workshop 016 11-05-14.jpg

workshop 017 11-05-14.jpg

This model was started by the late Arnold Throp in the 1940's, and has been passed through various owners before ending up with me.

I will hopefully be finishing it and displaying it at some point when I have finished my model of "Agnes"

Phil

Allan B05/03/2017 22:34:32
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Would be cool to make, I think it's just because there are more plans for steam available
Andy Ash05/03/2017 22:52:51
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Very similar to your synchronous motor would be the Alexanderson alternators they used to generate high power VLF (long wave) transmissions in the early days of radio.

They didn't have thermionic valves big enough to use as oscillators, so they did it mechanically instead!

Georgineer05/03/2017 22:55:09
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After I've built the Boy's Own Model Gas Engine of 1895 (detailed design still a work-in-progress) I plan to build the boy's Own Small Generator of 1891, then link the two together.

fig.  012.jpg

Does that count?

George

Edited By Georgineer on 05/03/2017 22:56:16

JA05/03/2017 23:08:04
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Andy

Didn't they try send voice/music using such things before valves (triodes) arrived?

General

As for modelling such an item, it is not sexy unlike a steam engine or locomotive. I can just about understand those who want to make a 1/4 scale model of a Dean, Smith & Grace lathe (like the one I walk passed three or four times a week) but if I made a scale model of an RB211-22B would anyone be interested? [One: It would not work. Two: I would not even try].

JA

Andy Ash05/03/2017 23:29:31
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Radio transmission was one of the things that Tesla was messing around with.

I'd bet he tried all sorts of stuff.

Generally though I think the early VLF transmission were probably morse code.

If you have high power CW transmitter you can modulate it with a broomstick and some drawing pins!!!

Doug Bauld06/03/2017 06:01:29
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Neil does have a very good point, I for one will not Knock It. Just try winding the coils by hand and laying them for correct connection to the commutator ?

Neil Wyatt06/03/2017 07:08:25
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Posted by Phil P on 05/03/2017 22:33:00:

We do make stuff like that.

workshop 012 11-05-14.jpg

And its going to be driven by a Uniflow engine.

workshop 016 11-05-14.jpg

workshop 017 11-05-14.jpg

This model was started by the late Arnold Throp in the 1940's, and has been passed through various owners before ending up with me.

I will hopefully be finishing it and displaying it at some point when I have finished my model of "Agnes"

Phil

Excellent Phil -the exception that proves the rule! Although the fact it's still unfinished sixty years on says a lot too!

Please document the build and then share it with Diane for ME!

Neil

Neil Wyatt06/03/2017 07:10:40
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Posted by Georgineer on 05/03/2017 22:55:09:

After I've built the Boy's Own Model Gas Engine of 1895 (detailed design still a work-in-progress) I plan to build the boy's Own Small Generator of 1891, then link the two together.

fig.  012.jpg

Does that count?

George

Edited By Georgineer on 05/03/2017 22:56:16

Yep!

Parents must have been very understanding in 1891 to let boys attach handwheels to 'Dining Room Table T'.

Neil

JasonB06/03/2017 07:40:23
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Neil, generators are very popular on the other side of the channel, the Germans seem to be very keen on them be they driven by steam or IC engines

Quite a nice build of one here, note the unusual use of alphabeti spagetti. The German ME supplies also sell quite a few generator kits

And closer to home over on MEM there is someone making up a generator to be driven by an Alyn Foundry Retlas engine. You may also be interested in the Franklin Engine there too.

J

richardandtracy06/03/2017 09:10:14
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Posted by Neil Wyatt on 05/03/2017 21:44:12:

...So why don't we (generally) see models of things like this?...

Because steam seems to take on a character of its own when working. Electrical stuff looks identical whether live, not running or dead as a Dodo. It has all the charm & attraction of a brick or transistor or a smack in the face.

Regards,

Richard.

JA06/03/2017 09:19:07
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I went to sleep thinking about Neil's last question - What other oddities do people think would make good models?

Obviously the model must be seen to do something and if possible its working parts be seen to move. Most types of steam engine have been done to death but two engines come to mind. One is the early paddle steamer engine (I know there are plans for some out there, perhaps even castings). The other would be an Easton, Amos & Sons drainage machine. There is a fine working machine not too far from me and I have spent quite a few days, when the workshop has been too cold, trying to make drawings for a model. I realise now that I will never start cutting metal for it.

Ian S C06/03/2017 10:19:01
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Volume one of "The Model Engineer and Amateur Electrician" (note the original name), has plans for a number of electric motors / generators.

Ian S C

JasonB06/03/2017 10:45:23
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JA, I know someone who also has desires to make a model of the engine at Westonzoylands too, I did take quite a few photos of the ones that were at Prestons for them.

Harry Wilkes06/03/2017 11:08:01
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Posted by Neil Wyatt on 05/03/2017 21:44:12:

I just turned up this on Wikipedia:

An electric motor with as much character as a steam engine? More character than a totally enclosed uniflow steam engine!

So why don't we (generally) see models of things like this?

What other oddities do people think would make good models?

Neil

Don't make them Neil but I've serviced one or two of them and their bigger cousins with brushes like house bricks wink

H

Russell Eberhardt06/03/2017 11:42:38
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In the future will people make scale models of microprocessors?

Does quantum theory scale?

Russell

Neil Wyatt06/03/2017 11:53:04
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Posted by JasonB on 06/03/2017 07:40:23:

Neil, generators are very popular on the other side of the channel, the Germans seem to be very keen on them be they driven by steam or IC engines

Quite a nice build of one here, note the unusual use of alphabeti spagetti. The German ME supplies also sell quite a few generator kits

And closer to home over on MEM there is someone making up a generator to be driven by an Alyn Foundry Retlas engine. You may also be interested in the Franklin Engine there too.

J

Wow! That makes me even more perplexed that UK modellers don't choose these as a subject! The usual UK approach is to stuff a permanent magnet motor in a decorative shell.

Are those kits of castings or just screw together kits? I clicked the Union Flag but nothing happens - I can scratch by in French but German is beyond me.

Neil

Edited By Neil Wyatt on 06/03/2017 11:57:49

Neil Wyatt06/03/2017 11:54:05
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Posted by richardandtracy on 06/03/2017 09:10:14:
Posted by Neil Wyatt on 05/03/2017 21:44:12:

...So why don't we (generally) see models of things like this?...

Because steam seems to take on a character of its own when working. Electrical stuff looks identical whether live, not running or dead as a Dodo. It has all the charm & attraction of a brick or transistor or a smack in the face.

I can't agree, I think an open-frame generator has at least as much interest as something like a Stuart Sirius.

Neil

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