By continuing to use this site, you agree to our use of cookies. Find out more

Member postings for petro1head

Here is a list of all the postings petro1head has made in our forums. Click on a thread name to jump to the thread.

Thread: WM18 - Z Axis power feed
11/08/2019 04:24:54
Posted by ChrisB on 10/08/2019 21:24:11:

Glad to see it working! 😋

Cheers, the smaller motor still lives so may be put to use for something or you can buy it

 

 

Edited By petro1head on 11/08/2019 04:25:42

10/08/2019 21:17:09
Posted by not done it yet on 10/08/2019 20:27:21:

Will it move slowly enough to power feed while cutting?

Yes

10/08/2019 20:09:28

I have completed my project. Thanks for the great input guys

Z Power feed 1.jpg

Z Power feed 2.jpg

 
PS Could a MOD edit the title to add: Finished Project please

Edited By petro1head on 10/08/2019 20:10:30

10/08/2019 09:54:03

Progress report. Yeh it a slow progress due let downs by ebay suppliers

I ordered the replacement 3Nm motor which arrives within 2 days, well done EU Stepperonline

Control box is built, wiring done.

I have one question re limit switches. I have one at the top but unsure where or even if, the lower should go. My thinking is depending what I am doing the lower stop will never be in the right place?

Thread: What hand protection do you use?
10/08/2019 09:50:05

Mechanics gloves

Thread: Finished my beam engine.
10/08/2019 09:48:47
Posted by Malc on 06/08/2019 21:03:49:

Julius de Waal Beam engine.f82242a3-b235-4907-a3bc-16483bffa036.jpeg

That looks fab

Thread: Any ideas please as to waht themay be ?
10/08/2019 09:47:58

Looks a bit like an expresso maker

Thread: Is your spindle bore large enough?
10/08/2019 09:46:12
Posted by ChrisB on 09/08/2019 19:21:20:

I think the spindle bore is never large enough! but I usually make do with what I have, especially for a one off.

Can't remember exactly what I was doing here, I guess it was shortening a cardan shaft... oddly enough it didn't come out too bad!

untitled.jpg

Edited By ChrisB on 09/08/2019 19:21:39

I would agree, I have 38mm and sometimes wish it was bigger, in fact I just wish I had a bigger lathe

Just looking at your photo made me realise I have never used the steady

Edited By petro1head on 10/08/2019 09:47:04

Thread: WM18 - Z Axis power feed
06/08/2019 17:53:23
Posted by ChrisB on 06/08/2019 17:42:37:

Wow! Are you sure you have a gas strut on your WM18 petrolhead? I mean no wonder you want a power assistance with 6.5kg force to move the head. I have checked mine and it's not more than 2kg to break away. Can someone else with a similar mill check as well please?

If you can't send the motor back, maybe you can use a different mounting setup? Say with a belt, and use a reduction to gain a mechanical advantage?

Trying to somehow redeem myself....🤔

My WM18 has the gas strut, had to reinstall it when I assembled the machine in the hut.

It was SillyOldDuffer's machine that needed 6.6kg as his does not have the gas strut

You will have to try harder than that crying 2

 

Edited By petro1head on 06/08/2019 17:54:04

06/08/2019 17:51:08
Posted by Joseph Noci 1 on 06/08/2019 17:11:14:

You can always use that motor on the x axis now..

Joe

I have the Warco one, however the motor has now stopped working, so in the bin it goes

06/08/2019 16:51:16
Posted by SillyOldDuffer on 06/08/2019 16:23:05:

For sizing the motor, here's what it look to overcome stiction and lift my WM18's head:

dsc06149.jpg

A weight of 6.5kg suspended from the manual winding handle was necessary to get movement. The handle is 55mm from the axle. 6.5kg is approximately 64N.

T = 0.055m x 64N = 3.52Nm

The handle turns the screw via 1:1 gearing.

Th e measurement confirms the 1.9Nm motor recommended by Chris is too small and a 3 to 4Nm motor as recommended by Joe is in the right ball-park. Not sure how typical my WM18 is: certainly raising the head is hard work! Given my figures a 4Nm motor would be needed for my WM18.

As my maths is awful, grateful for corrections...

Dave

Edited By SillyOldDuffer on 06/08/2019 16:25:33

Thanks for that. Does your WM18 have the gas strut

06/08/2019 16:50:07
Posted by Lainchy on 06/08/2019 16:37:17:

My WM14 is quite heavy to lift the head. I saw that Andrew Whale has fitted a gas strut to assist on his Sieg Mill. Is this an option on the WM18?

My WM18 has the gas strut and was std

06/08/2019 15:55:51
Posted by ChrisB on 06/08/2019 15:27:01:

Oh no! Looking at your photo showing the stepper on the column and noticed it's a fair bit short compared to the one I have. Checked mine and it's a 3NM NEMA 23...I need to go hide for a while - I'm really sorry!

Aggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggg, FFS!

You are in the dog house!

I cant send the motor back becuase I shortened the wires

06/08/2019 15:54:33
Posted by Joseph Noci 1 on 06/08/2019 14:51:44:

What do you mean by 'top end'? At high speed ( top end of) or top end of the column? Where on the column's height should make no difference, unless there is binding at the top and not lower down. You may need to do some setting up and move the axis only with the handwheel ( stepper mechanically disconnected) so you can feel if the movement is smooth up and down - I would suggest you try achieve that first, regardless of the torque of the chosen motor..

That motor should be able to move the axis downwards with repeatable ease and if not, there must be some binding somewhere.

The Oscilloscope - I would have liked to see the width of the step pulse from the PWM generator to the stepper driver - the driver normally requires a certain minimum width and nowhere can I find what the pulse width is of that PWM generator that you have. However, if this is a problem, it normally manifests as lost pulses, which may or may not be part of the problem you experience.

A larger stepper needed , I think...

Joe

Top end of the column :0

Is this any help: Frequency: High: 5.8KHZ-127KHZ, Mid: 590HZ-15.8KHZ, Low: 82HZ-2.3KHZ

06/08/2019 14:38:16

At either 2.8a, 3.1 or 3.7 its truggles at the top end with the jibs loosened off.

So I am going to see if they will swap the motor for me.

I'll send you the bill Chris

06/08/2019 14:17:25
Posted by ChrisB on 06/08/2019 13:57:15:

If you got the NEMA23 like the one I linked, with a holding torque of 1.9NM it's more than enough to move the column on a WM18.

I have tested mine on the X axis and it moves the table effortlessly. Make sure it's wired correctly, there are a lot of settings on the stepper controller. As I mentioned in my post above. I didn't wire it myself as I'm not electrically minded but I recall it was a bit of a fiddle until we got it set properly. I'll ask my brother for a wiring diagram and controller settings.

Have a look at the below video, he's using a 3NM, Nema23 for the table powerfeed on a Raglan.

**LINK**

Edited By ChrisB on 06/08/2019 14:07:15

That was the YouTube vid I followed, however he is used the 3nm motor.

I also wonder, the X axis is a lot easier to feed that the Z, concidering the weight of the head.

Just a thought Chris

Edited By petro1head on 06/08/2019 14:18:09

06/08/2019 14:15:20
Posted by Joseph Noci 1 on 06/08/2019 13:39:43:

Bit late to enter the fray, but...I do think a NEMA34 size would have been better, or at least a motor with maybe around 3 to 4NM torque. The problem is really overcoming the stiction in the system and will be worse on the up..

If you are willing to try a few things -

Does the motor turn on its own, disconnected from the leadscrew?

If so, loosen up the Z Gibs completely and try again, just to see if things move.

If not, let me know and we take it from there.

Do you have an oscilloscope?

Can you post a wiring diagram of how you connected the bits?

Joe

I am starting to feel the 3nm motor may have been better Link

Before fitting I bench tested the motor and it was turning fine.

When I first fitted it the dip switches were set to 1 amp, when I set it to the required amperage, 2.8, it stated working on the mill.

I don't have an occiliscpoe

Wiring diagram:

stepper wiring.jpg

06/08/2019 13:17:46

Oh bugger!

The stepper motor ChrisB linked to does not seem powerfull enough and cant turn the lead screw

Edit:  The current switches were set to the lowest current.  However as the head raises it get a little tighter and the motor then struggles, currently looking into why it gets tighter

Edited By petro1head on 06/08/2019 14:00:06

04/08/2019 17:35:11
Posted by Bandersnatch on 04/08/2019 17:10:04:

It's not very clear to me whether the intention is as a z-axis feed while cutting or simply to raise/lower the head without effort.

If it's the latter, the poor-man's version is a socket fitted in an electric drill/driver with the clutch set appropriately.

Currently my thought are just to raise lower the head however once done it may well be good enough to feed while cutting.

re your second statement, will, yes i could just do that. Bit Heath Robinson but each to their own.

for me its also the enjoyment of the project

04/08/2019 13:10:42

Work has started, got the mount, connection and motor installed

z axis 2.jpg

Just waiting for delivery of the PWM and project boxes then I can start the wiring.

Next task while waiting id to fit the limit switched.

Re the wiring would it be worth covering the wire metal conduit  What size and where from? Or I could use this stuff Link

The motor only put a small amount of resistance on the handle so happy

Edited By petro1head on 04/08/2019 13:27:29

Magazine Locator

Want the latest issue of Model Engineer or Model Engineers' Workshop? Use our magazine locator links to find your nearest stockist!

Find Model Engineer & Model Engineers' Workshop

Latest Forum Posts
Support Our Partners
ChesterUK
Eccentric July 5 2018
Ausee.com.au
Advertise With Us
Warco
Meridienne Sept 2019
TRANSWAVE Converters
Eccentric Engineering
Allendale Electronics
emcomachinetools
Subscription Offer

Latest "Wanted" Ads
Get In Touch!

Do you want to contact the Model Engineer and Model Engineers' Workshop team?

You can contact us by phone, mail or email about the magazines including becoming a contributor, submitting reader's letters or making queries about articles. You can also get in touch about this website, advertising or other general issues.

Click THIS LINK for full contact details.

For subscription issues please see THIS LINK.

Digital Back Issues

Social Media online

'Like' us on Facebook
Follow us on Facebook

Follow us on Twitter
 Twitter Logo

Pin us on Pinterest