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Member postings for Ian P

Here is a list of all the postings Ian P has made in our forums. Click on a thread name to jump to the thread.

Thread: How can I use this motor economically?
05/04/2020 20:34:59

I have 'parked' the servo motors and drive for the time being and am fitting a standard motor and VFD to the linisher. There are no Hall sensors in this motor particular motor, The picture is the inside of the motor terminal box and the only wires exiting the motor itself are the three thick wires plus two white ones (probably the thermal sensor).

The manual linked to is a shorter version of the one I have but is essentially correct.

Ian P

04/04/2020 22:44:48

Thanks Robert, I'm not sure if this motor has integral Hall sensors but even if it did there is quite a lot of work (and some expense) to get it running. Even then it would be a fairly dumb system compared to what features even a cheap VFD has (accel/decel etc etc) so. Since I have three of the motors and two drives (one faulty) putting them on eBay is what I think I will do.

I thought it might be best to wait until things get nearer to normal but I've just looked at eBay help pages and surprisingly they say its mostly business as usual.

04/04/2020 20:54:16

Thanks for the info and suggestions, I know in my heart that making use of this type of motor without a suitable servo drive is not possible and its unrealistic of me to expect to find an economic way of doing it.

As mentioned the 'personality' and the configuration of the drive is stored in a eeprom so no battery involved, why this became corrupted just by unplugging and reconnecting to the mains is a mystery as its something I have done frequently. Using it to drive a linisher is almost a criminal waste of technology but the motor and drive were lying around spare when the original grotty induction motor burnt out. I have the customer version of the Windows 'BRU Master' software which allows configuring all the drive parameters but when I connect it to the drive it communicates but then reports the corrupted NV memory (as does the drives own error number).

I do have a second drive unit and motor which are currently working and fitted to a X1 size mill, I very rarely use it so could borrow the drive off that but as suggested it would probably make more sense to fit an induction motor with VFD and then sell the servo motors and drives I have (used kit seems to fetch high prices especially in the USA).

Joe's comments and recollections about the motor only running synchronously make it totally unsuitable as a machine power source, I could imagine with determination it would be possible to incorporate a feedback system and then drive with a VFD buts it not something I could tackle.

Just to mention as an item of interest. I control the motor speed and direction using the drive's analogue input (+/-10V) with a pot and toggle switch. Even at 4000rpm clicking the switch between forward/reverse is utterly drama free with the motor changing direction almost imperceptibly. If I had the expertise then using one of these as a direct drive lathe spindle motor would be ideal for ELS purposes.

Ian P

03/04/2020 21:25:34

I have been using this motor and its drive unit for several years in my linisher. Last week I unplugged it from the mains whilst I was having a tidy up and now it does not work. I have the full Electro-Craft manual for the drive and motor and the fault error number the drive shows is one that can only be repaired by board replacement followed by reconfiguring using software only given to authorised repair houses, in other words very expensive!

As I do not need any of the servo functions but if possible would like to use it as a plain (hopefully variable speed) motor. I wondered whether it could be driven by a VFD, its rating plate describes it as an 'AC Motor' although it contains magnets on the rotor so its not a conventional induction motor.

If it means anything to anyone here the motor is an 'H-4030-M-H-00AA'. Its continuously rated at 1.1KW 240V and runs up to 4000rpm. There are only 3 wires to the motor itself (plus another 20 or so to the shaft encoder)

There are companies that supply refurbished drives (mostly in the USA) but at about $2000 not the route I want to take.

Anybody know how else I could drive the this (and another two similar ones I have) motor?

Ian P

20200403_171209.jpg

Thread: New design of mains plug?
02/04/2020 12:07:12
Posted by ega on 02/04/2020 11:43:51:
Posted by Neil Wyatt on 01/04/2020 20:54:20:

Quality plugs come with a card showing how long to cut each wire, so that if the cable pulls out live comes free first and earth is disconnected last.

...

How does this requirement apply to the modern moulded on plugs?

They are neat but often have the wrong length of lead.

Two points, The relationships of the individual wire lengths are not a 'requirement', they may be a recommendation.

When you say wrong length of lead then if too long it can be shortened, if its too short buy another longer onesmiley

Ian P

Thread: Taper reamer
31/03/2020 19:40:19

I doubt its made for any specific purpose, rather its a general purpose hand reamer mostly intended to enlarge existing holes in plastics and soft-ish and thin-ish metal.

I bought one to add to my collection because the small diameter was less than 1mm, most of the ones I have start at about 3mm but this one is ideal for opening holes in PCBs. The one in the picture does not look as small as 1mm but is otherwise identical. One thing to add is that mine is razor sharp and seems accurately ground right to the tip and will actually create new holes quite easily.

Ian P

Thread: New design of mains plug?
30/03/2020 20:02:44
Posted by Neil Wyatt on 30/03/2020 19:11:47:
Posted by Ian P on 30/03/2020 15:45:38:

Its not possible to visually check separation of the transformer.

Ian P

If it's an SMPSU, which I'm sure it is, it should have side by side coils.

The key thing is how well the two sides are separated on the PCB.

Neil

I am not a designer of power supplies but have seen hundreds of different designs of SMPS in everything from phone chargers to large bench PSUs and dont recall seeing more than a couple withe primary and secondary windings on separate bobbins.

Some that 'bigclive.com' has investigated and dismantled have the primary and secondary windings on alternate layers so more or less interleaved. If manufactured properly the isolation between input and output will meet or exceed the regulations, problem may arise if some other protection fails (say it overheats and the thermal fuse fails shorted) the transformer insulation may break down and couple mains to the output.

There are others on here that have intimate knowledge of PSU design and would be able to explain better than I that the subject PSU of this thread is extremely likely to be a safety hazard.

Ian P

30/03/2020 15:45:38

Its not possible to visually check separation of the transformer.

Ian P

30/03/2020 15:40:13

If you bought that from a UK supplier then trading standards should be advised. It certainly does not look to comply with current electrical standards.

The plug is the most obvious breach of CE regulations and should be changed. My concern though is whether what is inside the enclosure is safe to use (I'm being serious). We have no idea what you intend to use it for but potentially under fault or failure conditions there is always the possibility that mains voltage could be present on the output connector.

Ian P

Thread: Coronavirus
25/03/2020 19:51:12
Posted by Mick Henshall on 25/03/2020 16:41:56:

Our doctors surgery has just closed down and locked it's doors we can only go if invited by the surgery so seems 111 or 999 is the only option

Mick 🇫🇴

Our local surgery (one of three in the practice) was under threat of closure because it got a poor rating from the CQC and it needed investment. The partners have now 'temporarily' closed it saying that it was becoming increasingly difficult to deliver all their services. Their original closure proposal claimed that two instead of three locations would be better for all patients. It was near impossible to get a doctors appointment before the current situation arose, so here too it looks like 111 or 999 is all we have.

Ian P

Thread: vfd question
22/03/2020 21:43:50
Posted by Maurice Taylor on 22/03/2020 20:36:11:

I enjoy reading all the posts on VFD,s and 3 phase motors etc. Do these produce better quality work than a single phase motor with gearbox or belt/pulleys as they seem a complicated way to rotate a chuck or cutter ?

The quality of the work is down to the quality of the machine operator but all things being equal a 3 phase motor with VFD will makes it easier.

Complication is irrelevant, looking inside a mechanical watch or clock one could say it was a complicate device compared with a digital version (tiny bit of silicon and a few other bits.

Ian P

Thread: QCTP dilema?
19/03/2020 14:41:35

Is there an easy explanation of what the different type of QCTP are defined as. Dickson and Multifix make sense to me (I can picture them in my mind) but with 'wedge' and 'piston' its not obvious where either of these two technologies are appliued in the QCTP

Is the piston the cylindrical pillar that the individual toolholders clamp or is the part that pulls the toolhoder against the Vee's of a Dickson. Wedge too is a loose term, does it refer to the 'cam' action of a Dickson?

Ian P

Thread: Tool info
13/03/2020 18:12:09

It could be a squeezersmiley

Ian

Thread: Nice Myford on ebay
13/03/2020 10:13:02

I dont know what was supplied as standard when the lathe was new but surely it would come with faceplate, Morse centres, some basic tools, oil gun etc. Granted this one has a proper toolpost and VFD but I would not call it well equipped.

As an aside, the mounting position of the VFD is a bit weird but I suppose its to avoid the cost of separating the controls into a 'pendant' type setup.

Ian P

12/03/2020 21:31:05

As a schoolboy in the 50's I read, re-read, and read again the Sparey book from the local library which I continuously renewed again and again. I knew every diagram and machining operation without ever seeing a Myford in the flesh. I hankered after one for a long time but about 25 years ago when I was actually able to buy a lathe I ended up with a Boxford.

Nowadays I have a Harrison but if I wanted something Myford size it would not be a Myford and definitely not the one in the link. It might be very presentable but its extremely poorly equipped (unless I've missed something) and adding chucks, steadies etc will bump up the cost.

I agree with Nigel, the desirability and the pricing of old motorbikes and Myford lathes etc is partly to do with retirees trying to regain their youth or whatever. The same sort of thing applies to old vehicles but the difference is that the appeal of the classic car can only increase as they become rarer (as they are part of motoring history) whereas old lathes will only eventually become museum items.

Ian P

Thread: What am i doing wrong
10/03/2020 22:33:32

My introduction to lathe tools with carbide inserts was about 15 years ago when I bought a toolholder with 10 tips at a local steam rally, I was instantly converted!

I then bought a set of five tools with inserts from a well know supplier. The tip were pure rubbish, if the purchase had been my first introduction to indexable tooling then without doubt I would have been put off for life.

Point of me mentioning this is that the tip in Steve's picture looks to be identical to the ones supplied in the set I mentioned, they have the same dull grey look and the same parallel 'gutter' around the perimeter.

Ian P

PS, I did not know much about tips when I made my steam rally purchase but I now know they were the fine grained polished type for machining aluminium and plastic. (which I now use for 90% of all my turning)

Thread: Best Cutter for HDPE.
04/03/2020 21:53:54

By coincidence I was sent a link today for some cutters that look to be ideal for your purpose.

You should be able to Google this

'ALU XP Europa Tool'

Ian P

Thread: AT1 inverter 3 wire control
27/02/2020 15:27:54

I dont know the VFD you have (a link to the manual would save people having to do their own research)

A 'standard 3 wire control' unit (two switches presumably) is only standard in respect of a non VFD motor control setup. Your VFD might need two N.O. switches.

Possibly your VFD might cater for one switch being N.C. but if not it may be that your switches have open and closed contacts so could be rewired (still should only need three wires).

You will probably need another three wires for the speed potentiometer too.

Ian P

Thread: Cable Gland
25/02/2020 14:52:21

I fully understand the workspace envelope required for woodworking and when I need to use my radial arm saw now only do so when I can wheel it outside. I'm not sure though whether your current plan is going to be as convenient to operate as you expect.

In normal parlance, 'Emergency Stop' switches are just for that purpose. Using four separate ones just to stop the machine without having an equally easy to operate 'On' switch is highly unusual (or at least I have never come across a setup like that).

Some general thoughts (on this particular) machine control.

Feeding the motor through a contactor (as you are planning) then gives the No-Volt release feature that nowadays seems to be mandatory so that good.

The contactor should have a low voltage coil so that all the control wiring (some of which we now know needs to be flexible and frequently moved) is isolated and would not cause a hazard if it got damaged, tripped over, fell iunto a bucket of water, or whatever.

Only three low voltage wires (which would not need an earth) are needed to connect to two pushbuttons that would be the On/Off controls for the motor. If the Stop button is the larger or more prominent button of the pair, then in effect it is your E-Stop. You can have as many two button pairs as you want from the same three wires if you want to control the motor from several locations.

The more switches and controls you have, especially if they are widely dispersed the less likely one would be to instinctively know which one to use in a genuine emergency.

If this machine has approximately a 'square' format like a large table, then just two E-Stop switches or control positions on diagonally opposite corners are just as reachable as your four will be.

Other options to consider could be, a keyfob type wireless control of the motor maybe on your hand or wrist whilst working, foot operated switches (that need to be kept depressed).

Ian P

24/02/2020 23:12:27

Its late and was just going to turn my PC off when I saw the lasts posts on this thread. The thought then came to me that most of the topic has been about emergency stops.

I know these are so the motor can be stopped from any side of the machine but I then wondered how the machine can be started from any side of the machine?

If these are purely 'emergency' stop buttons then how is the motor started and stopped in normal use?

The original machine has an on/off switch on the motor its itself, it looks like a simple mechanical switch so presumably you intend to leave it permanently in the ON position and control the motor from your DOL mounted on the wall. Does this mean that you might have to walk round to the other side of the machine after you have started the motor?

Sometimes (and I'm guilty of this too) its possible to get carried away on a particular route to solving a problem without really analysing what the problem is. In this case the more switches, wiring, terminals, circuitry and other components that seem to be increasingly involved, the more likely that faults and operational complications will be possible.

The keep it simple approach has a lot in its favour, why not have a length of string strung just overhead that pulls out the 13A plug (like the communication cord in a train carriage). OK thats crude and its not really a serious suggestion but the proposed system of emergency stop switches carrying mains voltage does seem a good idea either.

What one does in their own home workshop does not have to be to industrial standards (its for your own use and its not operating 24 hours a day) but where possible it should at least be based on sound practice.

Rantover

Ian P

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