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Member postings for Mick B1

Here is a list of all the postings Mick B1 has made in our forums. Click on a thread name to jump to the thread.

Thread: Interesting YouTube Video.
24/06/2022 17:05:13

Nice one!

Thank you, Chuck.


Thread: I may be stupid but
24/06/2022 10:55:05
Posted by SillyOldDuffer on 24/06/2022 09:55:53:
Posted by AdrianR on 24/06/2022 08:34:18:

If you think about the forces on the scroll, it is better to tighten all three, ideally, you would turn all of them at the same time.



Even new chucks are imperfect mechanically and the fit gets worse with wear. Although the scroll mostly rotates, it also moves slightly sideways and perhaps tilts as well. Although the unwanted movement is tiny, it's enough to stop the jaws from fully tightening. Turning the adjusters in sequence tends to release jambing due to non-rotary movement, and allows the jaws to tighten a little more. Three is enough.



Yes, all true, but - maddeningly - sellers only issue one key, usually only one or at most two key pinions are accessible from any single position, and I've never met anybody with enough arms...


Certainly if I'm trying for concentricity with the gripped diameter, I've found I get the best results (about 2 or 3 tenths TIR) by tightening all 3 pinions - but it's not common to need that, so in most cases I won't bother.

But even if I have to play about with a few attempts, clocking the concentricity as I go, it's generally still a helluva lot quicker than swapping to a 4-jaw independent chuck. I generally use those for eccentrics or components unsuitable for 3-jaw grip. Because 3-jaws seem so much better today than they were when I started turning, I find myself unwilling to disturb it without very good reason.

Thread: Warco WM 250V power feed stuck/crash
22/06/2022 15:27:48

Well, that's pretty good news, Bombardier! That diecasting is what I was calling the 'crossslide handwheel bearing housing', and pulling the 2 caphead screws was what I was suggesting to start accessing the cross leadscrew shearpin.

From the position of the crossslide in the photo, you're nowhere near the furthest extent of travel - closer to the rearward limit defined by front face of the arc with the indicator line on it. Was that where it was when it jammed?

But it still doesn't look like the cause has come to light. I take it you've retightened the capscrews and it all still works? I guess we've all had it happen from time to time that we fix things without ever really finding out what we did that sorted it - I certainly have...


22/06/2022 10:20:43

IIRC I think you have to pull the two socket cap screws securing the crossslide handwheel bearing housing - can't remember if you've to remove the handwheel itself. The shearpin connection's either inside the bearing housing or a bit further forward under the crossslide base casting. You might get at it by pulling the crossslide itself backwards to push the leadscrew towards you (?)

It's not there at all in the exploded diagram in my manual, but it certainly is in reality. Obviously the whole distribution system out to Warco isn't being fully kept up to date with engineering changes.

It's just a bit of 1/8" or ~3mm diameter brass. When replacing, some people groove it where it's supposed to break, to weaken it. I bend them a little in the hope of preventing a broken piece falling out and jamming something else, as happened to my 250V a few years back.

Ain't nuffin' like finding and fixing a critical problem to create that human/machine bonding... wink

Edited By Mick B1 on 22/06/2022 10:31:51

21/06/2022 19:44:13
Posted by Bombardier on 21/06/2022 18:34:39:

yes the power feed has disengaged but the lead screw will not move so I guess it is the shear pin right?

If the pin broke, the handwheel might spin idly but won't turn the leadscrew. If the handwheel won't turn, then something's jammed the drive pinion and moving the lever to disngage the feed isn't disengaging it for some reason.

I can't remember how it was put together, but when I took it apart, I could see how it worked it at the time.

21/06/2022 18:05:12

On my 250V the nut doesn't wind off the end of the cross leadscrew - it comes to a hard stop with the crosslide table rear face about 111mm from the rear stop (the front face of the handwheel bearing housing). If you go beyond this it'll jam hard and the cross leadscrew shearpin should break. If it does the broken bit's highly likely to fall into the apron gearbox and jam that by lying along a toothspace.

If you've not overtravelled I suppose it's possible that an apron gear has picked up some other debris.

Can you disengage the power feed, and if so, can you then run the cross leadscrew easily by hand?

Obviously, if the shearpin's gone, the crossslide won't move.

Edited By Mick B1 on 21/06/2022 18:11:56

Thread: Info' that might be of use to Warco Lathe owners.
20/06/2022 19:12:05

That 0,018mm 'lift' is about 7 tenths in old money.

Presumably you mean vertical play in the carriage?

I've had my WM250V for over 7 years now and never been aware of such a thing, nor given any thought to how I might measure it, what it might do, how I might fix it or whether it's worth doing so.

I can only imagine it might have some effect when there are upward forces communicating to the carriage, such as when turning in forward rotation from an RTP, or milling the underside of a component in a vertical slide - something I did successfully and AFAIK with decent precision only yesterday.

Now I don't know whether I should be worried about it.

Thread: What Did you do Today 2022
15/06/2022 22:04:26
Posted by Derek Lane on 15/06/2022 08:21:59:

More a case of what I did the weekend. A military show that myself and the wife attended with her knitting and my woodturning this is my other hobby and by doing things like this help give me a little extra to buy tools and the like for both the woodturning and some of my metal work.


Looks like top-class work - very nice pieces.


Thread: Warco green paint
14/06/2022 17:29:40
Posted by Howard Lewis on 14/06/2022 17:11:45:


Accepting some of the quality control issues that have been seen, the colour might even vary from batch to batch!


I'll say it does! My Warco tins of touchup green and yellow don't even match the machine they were issued with.

My guess is that they source it promiscuously from whoever's selling on lowest price and leadtime, and that machine paint and touchup pots might come from separate suppliers validated on a casual colour match.

But hey! I don't really care - they still look better than rusty exposed chips, and the machine does what it should irrespective.

I should add that the Myford-labelled paint I bought for the Speed 10 I used to have had the same issue.

I didn't care then either.

Edited By Mick B1 on 14/06/2022 17:33:26

Thread: What Did you do Today 2022
11/06/2022 17:03:36

Nuts for the S160 gauge frames. The railway want to keep a set of spares, and this is the first component. I picked it cos it's a bit of a challenge on the Warco 250V. Could only get big enough LG2 in round bar, so had the hex it down on the Bridgie clone, as posted on 20.05.22.

They're 1.67" A/F, threaded 7/8" - 14 BSP, and have a recess halfway. One side of the recess the thread's RH, the other side LH. Single point threading tool was a bit of 1/8" square HSS in a plain 3/8" boring bar, hand ground on cheap bench grinder and checked with a vernier protractor and eyeglass.

I thought it'd be too hairy to do it under power and that I'd have to crank the lathe manually, but it wasn't actually too difficult as long as I started each pass in the recess and cut away from the chuck. Did the LH end first and checked first and last-off on an existing valve body - I had a tap to finish and check the RH thread so that was a bit simpler. Still took a bit of concentration to do all the reversing and sharp stops to get the tool in the right place for each pass - can't disengage the halfnut during each process cos pitching back in would be pretty difficult.

Marked them up so the fitters'll know which end they're trying to screw on.

I think theyr'e all OK. smiley

all the nuts.jpg

Thread: pyrex is not PYREX
09/06/2022 12:22:24
Posted by SillyOldDuffer on 09/06/2022 11:12:21:

One of my favourite hobby-horses is criticising the trust folk have in Trade and Brand names, which just labels with no solid connection to who owns the company, where the product is made, what it's made of, or a specification.


Reputations go up as well as down, and the best available at the moment may be a newcomer, or a tarnished name back on the up.



I'd agree - the integrity of brands has been steadily eroded since about the '70s and very many of them now represent little or nothing more than an exercise in badge-engineering of generic products. Witness the 'Moore & Wrong' debate of a couple of years back - and conversely the respect now generally accorded to genuine Mitutoyo, when in the '70s they were regarded by many as cheapie, low-grade instruments.

I sometimes get YouGov surveys about brands of anything from actual solid products to financial and insurance services, fashion, football and gambling. It seems there's a drive from company marketing departments to support brand preference among customers for anything at all, even though most of us know most of them are now worth little or nothing as assurances of quality.

I have one example to cite on the brand at issue here. A couple of years ago we bought a new 'Pyrex' (don't remember the character cases) measuring jug, which just over a year ago shattered to fragments when dropped from about knee-height onto a vinyl floor. Previous experience would suggest it should've bounced without damage.


Edited By Mick B1 on 09/06/2022 12:25:23

Thread: Warco WM 250V power feed stuck/crash
06/06/2022 21:44:50
Posted by Bazyle on 06/06/2022 17:41:44:

The red patch on the photo implies to me that the pinion hit the bed so I suspect that something like a circlip or grubscrew holding the gear shaft in the gearbox was missing and it worked its way outwards from the gearbox.

Yes - highly plausible - or maybe an obstruction in a toothgap in the pinion deflected the pinion downward so the rotating tooth crowns scarred the bed whilst the intrusion mashed the rack teeth.

Again - why didn't the shearpin shear? Wish I'd kept mine now - I replaced it with brass but suspected the original might've been silver steel.


Edited By Mick B1 on 06/06/2022 21:47:22

06/06/2022 16:23:03

It's a fair result in that it gives Bombardier a new machine and saves investigation of any other consequential damage.

I'm pretty sure the rack is toast, and I'm not sure how much skilled machine tool fitter resource they have, to be able to send one out to replace it on site - plus of course resolve the bent pinion shaft issues, and replace the shearpin with one that'll function as it should. It'd take a posh top-o'-the-range dealer to do it that way, and that would have to push up new sale prices too.

05/06/2022 13:05:25

It's full of risk to speculate, but I think the tooth directly below the tubular location dowel in the photo has fractured and can't be recovered - trying to reform it would most likely result (IMO!!) in the top 2/3 breaking off. Several others are in a bad case too. I'd say the rack has to be replaced.

As for cause I'm wondering if a substantial piece of solid debris (which might still be there in the adjacent toothspace?) got into the meshing pinon and trapped between it and the rack.

I still think the leadscrew shearpin wants looking at, because it should've broken well before any such damage was caused. That's what it's for.

04/06/2022 11:00:07

2) I ran out of travel on the crossslide once. The cross leadscrew shearpin did its job and bruk, but the broken end fell out into the apron gearbox, where it dropped into the toothgap of a pinion and jammed it solid. The oil was sticky enough to stop it falling out if I partially turned the mechanism. I had to disconnect the main leadscrew so I could remove the apron front and fish about in the gloom until I flipped the remains of the pin into the oil left in the apron - from where there was no prospect of it ever being picked up again as long as gravity still works as it now does. Then I replaced it with a new pin - very slightly bent to reduce the risk of part of it dropping out again. Problem fixed.

But I see you've got a mangled tooth on your bed rack. It would certainly be best if the rack were replaced. In my case the main leadscrew shearpin (see issue 1) above ) was made of steel, not the usual brass. If this is the situation on yours you might make a case to Warco to replace it.

04/06/2022 10:41:45

Two similar things happened on my WM250V:

1) I engaged longitudinal feed when I meant cross feed, with a locked carriage. It bent the shaft of the bed pinion and broke one of the keyed bushes in the headstock geartrain in half. I lived for a while with very sticky patches in the carriage motion every 3 turns or so. Eventually I found I could straighten the bent pinion shaft with the toe end of a standard crowbar and had no more trouble with it.

crowbar fix 2.jpg

Thread: Nut Making
30/05/2022 18:10:19
Posted by robjon44 on 30/05/2022 17:04:27:

Mick B1, not a criticism but spiral flute propels swarf upward through finished thread whereas spiral point propels it downward out of back of thread, preferable no?



Maybe I didn't look long enough, but I saw they were getting a continuous chip and thought they wouldn't want it birdsnesting on the eject side.

Edited By Mick B1 on 30/05/2022 18:10:48

30/05/2022 18:10:18
Posted by robjon44 on 30/05/2022 17:04:27:

Mick B1, not a criticism but spiral flute propels swarf upward through finished thread whereas spiral point propels it downward out of back of thread, preferable no?



Maybe I didn't look long enough, but I saw they were getting a continuous and thought they wouldn't want it birdsnesting on the eject side.

30/05/2022 18:10:17
Posted by robjon44 on 30/05/2022 17:04:27:

Mick B1, not a criticism but spiral flute propels swarf upward through finished thread whereas spiral point propels it downward out of back of thread, preferable no?



Maybe I didn't look long enough, but I saw they were getting a continuous and thought they wouldn't want it birdsnesting on the eject side.

Thread: Touchdown, new toy has arrived. Warco WM290V
30/05/2022 09:27:09

Rob and Jason, thanks for the answers and comments.

I still think it's a bit shifty to add and advertise a feature that doesn't actually deliver a capability the buyer might reasonably expect.

What Jason recommends is what I've been doing on my 250V

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