By continuing to use this site, you agree to our use of cookies. Find out more
Forum sponsored by:
Forum sponsored by allandale

1/6" x 28tpi tap & die.

All Topics | Latest Posts

Search for:  in Thread Title in  
speelwerk12/08/2017 20:45:50
296 forum posts
1 photos

Perhaps someone knows a supplier for tap & die 1/6" x 28 tpi. I have tried to find one with no luck. Niko.

JasonB12/08/2017 20:51:49
avatar
Moderator
11686 forum posts
1040 photos

Do you mean 1/4" x 28 as that would be UNF?

speelwerk12/08/2017 20:56:23
296 forum posts
1 photos
Posted by JasonB on 12/08/2017 20:51:49:

Do you mean 1/4" x 28 as that would be UNF?

No, I am looking for 1/6" x 28, if it exists.

JasonB12/08/2017 21:01:12
avatar
Moderator
11686 forum posts
1040 photos

I don't know of anything around that dia 0.167" with such a coarse pitch

An 8-30 gauge american screw is close on diameter at 0.164" but even the rare UNS special pitch is only 30tpi

I can;t think of any standard that uses 1/6"

 

What is it for? Could it be a pipe thread where the 1/6" refers to teh bore as 28tpi may be about right for that and also right for 1/16" if there is a typo

 

Edited By JasonB on 12/08/2017 21:04:53

speelwerk12/08/2017 21:16:03
296 forum posts
1 photos

It must be some kind of Swiss size from 1870. It is used much in musical boxes from that period. Many times the thread on the screw is gone and I have to thread cut new ones which takes too much time or use an oversize which is not ideal. Niko.

Michael Gilligan12/08/2017 22:19:08
avatar
10328 forum posts
446 photos

Niko,

This table includes the Thury threads:

http://pages.cs.wisc.edu/~bolo/workshop/thread.html

... but still nothing to match your spec.

It looks very much like a special.

MichaelG.

.

P.S. ... is it a full form thread ?

Just wondering if it could be a truncated form of the Thury #1

speelwerk12/08/2017 22:34:47
296 forum posts
1 photos

Thanks for the help, however it is a full form thread. Niko.

not done it yet12/08/2017 23:23:49
1264 forum posts
9 photos

Swiss? 1870? I would not have thought they were using Imperial measurements a great deal - although sock machines and other similar inventions did tend to comply to the UK/US sizes. Or maybe the movements were Swiss and the container made somewhere else?

Clive Foster12/08/2017 23:36:11
1156 forum posts
19 photos

1870 pre-dates compulsory metrication, metric was optional from 1868 and compulsory from1877, so the thread could well have been specified in the old Swiss system. Almost certainly an in-house or local thread used by a single manufacturer or group of firms from the same area.

The old Swiss base unit for smaller measures was the pied (fuss) re-defined as 0.30 metres for the transition to metric but subject to local variations. Next down is the pouce at 1/12 th of a pied followed by the linie at 1/144 th of a pied or 1/12 th of a pouce.

Pied and pouce are essentially same as Imperial foot and inch so 1/6 inch diameter is likely to have been 2 linie in the old system. Which is sensible.

The 28 tip pitch doesn't appear to be related to the Thury system, which wasn't defined until 1877 or thereabouts. Thury devised the system as a standardisation of "useful" mathematically related threads close to those commonly used in the watchmaking industry. 28 tip is close to the pitch of a no 1 but the diameter is nearly mid-way between 2 and 3. Sounds too much of an outlier for one of the close to threads previously used.

Clive.

Hopper13/08/2017 03:52:49
avatar
2098 forum posts
26 photos

I wonder if Tracy Tools or The Tap and Die Company that advertise in the back of MEW would make special orders such as these?

SillyOldDuffer13/08/2017 08:57:55
2259 forum posts
486 photos

You could make a tap and die to suit from silver steel. The picture shows a home made tap.

dsc04404.jpg

To make it I turned a length of silver steel (aka drill rod) down to the required diameter and lathe cut a thread in the usual way. Then I milled the relieving slots and squared the driving end. After the usual heat treatment the tap works surprisingly well considering how crude it is.

Once you've got a hardened tap it wouldn't be difficult to make a silver steel die with it.

Obviously home-made won't last as well as the real thing but they do work. If you mend lots of music boxes it would be worth making a batch.

Dave

Phil P13/08/2017 09:46:36
393 forum posts
111 photos

Niko

Are those the screws that hold the comb onto the bedplate that you are trying to replace ?

I too have had trouble finding an exact match and have resorted to making slightly larger ones. I have looked for these sizes for around twenty years with no luck.

I wondered if you make your own gears for the governors as well ? I have also been looking for 0.32 & 0.38 Module gear cutters with no luck either.

Phil

P.S. If you run short of musical boxes to restore, I know where there are plenty of them !! (In my loft)

speelwerk13/08/2017 11:25:05
296 forum posts
1 photos

Yes Phil, those are the comb screws, you would like to keep it as original as possible but they can have had a hard live giving you no other option then to make slightly larger sized ones. The 0.32 & 0.38 mm module is another of those problems, you can try this one **LINK** . I use a 19th century rounding-up machine and cutters to make it mesh the other gear in the governor. It goes a little over 0.40 mm modern module but the Swiss must also have had rounding-up machines for large size wheels, but sofar never found one. I think your loft will look similar to mine. Niko.

Edited By speelwerk on 13/08/2017 11:26:01

Edited By speelwerk on 13/08/2017 11:27:22

Ian S C13/08/2017 12:58:02
avatar
6491 forum posts
216 photos

I/16" x 28 TPI would be neared to the pitch of a wood screw.
Wood screw sizes. #0 !/16 x 32 TPI.   #1  5/64"  x  28 TPI.   #2  3/32"  x  26 TPI.

Ian S C

Edited By Ian S C on 13/08/2017 13:06:53

Brian Sweeting13/08/2017 14:11:57
136 forum posts

Have you tried Wiseman Threading Tools, **LINK**

They offer a "specials" service.

bricky13/08/2017 16:10:04
229 forum posts
30 photos

The tap was possibly made in their workshop and then a screw plate made from it and not to difficult to harden if gauge plate or an old file annealed drilled and tapped and rehardened.

Frank

mick13/08/2017 16:54:17
340 forum posts
20 photos

Why not a 1.5M same meat, different gravy, but easier to source..

Michael Gilligan13/08/2017 19:59:01
avatar
10328 forum posts
446 photos
Posted by mick on 13/08/2017 16:54:17:

Why not a 1.5M same meat, different gravy, but easier to source..

.

I think because the required diameter is 1/6" ... which is about 4.23mm

MichaelG.

mick14/08/2017 17:32:51
340 forum posts
20 photos

Hi. Michael. 1.5mm divided by 25.4 = 0.059'' If you want to argue over 0.003'' on a screw thread be my guest, but for practical engineers its a practical answer.

Michael Gilligan14/08/2017 18:32:07
avatar
10328 forum posts
446 photos
Posted by mick on 14/08/2017 17:32:51:

Hi. Michael. 1.5mm divided by 25.4 = 0.059'' If you want to argue over 0.003'' on a screw thread be my guest, but for practical engineers its a practical answer.

.

Mick,

I don't want to argue with anyone about anything.

... but I simply don't understand your suggestion.

The screws on Niko's box are one sixth of an inch diameter.

MichaelG.

All Topics | Latest Posts

Please login to post a reply.

Magazine Locator

Want the latest issue of Model Engineer or Model Engineers' Workshop? Use our magazine locator links to find your nearest stockist!

Find Model Engineer & Model Engineers' Workshop

Email News - Join our newsletter

Love Model Engineering? Sign up to our emails for the latest news and special offers!

Latest Forum Posts
Support Our Partners
Merdienne London Show 2018
Ausee.com.au
Expo Tools July 14
Sarik
Shapiro
ChesterUK
Reeves 2000
emcomachinetools
Allendale Electronics
Warco
TRANSWAVE Converters
Eccentric Engineering
SPG Tools October Seventeen
Subscription Offer

Latest "For Sale" Ads
Latest "Wanted" Ads
Get In Touch!

Do you want to contact the Model Engineer and Model Engineers' Workshop team?

You can contact us by phone, mail or email about the magazines including becoming a contributor, submitting reader's letters or making queries about articles. You can also get in touch about this website, advertising or other general issues.

Click THIS LINK for full contact details.

For subscription issues please see THIS LINK.

Digital Back Issues

Social Media online

'Like' us on Facebook
Follow us on Facebook

Follow us on Twitter
 Twitter Logo

Pin us on Pinterest

Visit the Model Engineer
Exhibition website

Model Engineer Exhibition